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PLEASE help me design a 16 week pre contest stack

B-legit

New member
I've done a search and could'nt really find anything about good 16 week precontest stacks. My contest is on Nov. 3rd so i would probably need to start the Long test (sos, or omna) on July 1st. I would like to use anything necessary except hgh.

My stats are
20yrs
195 lbs.
12 % b.f. (Just tested today)
Have done
sos (light)
sos/laurabolin(light)
Deca/dbol (moderate dosage)

I want to go all out and win this show so Please, any help would greatly be appreciated thanks in advance.
B-Legit
 
well my first question is how tall are you?.....just curious.

well i would do this:
week 1-10 test enanthate 500-750mg/wk
week 1-5(6) dbol 30-40mg/day
week 6-15 eq 400-500mg/wk
week 13-16 halo 20-25mg/day
week 10-15 winny 50mg/day
week 15-16 arimidex 1mg/day
week 15-16 nolvadex 20mg/day

this is just a starting out point...lets see what you think.
 
jc21 said:
well my first question is how tall are you?.....just curious.

well i would do this:
week 1-10 test enanthate 500-750mg/wk
week 1-5(6) dbol 30-40mg/day
week 6-15 eq 400-500mg/wk
week 13-16 halo 20-25mg/day
week 10-15 winny 50mg/day
week 15-16 arimidex 1mg/day
week 15-16 nolvadex 20mg/day

this is just a starting out point...lets see what you think.

Nice! Now tell him what you would really do. Hehehe.
 
im 5'11"
That looks good. What about deca. Is that not very good precontest??? How about sos instead of enanthate??? Which would be the better test of choice???
 
i think enanthate would be the test of choice for bulking before a show. if you wanted to throw in some deca i would put it in at week 1-10 @400-500mg/wk. he by the way what kind of show is this? have you ever done a show before? have you ever been to a show before? cause you are kind of tall for the weight class you are gonna be in.
 
j.c. this will be my first show. This is the NPC Mr. Sacramento. Not a real big show, but some of my friends, one guy who is doing the open heavyweight in the Mr. Cal nudged me this way, and now im stoked about it. I know the height thing sucks but hopefully with hard work I can come in large and shredded. This is why I know that my stack will be critical in my success.
By the way, thanks for taking the time to throw that at me...and if thats you in the pic...holy shit you ARE THE MAN! (and this is why i will def. take your advice). Thanks again Bro!
 
sorry, novice middle or heavyweight. The heavyweight last year was shit so i might try to hang with the big boys.
 
Jc21

Is right on the money but I would think about armidex the whole cycle and nolvadex when necessary if at all.

Everyone has their favorite, I prefer test enanthate to any other ester.
 
so you think at my current weight that i shouldn't go up to a gram of test??? 500-750 is cool if that would be enough.
 
If you're 12% bodyfat it's gonna take you 16 weeks just to get shredded, let alone attempt to gain some LBM along the way. Those mega-cycles listed above are nuts if you ask me. Unless you are eating in a hypercaloric state then you are wasting a lot of those drugs. And if you are eating in a hypercaloric state then you aren't going to burn sufficient fat to get shredded. If you want to do the show right you should have been bulking this whole time until now, there is no sense trying to pack on mass during your pre-contest cycle.

My suggestion is just to do enough drugs to maintain the LBM you have and diet like a mad dog to get shredded. 16 weeks sounds like a long time but most pros diet this long to get to their contest condition and they know exactly how their bodies work and what it takes to achieve that look. If this is your first show then this is all new to you then you better use these next 16 weeks to your advantage. If you aren't big enough to compete yet then I'd immediately stop any plans of going to this show and focus on getting big.
 
i think he can drop the amount of fat in 12 weeks...remeber he is 20 years old..metabolism like crazy. when i did a show at that old i didnt even do cardio. he isnt pro he is just a kid doing a novice show to have fun...it is good experience.
the cycle is probably too much...but it is just a starting out point...he could take things out or add some depending on him...i think most of that is neseccary for a show.
and i am a true believer that you can gain muscle going into a show even on a low carb diet. i mean nothing drastic...maybe a couple pounds. he stilll has a about 12 weeks till he has to start dieting.
 
