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Gain speed and size??
- Thread starter Needhelp
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PopeyePower
New member
Most bodybuilders don't know what an olympic lift is, altough they could benefit greatly from them, Flex and Musclemag don't mention them, so nobody does them.....There are a lot of programs to hook yourself up with that will help you meet your goals......whatever you choose, train explosively and do the olympic lifts..or some hybrid of them....and throw in some sprints and plyometrics......A technique that works for a lot of trainees is a rep scheme like 5-5-5-3-3-8 for example where your 5's and 3's build strength and are done explosively and the last set of 8 is for hypertrophy and weight gain.....this can lead to burnout and overtraining if done for too long, but then again so can just about everything......There are some posts by Arioch on the Powerlifting board on the olympic lifts.....read them, they are better than any book i have ever read on weight training......and from personal experience training using OL can increase size....when I started power cleaning I must have gained 10 pounds in a month, my upper back and neck just got jacked....the more difficult the lift, the harder you breath , and the more you sweat, the better it is for you.
What OL lifts are you talking about?
Right now i do c&p, squat (Well OL version is over head, right, should i do that instead or add it?)
So I would do 6 sets? I might try this in a few months because right now my strength is pretty pathetic and i'll probably benefit from almost anything......
How long should I do that type of routine? Should I cycle it? Like 5 weeks some other routine, 5 weeks 555338......
Thanks for the help
Right now i do c&p, squat (Well OL version is over head, right, should i do that instead or add it?)
So I would do 6 sets? I might try this in a few months because right now my strength is pretty pathetic and i'll probably benefit from almost anything......
How long should I do that type of routine? Should I cycle it? Like 5 weeks some other routine, 5 weeks 555338......
Thanks for the help
coolcolj
New member
I did a 3week HST style program for 3 weeks and then switched to the below
since 5 weeks ago I'm
up 4kg in bodyweight - 8.8 lbs
stronger in every lift
improved my standing long jump by 6 inches
added 2 inches to my vertical jump
1.25 inches on my legs
3/4 inch on my arms
all this without doing any plyos, sprint work or playing any basketball, but I'm definitely gonna enjoy putting down some hurtin come summer time
and I'm pretty sure I can accelerate like I've been shot out of a cannon
what I do now
day 1- chest and back
day 2 - power clean, legs, lower back
day 3 - rest
day 4- Snatch, shoulders and arms, cuffs, shins and abs
day 5- rest
repeat
I don't even go to failure, and my reps and poundages go up every workout. The system I use is somewhat instinctive in a sense. Its slightly different for each exercise and day I use.
But generally speaking I do 2 heavy work sets (plus 3 warmup sets) with controlled eccentric and maximal explosive concentric, but since the weight is heavy it doesn't move that fast. I generally work in the 5-6 rep range except for dumbell exercises where I go from 6-8 since the jumps between dumbells is too great. After the 2 worksets I do 1 power set which is a set 8 with 60% of my 1RM (guess) with explosive speed.
I try to avoid failure. Generally stopping the set 1 rep short of failure. If I get the 2 sets of 5 in the main sets, then I increase the weight next workout. For dumbells, I start with 2 sets of 6 for the main work sets, next workout I do 2x7, after that I do 2x8, if I can get the 2 sets easily I do an additional set. then next workout I use the next heavier set of dumbells
For Incline dumbell Bench press let me give you an example of what I did this week -
Last chest workout I did 3 sets on incline dumbells B.P- 1st set I did 7 reps - hard. 2nd set after 2 mins rest 5 reps - near failed. I then used 60% 1RM dumbell and did some explosive 8 reps for power.
Yesterday I used the same weight blew out 8 reps, stopped the set. Next set after 2 mins rest did 8 reps as well, 3rd set did 7 reps and then 4th set 60% 1RM 8 reps explosively for power, never to failure. Going up to the next heavier set of dumbells next workout and drop my reps back to 6 for 2 sets followed by my power set. When you make progress you feel good!!
Whereas for say my squat after my warmup sets, I do 2x5, if I get both sets comfortable, without hitting failure then I up the weight 5 lbs next workout. So far I've been doing that every workout! 5lbs every workout is great!
I always do 3 warmup sets for each main compound exercise 1x15 with a very light weight, 1x10 with something a bit heavier, and then 1x8 with something about 60-70% of the work weight. If the muscle is already warm then I skip the warmup sets.
Also with that 3rd Power set, while I say its 60% of my 1RM for 8 reps, generally speaking I tend to use the same weight week to week even though my main work sets have gone up, as its more for speed and neural activation.
