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lol you got me on that one bro...lets not forget i was injured at war though.brewers said:
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needtogetaas
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do you really want to make a stand and say you are for proviron during pct bro...brewers said:
tampatraps
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brewers said:
So your trying to call him out.... I would ask why would someone use proviron in pct when there are much better products yes it may help with increase LH levels and dosent effect other hormone levels...you tell us what you think and I am sure we can tell you why you are right or wrong.
Tampatraps
tampatraps
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tampatraps said:
sorry needto it's your battle didn't mean to step on your toe's
needtogetaas
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Patel RH.
Department of Obstetrics & Gynaecology, St. George's Hospital Medical School London, U.K.
Two hundred fifty subfertile men with idiopathic oligospermia (count less than 20 million/ml) were treated with mesterolone (100-150 mg/day) for 12 months. Seminal analysis were assayed 3 times and serum follicle stimulating hormone (FSH - follicle stimulating hormone - ) luteinizing hormone (lh - leutenizing hormone - ) and plasma testosterone were assayed once before treatment and repeated at 3, 6, 9 and 12 months after the initiation of treatment. One hundred ten patients (44%) had normal serum FSH, LH and plasma testosterone, 85 patients (34%) had low serum FSH, LH and low plasma testosterone. One hundred seventy-five patients (70%) had moderate oligospermia (count 5 to less than 20 million/ml) and 75 patients (30%) had severe oligospermia (count less than 5 million/ml). Seventy-five moderately oligospermic patients showed significant improvement in the sperm density, total sperm count and motility following mesterolone therapy whereas only 12% showed improvement in the severe oligospermic group. Mesterolone had no depressing effect on low or normal serum FSH and LH levels but had depressing effect on 25% if the levels were elevated. There was no significant adverse effect on testosterone levels or on liver function. One hundred fifteen (46%) pregnancies resulted following the treatment, 9 of 115 (7.8%) aborted and 2 (1.7%) had ectopic pregnancy. Mesterolone was found to be more useful in patients with a sperm count ranging between 5 and 20 million/ml. Those with severe oligospermia (count less than 5 million) do not seem to benefit from this therapy.
Methods Find Exp Clin Pharmacol. 1984 Jun;6(6):331-7. Related Articles, Links
The effects of mesterolone, a male sex hormone in depressed patients (a double blind controlled study).
Itil TM, Michael ST, Shapiro DM, Itil KZ.
Based on computer EEG (CEEG) profiles, in high doses, antidepressant properties of mesterolone, a synthetic androgen, were predicted. In a double-blind placebo controlled study, the clinical effects of 300-450 mg daily mesterolone were investigated in 52 relatively young (age range 26-53 years, mean 42.7 years) male depressed outpatients. During 6 weeks of mesterolone treatment, there was a significant improvement of depressive symptomatology. However, since an improvement was also established during the placebo treatment, no statistically appreciable difference in the therapeutic effects of mesterolone was established compared to placebo. Mesterolone treatment significantly decreased both plasma testosterone and protein bound testosterone levels. Patients with high testosterone levels prior to treatment seem to have had more benefit from mesterolone treatment than patients with low testosterone levels. The degree of improvement weakly correlated to the decrease of testosterone levels during mesterolone treatment
Arch Dermatol Res. 1981;270(3):333-40. Related Articles, Links
[Effects of long-term use of mesterolone on different urine metabolites in andrological patients (author's transl)]
[Article in German]
Schramm P, Benes P, Morsches B.
We studied whether long-term use of mesterolone (12 weeks and longer) changed the pattern of steroid metabolites in urine from male subjects. We noticed an increase in dehydroepiandrosterone (DHEA) levels from 211-4 +/- 130.5 ug/die to 9943.8 +/- 6564.7 ug/die in the urine of all subjects tested. This increase was significant. After mesterolone administration was discontinued, DHEA levels decreased to their initial value. DHEA levels showed the smallest increase in those subjects having high plasma FSH levels. Perhaps the delta 4 pathway of testosterone synthesis may be preferred in these three subjects. We suppose that mesterolone has a blocking effect on the delta 5 pathway of testosterone synthesis. DHEA from the DHEA-pool can be used for testosterone synthesis and mesterolone seems to block some enzymes in the synthetic pathway. We were not able to detect a decrease in plasma testosterone levels during mesterolone use because of technical problems. Moreover, our patients told us that they felt ill after discontinuing mesterolone use; it may be possible that there is a psychotropic DHEA-effect during mesterolone use.
Int Urol Nephrol. 1978;10(3):251-6. Related Articles, Links
Mesterolone treatment of patients with pathospermia.
Szollosi J, Falkay GY, Sas M.
The response to Mesterolone, in doses of 25 mg/day, was examined in 42 pathospermic patients. Treatment lasted for 100 days. The pronounced response to the Mesterolone treatment was observed in hypozoo- and oligozoospermia with low initial fructose content in the ejaculate. Fructose content attained its normal range after the treatment. During the therapeutic period 11 wives became pregnant. The authors conclude that Mesterolone does not influence plasma FSH, LH and testosterone levels, it has only peripheral effects.
I mean we can pull up studies and test all day there is a lot out there on the subject just shit loads of info on it...have I tried it for PCT - post cycle therapy - hell no why not?because I just dont trust it and nothing has swade be to think other wise...
Department of Obstetrics & Gynaecology, St. George's Hospital Medical School London, U.K.