I'm not competetive, but, I think in place of the Halo wk 13-16, maybe take Fina w/ the winny wk. 10-15, I know fina makes me hard as nails.
 
imo halo will harden you up better than anavar or fina. and anavar and halo can be taken all the way up to show time and after. you could definaltly substitue anavar for the halo though and be alright.
 
jc21 said:
i think he can drop the amount of fat in 12 weeks...remeber he is 20 years old..metabolism like crazy. when i did a show at that old i didnt even do cardio. he isnt pro he is just a kid doing a novice show to have fun...it is good experience.
the cycle is probably too much...but it is just a starting out point...he could take things out or add some depending on him...i think most of that is neseccary for a show.
and i am a true believer that you can gain muscle going into a show even on a low carb diet. i mean nothing drastic...maybe a couple pounds. he stilll has a about 12 weeks till he has to start dieting.


"he isnt pro he is just a kid doing a novice show to have fun"

Then why do you suggest such a brutal stack??? :confused:

It's not that great actually, the high levels of androgen will thicken your skin and won't gave you that paper thin look no matter how low you get in BF%. Arimidex should be run for the full course.

The use of orals is very excessive.

This is very irresponsible and dangerous advice, and B-legit I would urge you to reconsider.
 
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BigAndy69 said:




Then why do you suggest such a brutal stack??? :confused:

The use of orals is very excessive.

This is very irresponsible and dangerous advice, and B-legit I would urge you to reconsider.


Overlooked the arimidex part which I agree with it should be taken the whole way through BUT..... How do u figure this is a BRUTAL stack?? Dangerous advice?? Really you think? :rolleyes:
 
You don't think that running winny and halo together is dumb and unhealthy?

Sure he won't drop dead (quickly), but if he keeps doing that, he just might. Nothing like pissing in a bag.
 
BigAndy.

well i dont consider this to be a brutal stack, like i said earlier i believe most of the stuff is needed when you compete. and yes winny is a most along with either halo or anavar. i didnt say that is what the kid should do, i said that is what i would do, i believe it is a good stack. now it isnt really what i would do, mine is much more complex. if you want to compete at high levels you have to take risks. i left the arimidex out because i dont need it when I cycle...i dont have a problem with aromitiztion, now i do recommend it for other people...but using it 2 weeks out is a must. i dont consider the use of androgens to be excessive at all...all androgens are cut out 6 weeks out...except for halo..which WILL not thicken the skin.

i am not trying to tell b-legit to take this....but i believe it is a good stack for a show. my friend just used almost this exact stack( it was his second) and tore up the show.

my question to you andy is have you ever competed?
 
No JC1, I've never competed but I've been through pre contest like dieting. I've help 3 people compete in real life(not the board), 2 men and 1 woman. My expertise are more related to dieting than anything else as I beleive that gear use is only secondary. A friend of mine won his weight class and the overall; using a zambon amp ED for 6 weeks along with arimidex at half a mg a day and clenbuterol. That was it.

I respect your opinion if you feel that all these drugs are necessary and in some cases they are. What really bother me was that B-Legit looked like he was going to do that stack and was going to follow it blindly instead of learning the logic behing the cycle you presented.
 
well good to see you do have knowledge about what it takes to compete...you are right some people can go in on virtually nothing an win. and you are right that it wasn't the brightest idea to follow a cycle blindly that some guy uses off the net. i was just meant to be a starting out point. i figured depending on his experince that we would take something things out of put somethings in.

i respect your opinion as well and i am glad that we could discuss this in a civil manner without flames flying everywhere.
 
Remember that this kid is only 20 years old so advising that kind of cycle to someone of that age is already pushing it. He also has some sort of previous AS usage which means he probably started at 19 and maybe younger which we all know is bad news. I stopped growing vertically by 10th grade but I didn't completely fill out until I was at least 21. I put on a lot of muscle mass naturally a few years after high school and I didn't even work out. Had I started AS I might have missed out on that natural growth period.