This what my workout currently looks like
day 1- Yates overhand Barbell rows 2x6, 1x8 power set
Incline Dumbell BP 2x6-8, 1x8 power set
Pullups (shoulder width grip) 2x6, 1x8 power set on pulldown machine
Day 2 - Overhead squat 1x5 - more for warmup and mobilise hips and shoulders
Powercleans 2x5
Full back squat 2x5
Full Front squat 2x5
Jump squats 1x6
Sideways lunges 2x5 each side - sometimes I'll add reverse lunges here in a big complex
Glute Ham raise on floor 2x5 using hands to help
Romanian deadlift 1x10 -
Standing single leg calf raise - hold a dumbell - 2x6
reverse hypers - bodyweight 2x15 to flush blood and stretch lower back
Day 3 - Rest
Day 4 - Power Snatch 2x5
Push press/jerks 2x5
Modified Cuban Press 2x6
Lying L Fyles to work rotatry cuffs 2x10-15
Incline curls 2x6
Standing dumbell curl 1x6
Decline tricep extension 3x6
Hanging leg raise 3x10-15
Toe raises to work shin muscles 3x6-10
Day 5 - rest
then repeat
Each workout takes me 1 hour to do including a 10 minute warmup
I'll do this cycle for another 4 weeks and then, I'm off to recoup and start back on a 3 times a week full body HST cycle and then switch back to this program afterward, and so on it goes
This way I alternate between Hypetrophy and power/strength cycles - plus 9 days time off after the strength/power cycle
since 5 weeks ago I'm
up 4kg in bodyweight - 8.8 lbs
stronger in every lift
improved my standing long jump by 6 inches
added 2 inches to my vertical jump
1.25 inches on my legs
3/4 inch on my arms
all this without doing any plyos, sprint work or playing any basketball, but I'm definitely gonna enjoy putting down some hurtin come summer time
and I'm pretty sure I can accelerate like I've been shot out of a cannon
what I do now
day 1- chest and back
day 2 - power clean, legs, lower back
day 3 - rest
day 4- Snatch, shoulders and arms, cuffs, shins and abs
day 5- rest
repeat
I don't even go to failure, and my reps and poundages go up every workout. The system I use is somewhat instinctive in a sense. Its slightly different for each exercise and day I use.
But generally speaking I do 2 heavy work sets (plus 3 warmup sets) with controlled eccentric and maximal explosive concentric, but since the weight is heavy it doesn't move that fast. I generally work in the 5-6 rep range except for dumbell exercises where I go from 6-8 since the jumps between dumbells is too great. After the 2 worksets I do 1 power set which is a set 8 with 60% of my 1RM (guess) with explosive speed.
I try to avoid failure. Generally stopping the set 1 rep short of failure. If I get the 2 sets of 5 in the main sets, then I increase the weight next workout. For dumbells, I start with 2 sets of 6 for the main work sets, next workout I do 2x7, after that I do 2x8, if I can get the 2 sets easily I do an additional set. then next workout I use the next heavier set of dumbells
For Incline dumbell Bench press let me give you an example of what I did this week -
Last chest workout I did 3 sets on incline dumbells B.P- 1st set I did 7 reps - hard. 2nd set after 2 mins rest 5 reps - near failed. I then used 60% 1RM dumbell and did some explosive 8 reps for power.
Yesterday I used the same weight blew out 8 reps, stopped the set. Next set after 2 mins rest did 8 reps as well, 3rd set did 7 reps and then 4th set 60% 1RM 8 reps explosively for power, never to failure. Going up to the next heavier set of dumbells next workout and drop my reps back to 6 for 2 sets followed by my power set. When you make progress you feel good!!
Whereas for say my squat after my warmup sets, I do 2x5, if I get both sets comfortable, without hitting failure then I up the weight 5 lbs next workout. So far I've been doing that every workout! 5lbs every workout is great!
I always do 3 warmup sets for each main compound exercise 1x15 with a very light weight, 1x10 with something a bit heavier, and then 1x8 with something about 60-70% of the work weight. If the muscle is already warm then I skip the warmup sets.
Also with that 3rd Power set, while I say its 60% of my 1RM for 8 reps, generally speaking I tend to use the same weight week to week even though my main work sets have gone up, as its more for speed and neural activation.
