Diindolymethane (DIM)

[John McLane]

Anybody used this? It's an anti-estrogen

 

[Elrock]

I only use it in transdermal form as it is in Forma Stanzol. It has poor oral bioavailability.

 

[Russianstar]

Its pretty poor full stop, much better options, its in Forma because it allows aromatisation in the brain which is vital for health when using an A.I

 

[pdelta]

Anybody used this? It's an anti-estrogen

I've use DIM for years however I3C is a better option. It's not an AI per se. It's an estrogen channeling agent. It channel bad estrogen E2 in to more beneficial estrogens E1 and E3. You get the benefit of estrogen without side effects of bad estrogen. And yes it works. I have many blood tests to prove it.

 

[Russianstar]

I've use DIM for years however I3C is a better option. It's not an AI per se. It's an estrogen channeling agent. It channel bad estrogen E2 in to more beneficial estrogens E1 and E3. You get the benefit of estrogen without side effects of bad estrogen. And yes it works. I have many blood tests to prove it.

How much do you use? Transdermal or oral? Did you use it with anything else?
These are all factors involved in deciding if something does work.

I suggested its addition in forma because of its action in the brain.


Indole certainly performs better in most studies.

 

[pdelta]

I've used as a standalone and in stack with my favorite AI formestane. I typically use 200mg/day when I'm not on cycle. More when I am on cycle. I've gone as high as 800mg/day in divided doses. IMO I3C (Indole 3 Carbinol) is the best option. Most of the research has been done on I3C. DIM can have adverse effects in certain hormonal environments.

 

[Russianstar]

I've used as a standalone and in stack with my favorite AI formestane. I typically use 200mg/day when I'm not on cycle. More when I am on cycle. I've gone as high as 800mg/day in divided doses. IMO I3C (Indole 3 Carbinol) is the best option. Most of the research has been done on I3C. DIM can have adverse effects in certain hormonal environments.

Indeed, Anti-cancer properties , in particular breast and colon, ionizing radiation protective, just a shame about its oral bioavailability.
It also improves left ventricular function which is of interest of those with heart problems.

 

[Russianstar]

Its pretty poor full stop, much better options, its in Forma because it allows aromatisation in the brain which is vital for health when using an A.I

Poor as in a weak A.I and poor as in bioavailability. It has a multitude of benefits when used for the right reasons, and even more so when applied topically.

 

[pdelta]

I've never heard of any bioavailability problems with either DIM or I3C and I've researching them for years.

 

[Russianstar]

I've never heard of any bioavailability problems with either DIM or I3C and I've researching them for years.

Sorry I don't just say things without backing stuff up, I can help you research if you like. I wrote a long article recently about anti-estrogens, and often get students to do studies on them after my lectures.


"Despite the fact that DIM is stable under acidic conditions (Grose and Bjeldanes, 1992), the administration of DIM to female Sprague-Dawley rats by the i.p. route resulted in greater induction of the cytochromes P450 responsible for estradiol 2-hydroxylation as compared with the oral route (Jellinck et al., 1993). Attempting to augment DIM bioavailability, a patented formulation of DIM has been developed [BioResponse-DIM (BR-DIM); Indolplex] that utilizes solubility-enhancing microencapsulation technology.

crystalline DIM was found to exhibit low apparent oral bioavailability, as would be expected from its low aqueous and lipid solubility.

It also needs to be active for longer periods to work as it breaks down very quickly as shown above, in 1 hour it declines in its effects.

Oral route shows less affect on estrogen than i.p

The bio response formula that initiate greatest results was a topical application with the following.
DIM, 3,3′-diindolylmethane; DMSO, dimethyl sulfoxide

Because it lacks bioavailability researchers have been looking for ways to improve it in oral form, so heres from another study.

"DIM formulations on the basis of pegylated vitamin E are known in prior art (U.S. Pat. No. 6,416,793 published on Jul. 9, 2002). TPGS-based compositions, though, have helped achieve a very insignificant (not more than 50% to 100%) increase in biological availability of DIM, its analogues, and derivatives, for which reason the therapeutic potential of these compounds cannot be used to capacity. Besides, the preparation has to be spray-dried in a very power-intensive process that raises its production costs.

The closest prior art of the present invention described in international application WO 2009032699 (published on Mar. 12, 2009) relates to pharmaceutical compositions based on an anti-proliferative combination of DIM, polyunsaturated fatty acids (PUFAs), and folic acid. These compositions are disadvantageous because they are not stable enough, the principal component precipitating as tiny crystals in storage. Moreover, most people being short of omega-3 fatty acids, derived PUFAs may only have exaggerated effects. According to recent findings, addition of folic acid is undesirable for small children having inflammatory diseases of the autoimmune type


Indole which as I said is a great product, has much higher oral bioavailability.