At any rate I still think it's too many drugs for a cutting stack. He would probably do well on 250-300mg of Test weekly along with a high dose of Ox and a low dose of T3. He could stop the Test after 10 weeks and let it taper off naturally while he continued the Ox throughout the show. Chances are he'd probably gain a little LBM from the Ox while significantly dropping his bodyfat IF his diet is in check. Ox is one of the best anti-catabolic drugs out there. Combined with a very strict low calorie diet he should be able to drop considerable fat while keeping most of his mass.

Remember, he wants to win this show and if he's 12% bodyfat now then he needs to concentrate on cutting and nothing else. Who cares if he adds 10 pounds of LBM before the show, if he doesn't come in shredded it won't matter. He'll look bigger with 10 pounds less LBM if he is at 5% bodyfat than if he was 10 pounds heavier at 8%.

My bottom line is KISS. As jc21 said "he isnt pro he is just a kid doing a novice show to have fun" so I see no need to go balls out on a cycle like you suggested. I know there are pros out there that probably take less drugs while dieting than you advised.
 
geez...im not a pussy. I need to get some size the first 8 weeks and then the second 8 weeks concentrate on eliminating fat, and hardening up. Am i correct on this idea??? Isn't that the idea of starting off with test and dbol?
 
B-legit said:
geez...im not a pussy. I need to get some size the first 8 weeks and then the second 8 weeks concentrate on eliminating fat, and hardening up. Am i correct on this idea??? Isn't that the idea of starting off with test and dbol?

I know your not a pussy.......ehh........I guess not. I agree with what you are saying, bulk the first 8 weeks and harden up the other 8. I don't see anything wrong with that?
 
I don't know where the pussy thing came from unless you feel that we don't think you can handle the cycle. It has nothing to do with that, all of my replies were mostly to the effect that you're getting bad advice.

First and foremost I think you're setting yourself up for failure. The average pro bodybuilder never goes above 12% bodyfat in the off season yet they routinely take 16 weeks to diet down to contest shape. You on the other hand want to bulk for 8 weeks then diet for 8. If you want to put on muscle for 8 weeks then you are gonna have to eat and when you do that you're gonna put on some fat. Even if it's minimal it's still more than you have now. Even IF you managed to not put on any more fat, you still only would have 8 weeks to diet down to contest shape which I'm guessing is in the neighborhood of 5%. I no of no individual who can go from 12% to 5% bodyfat in 8 weeks without burning off all of the mass they worked so hard to gain. This is just plain and simple fact it has nothing to do if you're "tough enough" to handle it.

I'm just trying to clue you into reality instead of blowing sunshine up your ass as others have done. You cannot realistically do what you're wanting to do and hope to come into the contest with expectations of winning. If you don't think you're big enough to win 16 weeks out then you shouldn't enter because you will only get smaller while dieting. Bulking for 6 weeks before hand isn't the answer because if you con't come in shredded you will place horribly. Even if you managed to hit the 8% mark you will look smooth compared to the others around you that I guarantee will be shredded to the bone. Perhaps this needs to happen so you will then realize the true dedication it will take to reach contest shape. As it seems now you think it's not hard to do and that you'll just shed that extra 7% bodyfat in a mere 8 weeks. Unless you're a genetic anomaly I don't see this happening. Not to mention the fact that if you were a genetic anomaly you'd never have gotten up to 12% as it is.

My suggestion is to come in to the contest with the muscle mass you have now, just be as hard and dry as you can be to make yourself appear even bigger. Anyone who tells you that you can gain muscle for 8 weeks then shed fat for the last 8 and expect to be down in contest shape is full of shit plain and simple.

My last little advice to you is it's the diet and workout that do 90% of the work, any amount of drugs won't make up for this fact. That is why the mega-cycle advised to you isn't the answer to your prayers, being prepared is.
 
hey vegeta quit writing so much!!! i cant read that much:p

anyway...just because the first 10 weeks of the cycle is a "bulking cycle" doesnt mean you can't diet during it. people put too much emphasis on whether it is a bulking cycle or not...who cares i can cut up on any drug out there..it is all in the diet. and bodyfat % is a bunch of crap too..there is no real way to test it anyway. you are correct that 8 weeks isnt enough to cut down properly, but 12 is.