This what my workout currently looks like
day 1- Yates overhand Barbell rows 2x6, 1x8 power set
Incline Dumbell BP 2x6-8, 1x8 power set
Pullups (shoulder width grip) 2x6, 1x8 power set on pulldown machine
Day 2 - Overhead squat 1x5 - more for warmup and mobilise hips and shoulders
Powercleans 2x5
Full back squat 2x5
Full Front squat 2x5
Jump squats 1x6
Sideways lunges 2x5 each side - sometimes I'll add reverse lunges here in a big complex
Glute Ham raise on floor 2x5 using hands to help
Romanian deadlift 1x10 -
Standing single leg calf raise - hold a dumbell - 2x6
reverse hypers - bodyweight 2x15 to flush blood and stretch lower back
Day 3 - Rest
Day 4 - Power Snatch 2x5
Push press/jerks 2x5
Modified Cuban Press 2x6
Lying L Fyles to work rotatry cuffs 2x10-15
Incline curls 2x6
Standing dumbell curl 1x6
Decline tricep extension 3x6
Hanging leg raise 3x10-15
Toe raises to work shin muscles 3x6-10
Day 5 - rest
then repeat
Each workout takes me 1 hour to do including a 10 minute warmup
I'll do this cycle for another 4 weeks and then, I'm off to recoup and start back on a 3 times a week full body HST cycle and then switch back to this program afterward, and so on it goes
This way I alternate between Hypetrophy and power/strength cycles - plus 9 days time off after the strength/power cycle
Last edited:
PopeyePower
New member
The Olympic lifts as they are performed in competition are the snatch and the clean and jerk. There are various hybrids you can perform in training, such as power cleans, hang cleans, power snatches, hang snatches, split jerks, push jerks, push presses, power shrugs, to name some, there are quite a bit more.....the purpose of these hybrids for an athlete is to build explosion and enhance performance at their respective sport, for an athlete competing in OL they would be used to improve their snatch and C&J......you are correct that an Olympic or Snatch Grip Squat is an overhead squat......there is so much to be explained about the olympic lifts and once you leant them, there is always room for improvement as far as technique goes, you need to be patient, improving your snatch is not like improving your bench, you need to practice the form before anything, i would reccomend going through the movment one week with a broom stick before even trying the bare bar, then just go up 5lbs a week....form is much more important than how much weight you are handling for the beginner.....even guys who have been training for years can always improve their form.....my advice would be to hook up with a good strength coach.....you can also utilize this board, I am new to the board, but on the powerlifting board I read some posts by Arioch and they are awesome, I would bet this guy has forgotten more about lifting than I will ever know, also I was doing a search and saw some posts with video clpis of the correct way to execute various lifts were attached........As far as the rep scheme I outlined in my previous post, it isn't the word of God....it is just a little sample of a rep scheme many athletes I have trained with have used. If you are looking for explosion, size, and speed it may work for you because the idea is that your 5's and 3's build strength and the 8 reps is for hypertrophy, you can go 5-5-2-2-2-8 or 5-3-3-3-3-8.....or any type of variation, the point to keep in mind is that for most trainees reps between 2-5 build power and reps between 7-10 build size, so just keep this in mind when desiging your rep scheme....also, post how long you have been training and your progress to date,as well as your age.......training is a very personal thing and trial and error over the years will help you decide what works best for you....read all you can to grasp the basic principles and then use that knowledge with your personal experience in the gym to work out something for yourself.....I would tell you to use a program as long as it works, when you hit a wall, then make some changes.....the more advanced you are, the more variety you need, beginners and intermediates can perform say bench presses every week for months or even years and still make gains....the longer you train, the more creative you need to become.......and onemore thing about the sets.....say you went with 5-5-5-5-8 on a bench press and your 5 rep max is 315, you would want to warm up a little, then do your working sets with 265-285-295-315 and then your backoff set with something you can hit for 8 reps to failure and when strength training all reps should be performed by you, no help from a spotter.....I am just rambling and throwing ideas out for you and giving you a little base to work with......I hope this helped a little...
Last edited:
PopeyePower
New member
That was a good post CoolColJ, and it is just another example that there are many ways to acheive your goals.....if you don't like the idea of training for speed, strength, and hypertrophy all at once you can use a cycle approach where for so many weeks you build size, then for so many weeks you build speed and strength, i like that workout a lot.......another thing you can do is work 2 on, 1 off, 2 on 1 off with the first day being for explosion and the second being for base.....a lot of the big college football programs are using a system like this.....it would look something like this....
