finasteride: effects on overall body composition

[Alpine`]

We all know that DHT is responsible for aggravating MPB. And by now many of us have come to realize DHT isn’t so bad and serves a purpose besides just causing hair loss.

What I’m concerned with in this post is how long-term finasteride use effects overall body composition. That is, lean muscle vs body fat and also how it effects lean muscle gains.

While DHT is a much stronger androgen than Testosterone it still has less (musch less) of an effect on skeletal muscle than Testosterone does. From what I have read DHT is significantly weaker than Test in terms of promoting lean muscle. As long as your Test is normal/high you should have no issues gaining and keeping lean muscle.

Still, we have many anecdotal reports of people claiming finasteride hindered gains or degraded overall quality of body composition. I have seen reports of people saying finasteride should not be used when trying to get very lean because it makes it harder to reduce body fat. Some even go as far as to say that it promotes body fat. It’s true that DHT is somewhat of a natural ant-estrogen within the body. It does this through a few numerous pathways and this why some may experience gyno on finasteride. Many critics of finasteride say it shouldn’t be taken at all. They say the incidence of sides and permanaent sexual effects is much more common that Merck likes to admit. Swale, a notable medical voice with special experience, has been very vocal in an effort to dissuade people from using it.

Is there any solid science or evidence that shows DHT reduction leads to increased body fat? I’m not aware of any studies in regard to how it effects body composition. I don’t like the idea of reducing DHT but it does help with MPB. I took finasteride for roughly 2 years with no major side effects to speak of. However, there are MANY sides attributed to its use. They seem to increase as one gets older. Perhaps the sexual side effects are much more noticeable as reach your 30’s. I consider myself lucky but I have noticed a gradual increase in hair loss since I stopped taking it. I seemed to have slightly easier time depositing abdominal fat during my time on finasteride. During Tren use I also noticed very mild gyno for the first time. I have read that the effects of low DHT (and the loss of its estrogen antagonism) paired with progesterone can often be trouble. We all know that estrogen + progesterone can lead to bad things. This was the only time I ever experienced any type of gyno activity. This leads me to think if using finasteride with Tren or Superdrol you should be particularly careful.

I’m willing to go back on finasteride for a few more years (maybe until Mid 30’s) if I become confident that it doesn’t have a negative impact on body composition. I stopped taking it due to recent efforts to become very lean. What are your opinions on finasteride and body composition? Do you think it promotes fat gain or simply slows lean out? I would like to hear from some of you who have taken finasteride long-term and its perceived effects on your composition and any sides you may have had.

Thanks in advance.

 

[lanky]

Although i have not took finasteride myself, some of my geriatric and a little younger patients that were taking the 5mg dosage for BPH complained of of feeling a "little more tired" when taking the drug, a few discontinued and verbalized that the fatigue was reduced. Am i saying does this hold any significance? who knows, there are many factors for fatigue, especially in the geriatric population, and when they are in certain hospital settings, and current disease proccesses etc..

 

[Workout King]

finasteride on a short term basis of my use made me feel very weak and tired and dropped all my lifts a considerable amout, though i didn't notice any body composition change other than less chest hair.

 

[Harder N Leaner]

ive been on finasteride for about 3 months and have lost 16 lbs... Im not on cycle and havent cycled since november and i have keep all muscle and in fact got stronger in the last 3 months.

 

[Alpine`]

Personal experience is great. I'm looking for that.

I guess Im also looking for any physiological/hormonal reason why it would tend to make you "fatter" or perhaps make you deposit abdominal fat easier. Perhaps some of the more well read members can chime in on this aspect. I think its clear to some it may soften you a little in terms of muscle hardness.

I dont think its impossible to get lean or stay lean on it. I'm just wondering if there are any underlying reasons why it could be detrimental to a lean muscular physique.

 

[stevebarber]

I've taken proscar and haven't really noticed any hegative effects on body composition at all. Why not just take it first and then see how it goes?

 

[Alpine`]

I have taken it, I took it for about 2 years and it did reduce MPB but I "seemed" to put on abdomnial fat quicker/easier. I was never sure if it was legit or a placebo. I wanted to try and find out. Obviously there are no studies on it because a) merck was paying for most of them b) merck wouldnt want to cast its product in a negative light.

You would think that even the possibility of more estrogen would lead to more BF. I seem to get getting a lot of feedback like " Yes estrogen = fat" and so on. In reality Im not sure its that simple. When it comes to the delicate balance of the human physiology 1+1 isnt always 2.

J Clin Endocrinol Metab. 2005 Jun;90(6):3592-9.

Estrogen supplementation reduces whole body leucine and carbohydrate oxidation and increases lipid oxidation in men during endurance exercise.

Hamadeh MJ, Devries MC, Tarnopolsky MA.

Department of Pediatrics and Medicine, McMaster University Medical Center, 1200 Main Street West, Hamilton, Ontario, Canada L8N 3Z5.

Healthy active men exhibit higher rates of carbohydrate (CHO) and leucine oxidation and lower rates of lipid oxidation compared with their female counterparts both at rest and during moderate intensity endurance exercise. We postulated that this reduced dependence on amino acids as a fuel source in women was due to the female sex hormone estrogen. In a randomized, double-blind, placebo-controlled, cross-over design, we investigated the effect of supplementing 12 recreationally active men with estrogen on whole body substrate oxidation and leucine kinetics at rest and during moderate intensity endurance exercise. Subjects cycled for 90 min at an intensity of 65% maximum O(2) consumption after 8 d of either estrogen supplementation (2 mg 17beta-estradiol/d) or placebo (polycose). After a 2-wk washout period, they repeated the test after 8 d of the alternate treatment. On the test day, after a primed continuous infusion of l-[(13)C]leucine, O(2) consumption, CO(2) production, steady-state breath (13)CO(2), and plasma alpha-[(13)C]ketoisocaproate enrichments were measured at rest and at 60, 75, and 90 min during exercise in the postabsorptive state. Exercise increased energy expenditure more than 5-fold, CHO oxidation more than 6-fold, lipid oxidation more than 4-fold, and leucine oxidation 2.2-fold (all P < 0.0001), whereas it decreased the ratio of lipid to CHO oxidation by 50-70% (P = 0.003) compared with values at rest. Estrogen supplementation decreased respiratory exchange ratio during exercise (P = 0.03). Estrogen supplementation significantly decreased CHO oxidation by 5-16% (P = 0.04) and leucine oxidation by 16% (P = 0.01), whereas it significantly increased lipid oxidation by 22-44% (P = 0.024) at rest and during exercise. We conclude that estrogen influences fuel source selection at rest and during endurance exercise in recreationally active men, characterized by a reduced dependence on amino acids and CHO and an increased reliance on lipids as a fuel source.

That said, NOBODY is going to bump estrogen levels in an attempt to reduce fat for MANY other reasons (other feedback loops).
This doesnt help us at all, serves to cloud the situation even more. You would think estrogen = fat but perhaps not. As we learn more the BAD GUYS (DHT, estrogen) are actually not that bad. Its all there for a very good reason, millions of years of evolution were not a mistake. Like I said, this study just maks it harder to see if there is a legit reason why it would tend to reduce the overall quality of body comp. - that is to say, fat vs lean muscle.

 

[KD1]

I think it makes me a little bit softer looking, with a bit more water. But thats the price I pay for keeping the hair I have.