i dont know any pro's but i do now a few high level amatuers that would laugh their asses off at that stack if i told them to do it. where do you get that pro's dont do a lot of gear..come on. as for most pro's being under 12% year round. yeah right. i have saw chris cormier, kevin levrone, ronnie coleman, at about 12% or above in person. and i have seen pics of lee priest and shawn ray above that too. sorry bro but you are living in a fantasy world if you think bodybuilding is about being ripped year round.

ok kid i will give you the truth from what i see you have no chance of winning the whole show. at 5'11 and being a middle weight there should be no way you should win your class, but you could do alright at novice. but you know what it will be good experience, i have done shows and not won, it is still fun.
 
ok kid i will give you the truth from what i see you have no chance of winning the wh

j.c., i really appreciate your knowledge and character on helping me out for this. I totally agree with you that I will eat WAY clean when im hitting those high androgens, and i know that there will be some size to come from that!
Sorry to say that if i go into the show i will go into the show with every intention of winning the class i enter. Who would want to enter with the mentality of losing??? I sure wouldn't (how could you put 100% effort into it then??? I really think that with the cycle you provided (give or take)there will be some major upsets when i step onstage. NO MATTER WHAT!

Did you see what i wrote about running the fina along with the winny the last 6 weeks or so?
 
I think you misinterpreted a few of my comments. I wasn't implying that bodybuilders stay ripped all year long, in fact I'd consider 12% for a bodybuilder to be fat. My point was they start their diets at 12% or most likely higher and it still takes them 12-16 weeks to hit their target. Also of course they take huge amounts of drugs, they are pros are get paid to do it which is another one of my points. It takes them that long to get ripped even while doing crazy cycles, huge amounts of HGH and other drugs. This guy is wanting to do it in shorter time than the pros do and I honestly doubt if he knows his body the way the pros do, they have had years of practice.

You are right that there doesn't have to be such a hard line between cutting and bulking. I am one to know, I've dieted with both Fina and Oxandrolone and put muscle on both times. However the fact is if you are planning on putting some muscle on while dieting then you aren't losing fat as fast as possible. I lost fat while gaining muscle but I know if I had strictly concentrated on the fat loss I'd have lost it even faster, just without the extra LBM gains.

If you want to get ripped in the shortest amount of time possible then you have to go into the diet with that goal in mind. I highly doubt pros attempt to put on any size during their pre-contest diet they're just trying their damndest to keep what they have. A pre-contest cycle is a time to shed the rest of your bodyfat and keep what muscle you have, not a time to attempt to put on more muscle while trying to shed some fat.

B-legit I wish you the best of luck in your show, I just don't see how you can expect to be in contest shape in 16 weeks going about it the way you plan. I don't see how you gain enough extra muscle at the same time you're attempting to drop 7-8% bodyfat. I just think you're expecting more than what is possible. You said yourself you're not big enough to win, so how much more muscle do you think it will take? 10, 15, 20 pounds? It'd take at least 10 to notice that much of a difference and that kind of LBM in short order isn't so easy to accomplish, especially when trying to cut the fat.

I'm not here to tear anyone down, I am trying to be a realist in the matter. My point is if the pros(who have been doing this for years, work with the best strength coaches and nutrition experts, have access to more drugs than we can dream of and don't have to work regular jobs so they can devote every waking hour to their contest) can't even achieve what you want don't you think it's a bit arrogant to think you can do it so easily? Either your a genetic freak and a genious or need to wake up and realize it's not as easy as you make it out to be.
 
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My answer is going to be short but not sweet.

Id say wait on the show. Not to be a prick but at your height you should be like 195 contest weight.
You will be alot smaller than the other guys in your weight class and a little taller. It would be a waste of all that hard work.
I am speaking from personal experience.
I am 6'3" 262lbs @ 10%bf. If I were to try and prep without adding LBM i would be 245 @ 4%bf. Might sound big..but I am a good few inches taller than everyone else on stage.
I am not going to compete untill I am 305@12%bf. Then prep to 280@4%bf.
Dieting isnt easy and I dont like to waste my time if I dont know that I can win!
 
look guys,
i have been training for about 4 years non-stop and would like to try out a local competition for FUN! What i do know is that i react pretty well gear, and know that the contest will be a good learning experience for me. I was thinking that at 200lbs., 12% bf i could hit the androgens pretty good for the first 8-10 weeks and get to 215-220 AND AT LEAST KEEP MY BODYFAT THE SAME OR MAYBE DROP 1-2%. So are you guys telling me that i would NOT be able to drop4-5% b.f. in the remaining 6-8 weeks??? Even if I came in at around 5-6% i would be very happy, and would feel confident about doing decently. Remember that the show is for fun and experience. I think this plan is feasable???
 