Monday:
Power Clean(5-5-3-3)
Power Snatch(5-3-3-3)
Split Jerk(5-3-3-2)
High Pull(5-5-5-5)
Power Shrug(5-5-5-5)
Tuesday:
Front Squat (5-5-5-5-5)
Back Squat(5-5-5-3-3)
Bench Press(8-5-5-5)
Close Grip Bench(8-8)
Underhand Grip Chins (10-10-10)
then Wed off and Thurs and Fri you repeat Mon and Tues respectively with lighter weights, say 70% or you can do Mon heavy explosion, tues light base, thurs light explosion, Fri heavy base....as a beginner use the same exercises, as an intermediate change every month, as an advanced trainee switch every workout by advanced ......the sets and reps are just an example, nothing is set in stone, the gym is a place to escape and release stress and work towards a goal and improve yourself....it is fun and it is not rocket science, enjoy yourself and don't get caught up in following a program rep for rep, set for set, word for word, you'll go nuts.......i would reccomend that you write down what you did each workout though, so you can look back and refer to it down the line and to check your progress and see what works and what doesn't work....you'll have a blast training, and expect to make mistakes, everyone fucks up at first, who cares??? And you may have a great program that just doesn't do it for you...or one that did it for you and stopped one day....who gives a shit?? There is something out there for everyone, thats why there is vanilla and chocolate ice cream.......learn the basic principles, find what works for you through experience....use it til it stops working, when it stops find something new.
Monday:
Power Clean(5-5-3-3)
Power Snatch(5-3-3-3)
Split Jerk(5-3-3-2)
High Pull(5-5-5-5)
Power Shrug(5-5-5-5)
Tuesday:
Front Squat (5-5-5-5-5)
Back Squat(5-5-5-3-3)
Bench Press(8-5-5-5)
Close Grip Bench(8-8)
Underhand Grip Chins (10-10-10)
then Wed off and Thurs and Fri you repeat Mon and Tues respectively with lighter weights, say 70% or you can do Mon heavy explosion, tues light base, thurs light explosion, Fri heavy base....as a beginner use the same exercises, as an intermediate change every month, as an advanced trainee switch every workout by advanced ......the sets and reps are just an example, nothing is set in stone, the gym is a place to escape and release stress and work towards a goal and improve yourself....it is fun and it is not rocket science, enjoy yourself and don't get caught up in following a program rep for rep, set for set, word for word, you'll go nuts.......i would reccomend that you write down what you did each workout though, so you can look back and refer to it down the line and to check your progress and see what works and what doesn't work....you'll have a blast training, and expect to make mistakes, everyone fucks up at first, who cares??? And you may have a great program that just doesn't do it for you...or one that did it for you and stopped one day....who gives a shit?? There is something out there for everyone, thats why there is vanilla and chocolate ice cream.......learn the basic principles, find what works for you through experience....use it til it stops working, when it stops find something new.
Welsh power house
New member
Needhelp said:
Yes it is possibel, i train with my rugby team and lift for size and speed.
Make sure you hit the track hard once or twice a week......do you play a sport?
In the gym, concentrate on basic lifts and DO POWER CLEANS (the best for speed, and help you lift more weights on most other lifts = more size!)
Good luck
Well, i'm gonna be running sprints--track.. I really don't like the sport too well, but my mom thinks it's odd that i'm not out for any sports. My time in the 100 now is 12.2 w/o doing really any training, kind of slow... so I want to get down at least sub 11.4, do you think that's possible? Winter is coming up so I won't be able to go the track, can i still gain the speed with just weights?
If I do decide not to do track period, would doing ol's and that rep scheme (cycled) still benefit me for gaining mass?
If I do decide not to do track period, would doing ol's and that rep scheme (cycled) still benefit me for gaining mass?
benchmonster
New member
Do a ton of glute/ham raises. The russians are always big on these and manage to squeeze in a token white guy in the olympic finals. He always loses horribly to whomever the U.S. sends out. But I bet whoever the Russians sends out is a damn fast white guy.
Not trying to get a racial thing going here at all, just pointing out that the Russians don't have the best genetics available for sprinting and still produce some very fast runners. And one of their secret weapons is a ton of glute ham raises. It will strengthen the muscle that sprint, and done balistically, it will teach those muscles to fire off faster as well.
B.
Not trying to get a racial thing going here at all, just pointing out that the Russians don't have the best genetics available for sprinting and still produce some very fast runners. And one of their secret weapons is a ton of glute ham raises. It will strengthen the muscle that sprint, and done balistically, it will teach those muscles to fire off faster as well.
B.