Two hundred fifty subfertile men with idiopathic oligospermia (count less than 20 million/ml) were treated with mesterolone (100-150 mg/day) for 12 months. Seminal analysis were assayed 3 times and serum follicle stimulating hormone (FSH - follicle stimulating hormone - ) luteinizing hormone (lh - leutenizing hormone - ) and plasma testosterone were assayed once before treatment and repeated at 3, 6, 9 and 12 months after the initiation of treatment. One hundred ten patients (44%) had normal serum FSH, LH and plasma testosterone, 85 patients (34%) had low serum FSH, LH and low plasma testosterone. One hundred seventy-five patients (70%) had moderate oligospermia (count 5 to less than 20 million/ml) and 75 patients (30%) had severe oligospermia (count less than 5 million/ml). Seventy-five moderately oligospermic patients showed significant improvement in the sperm density, total sperm count and motility following mesterolone therapy whereas only 12% showed improvement in the severe oligospermic group. Mesterolone had no depressing effect on low or normal serum FSH and LH levels but had depressing effect on 25% if the levels were elevated. There was no significant adverse effect on testosterone levels or on liver function. One hundred fifteen (46%) pregnancies resulted following the treatment, 9 of 115 (7.8%) aborted and 2 (1.7%) had ectopic pregnancy. Mesterolone was found to be more useful in patients with a sperm count ranging between 5 and 20 million/ml. Those with severe oligospermia (count less than 5 million) do not seem to benefit from this therapy.
Methods Find Exp Clin Pharmacol. 1984 Jun;6(6):331-7. Related Articles, Links
The effects of mesterolone, a male sex hormone in depressed patients (a double blind controlled study).
Itil TM, Michael ST, Shapiro DM, Itil KZ.
Based on computer EEG (CEEG) profiles, in high doses, antidepressant properties of mesterolone, a synthetic androgen, were predicted. In a double-blind placebo controlled study, the clinical effects of 300-450 mg daily mesterolone were investigated in 52 relatively young (age range 26-53 years, mean 42.7 years) male depressed outpatients. During 6 weeks of mesterolone treatment, there was a significant improvement of depressive symptomatology. However, since an improvement was also established during the placebo treatment, no statistically appreciable difference in the therapeutic effects of mesterolone was established compared to placebo. Mesterolone treatment significantly decreased both plasma testosterone and protein bound testosterone levels. Patients with high testosterone levels prior to treatment seem to have had more benefit from mesterolone treatment than patients with low testosterone levels. The degree of improvement weakly correlated to the decrease of testosterone levels during mesterolone treatment
Arch Dermatol Res. 1981;270(3):333-40. Related Articles, Links
[Effects of long-term use of mesterolone on different urine metabolites in andrological patients (author's transl)]
[Article in German]
Schramm P, Benes P, Morsches B.
We studied whether long-term use of mesterolone (12 weeks and longer) changed the pattern of steroid metabolites in urine from male subjects. We noticed an increase in dehydroepiandrosterone (DHEA) levels from 211-4 +/- 130.5 ug/die to 9943.8 +/- 6564.7 ug/die in the urine of all subjects tested. This increase was significant. After mesterolone administration was discontinued, DHEA levels decreased to their initial value. DHEA levels showed the smallest increase in those subjects having high plasma FSH levels. Perhaps the delta 4 pathway of testosterone synthesis may be preferred in these three subjects. We suppose that mesterolone has a blocking effect on the delta 5 pathway of testosterone synthesis. DHEA from the DHEA-pool can be used for testosterone synthesis and mesterolone seems to block some enzymes in the synthetic pathway. We were not able to detect a decrease in plasma testosterone levels during mesterolone use because of technical problems. Moreover, our patients told us that they felt ill after discontinuing mesterolone use; it may be possible that there is a psychotropic DHEA-effect during mesterolone use.
Int Urol Nephrol. 1978;10(3):251-6. Related Articles, Links
Mesterolone treatment of patients with pathospermia.
Szollosi J, Falkay GY, Sas M.
The response to Mesterolone, in doses of 25 mg/day, was examined in 42 pathospermic patients. Treatment lasted for 100 days. The pronounced response to the Mesterolone treatment was observed in hypozoo- and oligozoospermia with low initial fructose content in the ejaculate. Fructose content attained its normal range after the treatment. During the therapeutic period 11 wives became pregnant. The authors conclude that Mesterolone does not influence plasma FSH, LH and testosterone levels, it has only peripheral effects.
I mean we can pull up studies and test all day there is a lot out there on the subject just shit loads of info on it...have I tried it for PCT - post cycle therapy - hell no why not?because I just dont trust it and nothing has swade be to think other wise...
needtogetaas
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Proviron is 1 methyl DHT, so it's mainly androgenic...so simple logic tells us...
When one hormone stimulates the production of a second, the second suppresses the production of the first duh
When one hormone stimulates the production of a second, the second suppresses the production of the first duh
needtogetaas
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I mean its pretty much the same dame thing as Masteron lol why would you use it for PCT - post cycle therapy - ...I can see where it would help "pre PCT - post cycle therapy -"because it may actually downgrade the actual estrogen receptor making it doubly effective at reducing circulating estrogen levels but its still going to shut the hpta down.
needtogetaas
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stfu samoth you nerd.lolsamoth said:This can be approximated if one is sufficiently far enough away from any bodies of notable mass.
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