B-Legit, I'm not saying your plan isn't good, I just think you need more time. I don't see how you can conceivably drop from 12% to 4-5% bodyfat in 6-8 week regardless what you do. If you managed to drop that much fat it would take a lot of muscle with it due to the short time.

You can go from 18% to 12% in 8 weeks but we all know it gets slower as you get lower so I just don't think you could make it. Personally my body starts putting up a fight at 12% and I have to crack down. However I have no clue what your metabolism is like, how low of a bodyfat % you've reached before, etc.. If you think you can make it then by all means give it a shot, but losing that much bodyfat that quickly will mean muscle loss no matter how you do it. I'd hate to see you lose all the muscle you worked so hard on putting on the first 8 weeks.
 
i believe in the cycle i put, that fina can be exchanged for winny. i will use both in my pre contest prep.
 
B-legit said:
sorry, novice middle or heavyweight. The heavyweight last year was shit so i might try to hang with the big boys.

Sorry bro but I don't think you're going to "hang with the big boys". Not if your 195 right now. I didn't go last year but I believe Carl from the Rocklin Max Muscle competed in the Sac show and that dewd is YOLKED!! :eek2: He's competing at the Mr. USA this year.

This isn't a flame bro I wish you the best. You've got balls! ;)Cause as of right now I'm the same height and bf% as you but I'm sittin at 210 and I wouldn't consider competing. I don't really consider the Sac show that small. The Folsom show is much smaller, although you're supposed to be natural. :rolleyes: yeah right

Anyway, good luck bro. Do you get tested at Incentive Fitness? They do the hydrostatic (underwater) testing.
 
I would take a good 30 weeks to juice up for a contest, but here is my 16 week stack

Week 16 - 10
> Enathate 1000mg a week
> 2-3 Anadrol 50 a day

Week 10 - 6
> Enathate 1000mg a week
> Deca 300mg's a week
> Winny V 50mg every second day

Week 6 - 3
> Propionate 1000mg a week
> Winny V 50mg's every second day
> 1 x 20mg Nolvadex a day

Week 3 - 1
> Winny V 50mg's every day
> Halo 20mg a day
> 1 x 20mg Nolvadex a day
> 1 x Arimidex a day

Week 1 - to comp
> Halo 25mg a day
> 1 x 20mg Nolvadex a day
> 1 x Arimidex a day

That's what i would do

Good Luck

Gapster
 
B-legit said:
mv maxx,
where do you lift at.
have you competed locally.
where are you at???

I live in Rocklin and work out at CA Family Fitness. A friend of mine is competing in the Mr. Chico contest on May 4th and is coming down today for a workout. He hasn't seen me in about 5 months. ..this should be fun. ;)

PM me bro and we could hit up a workout on the weekend.
 
lol - just click on the PM under my post. It will then open up a page where you can send a message.

Click on the
 
B-legit said:
thats tight...i lift at the orangevale cal fit... i heard rocklin is the shit!!!
How do i pm you???

The Rocklin gym is pretty nice. It's huge and there's usually lots of MILF!! :licker: (MILF = Mom's I'd Like to Fuck) - for those not in the know. ;)

But they only have 100lb db's which kills me. :redhot: And they have 5 flat benches and no decline bench. Also, no real power rack for squats. Family oriented gyms kinda piss me off. They were playing N'Sync every morning until they got tired of me telling them to change it everday and how not one person in the "weight lifting part of the gym" appreciated crappy music like that. Other than that it's pretty kewl. Can't wait for the eye candy this summer. mmmmmm BOOBS!! :p
 
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