POST 5X5...what next

[Guinness5.0]

Dude, you need to check your head.

You have made ridiculous gains from this and you want to CHANGE what you're doing? You lost 30 pounds of fat and increased strength by an insane amount and you think you gonna do better? Seriously bro, WTF are you thinking?! If gleenn's post and your own experience don't change your mind, I think you're pretty far gone - I'm not trying to insult you at all - I'm saying a rational person could not view your progress as anything but phenomenal and your first instinct is to CHANGE FOR THE SAKE OF CHANGE?!?! It's crazy!

And gear? You're just figuring out how to train properly and you want to throw another variable in? Not wise. Not wise at all. There's so much more for you to learn about how things work naturally.

 

[Protobuilder]

Awesome thread!!

Question -- how can you do the same exercise (e.g., squat on the 5x5) 3 times a week for several weeks (and if you're doing a single-factor approach, many MANY weeks) without experiencing burnout or "reactive inhibition" or whatever? I remember reading that 3-6 weeks is enough for any exercise before it's time to change to a new exercise . . .

 

[swordfish151]

Dude, you need to check your head.

You have made ridiculous gains from this and you want to CHANGE what you're doing? You lost 30 pounds of fat and increased strength by an insane amount and you think you gonna do better? Seriously bro, WTF are you thinking?! If gleenn's post and your own experience don't change your mind, I think you're pretty far gone - I'm not trying to insult you at all - I'm saying a rational person could not view your progress as anything but phenomenal and your first instinct is to CHANGE FOR THE SAKE OF CHANGE?!?! It's crazy!

And gear? You're just figuring out how to train properly and you want to throw another variable in? Not wise. Not wise at all. There's so much more for you to learn about how things work naturally.

Did you just...i think you just insulted me...lol.....im kidding bro....i hear what your saying..TOTALLY hear what your saying...i just noticed that too..when i looked at where i started and where im ending!! I was amazed...BUT the thought also occured to me that i must have been doing something wrong to have such huge gains...i did and am doing cardio 5X a week in the AM 45min strong...and weight is coming off and getting STRONGER...i thought i was going to get weaker by doing the cardio but it hasnt hindered my goal to get leaner...and all with a calorie restictive diet (carb cycling) under 2100 cals!! There has to be some explination to what im doing and why its working...or was i really that completley clueless before..i did notice that in the original 5X5 thread (cardio) was ok to do while on the program but that is all that was discussed so i took it upon myself to just add it in and see how it worked...im glad i did..as far the gear goes...i might just hold off on the cycle..i have done cycles in the past...but i was wondering in general about the consensus or feeling about the 5X5 and gear.

 

[Madcow2]

Swordfish, if you've read the description I explicitly say you can include some arm work - I think most people do anyway (there's actually a whole list of reasonable subs like push press for military, front squats for light squatting day, etc...). The reason why there were warnings not to screw with it is because lots of people kept coming up with interesting "tweaks" that made it into a 3 day split, bodypart 1x per week, and machine and isolation weighted workouts (i.e. they didn't know what they were doing). Maybe recheck the link for the description here on the updated TOC. http://www.geocities.com/elitemadcow1/table_of_contents_thread.htm. There is also an article for those who choose to use anabolics in section I - not that I condone it or feel it is necessary for what most people want to achieve but this is largely a BBing board and this is traditionally how BBers have gotten results from garbage programs so the populations are bound to overlap.

Anyway, there are a lot of topics linked there. Maybe spend some time reading. Tons of stuff on training theory, other programs, etc...

 

[Madcow2]

I was amazed...BUT the thought also occured to me that i must have been doing something wrong to have such huge gains...

Also, I am really impressed with your progress especially in light of fairly heavy cardio, serious caloric restriction, and major weight loss. Stunning.

That said, if you pulled this off naturally with simply good training - I really have a hard time understanding the desire to screw with it (given that it's okay to change it around some) and more to the crux your desire to use anabolics. Seriously, most of the people drugged up on the anabolic board can't get cutting results like you just did and would kill for it. If that isn't good enough - what is? I just can't figure out where the desire is coming from since you are finally getting exposure to real training (i.e. that actually works) and you are flying along at 100mph already. And I'm not just poking fun or trying to get you not to use them, I just have trouble understanding where the draw is.

 

[swordfish151]

i guess an edge...i mean no joke..i stepped on the scale at 225lbs...this morning i woke up went to the gym, stepped on the scale and it read 195lbs! this is in week 8 of the 5X5...i was also suprised due to the fact that i started doing am cardio on an empty tank for 5 days a week...also being on a low cal diet i sure thought i was going to not be able to push the weights up like i have...but in week 7 i was strong..i mean i was strong..in week 8 now and im just happy...starting to feel that wall really close you know...like..oh shit..here it comes..im feeling like im not going to be able to push through..but overall have loved this program...my back (from deads/rows) looks 100X better then before...i will post pics when im done with week 9 (before and after) i asked what was i doing wrong before that i gained so much now..meaning in strength....and it just dawned on me...before it was like clockwork..just went in.. and lifted...like an animal..but with no set structure...when i look at my 5x5 i wrote down the WHOLE program from day one from week 1 - week 9...now i know that i could have not possibly known where i was going to be in week 5 and so forth..but seeing it on paper and taking that paper to the gym with me..knowing that "oh ok..i have to incriment the weights today" made a HUGE difference for me...the 5X5 PUSHED me to increase my stength by letting me know it was time to move or push forward...alot of people including myself would be the type that if say 185 dead was taxing i probably would stick there for a while till i felt it was time..on the 5X5 for me it was like OK BUMP WEIGHT LETS GO...and you did it....i think the fact that i wrote it down pushed me alot harder and maybe thats why i got such huge strength gains..because i pushed....

 

[Madcow2]

That's a huge part of it. For a non-novice it's just not enough to go in, work hard, and hope to get progress over time. You have to approach training systematically. I think a lot of guys who have great work ethic and have been busting their ass for years are surprised to see what proper training and "working smart" can do (probably because of the abysmal success they've had with all the Flex flavor of the month programs over the years). If working hard moves you 5 steps and 3 of them are sideways due to poor training you are not better off than the slacker who moves 2 steps but all of them forward using a good program. Plus, the whole 'diet is 90%' thing really goes out the window when the only thing people change is the training and it makes such a massive difference.

 

[swordfish151]

I agree....the thing im pondering now is ...i got that strong on a low cal diet...i can only imagine when i start a clean bulk with cals over 3000! now that...i cant wait to see...i read the gear and 5X5 portion of the thread...i can see how it might not be a good idea due to the fact that whatever compound you decide to take and in what dosages that your strength becomes unreal...throwing your typical 10lbs incremint to a 20 or 30 lbs increment..but would that be so much of a bad thing...? i think at that point you just adjust and move foreward..no?

 

[Madcow2]

More than a few have been burned by strength increases that were too much and too fast. Tendons and connective tissue aren't part of the steroid cycle equation for many people. These lag behind, often with symptoms masked to a degree by fluid retention and all of a sudden people come off, have chronic pain, and suffer through not being able to perform a lift or lifts for a long period. You'll see this on the anabolic board every now and then.

 

[ceo]

I am bumping this thread because I think it is timely. There are some great posts in here by some greats like Glen Pendlay, and madcow (the 5x5 version most of you are probably using).

Some posts are long, but please takt the time to read through them. You want to know what to do after the 5x5? You say, "the 5x5 made me grow like no other, and I'm still gaining, but I want to change."? Maybe you don't need to change the entire program...just tweak it.