I've been thinking.......

[Sassy69]

I was kinda gonna say something like W6. I would say that generally over the years since I hit puberty I've been with 5-10 lbs of the same body weight, just keeping a "typical" lifestyle. I have trained for many years but it wasn't until the last 5 years or so that I finally figured out how to diet & train correctly that I was able to modify my body weight. Given any constant "average" of a lifestyle (regular eating habits, work, training or whatever), I experience a certain average weight & body composition. 2 years ago I got it down significantly for competition, but I also changed my diet drastically and changed my body composition as well. Then I rebounded and went in the other direction. Over the last 2 years I've averaged about 10 lbs more as a "comfortable" average weight, but I'm also carrying significantly more muscle than in the past, in addition to my currently kinda fat-accumulated state.

My comment ain't as scientific sounding as Corn's but its my observation.

 

[MS]

Wilson6 hit it on the head, but I have a very strong feeling that ultimate setpoint is based on total fat stores. I think that this is what the body "sees" via leptin or whatever, and is what it will continue to want to "see" over time. So you can easily get leaner by adding LBM without adding or losing total fat, and this is, IMHO, the best way to stay lean long term. Although your total fat hasn't decreased, your PERCENT fat has decreased so you look and feel leaner, and your body is happy because it maintains it fat stores.

 

[Cheetarah]

Wilson6 hit it on the head, but I have a very strong feeling that ultimate setpoint is based on total fat stores. I think that this is what the body "sees" via leptin or whatever, and is what it will continue to want to "see" over time. So you can easily get leaner by adding LBM without adding or losing total fat, and this is, IMHO, the best way to stay lean long term. Although your total fat hasn't decreased, your PERCENT fat has decreased so you look and feel leaner, and your body is happy because it maintains it fat stores.

I believe similarly. After about 1 1/2 years playing with my diet and trying to get leaner (gaining muscle and losing fat in the process), I've determined that my body is most comfortable somewhere between 16-18% body fat. To get below 16% makes my life hell, to hold 15% I pretty much have to be hungry all the time. I think this "setpoint" is based on genetics but other factors as well, for instance, birth control pills. I can't help but wonder if I'd be able to hold a lower bodyfat percentage if I wasn't on the pill.

Now the theory of gaining more muscle with my total fat staying the same, thereby making it a lower bodyfat PERCENTAGE, is quite interesting. I may be able to find whether or not it's true for me. Recently I did experience an increase in muscle mass with a decrease in bodyfat percentage (from 18.5% to 16.8%). You may be onto something! But geez, if that is true, I'm going to end up getting pretty big by the time I can hold 15% without starving all the time! I'm already WAY more muscular than all the other females I'm around. I don't want to stand out TOO much. I'm not really wanting to get bigger but it seems to be happening without my even trying. Sure wish that would happen with my bodyfat!

 

[SteelWeaver]

Well then, this is jolly good news!!! So the bigger we get, the leaner we'll be able to stay! Perfect! I always thought it was the PERCENTAGE that stayed the same, which would kinda suck.

I know that my fat percentage hasn't jumped back to what I started with, even though I'm quite a lot heavier than I used to be. Sure, I'm not "lean", but whatever, that'll come once I figure things out better.

Corn, I'm not sure what you mean by 'it's always "xxx pounds seems to be my set point." ' Who says this? Do you mean total number of pounds? From what I've seen here, most people talk about set point in terms of %bf ...

 

[spatts]

Question:

Do you think the body kinda KNOWS how much muscle it has and is less willing to get rid of fat, the more muscle that's present? Or am I just grasping at straws here?

It seems like the more LBM I have, the less willing my body is to give up any fat, below a certain level.

Thoughts?

 

[The Shadow]

...makes sense as the body will sacrifice muscle to save bf

 

[spatts]

I have been trying to get to 175 for a couple weeks. I'm holding steady at 187-189 despite the fact that I'm rotating as if I were on my old cutting diet. Which works less and less efficiently the more muscle I gain. Perhaps I'm undereating now, since this diet first worked when I was at 20 fewer pounds of LBM.

 

[JJFigure]

How many kcals/day are you eating? I believe the leaner you are, the harder it is to drop 5-7 lbs. I had to decrease my kcals to 11xbodyweight (1500 kcals/day) to get past my sticking points. Before, when I had less LBM, I could diet using 1700 kcals/day.

 

[The Shadow]

...technically MORE lbm will make it easier to lose 10-11 is typicaly average cals for cutting

 

[The Shadow]

Spatts - try adding in 200 per day......but I dunno if thats gonna do the trick....possible water retention?