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College ex-lineman attacks cop and car contains Tren, Test, A-50

bbkingpin

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AN INTERESTING READ...

How anger cut down a big lineman
One-time North Allegheny star faces long list of charges for attack on IUP officer

Friday, November 17, 2000

By Tom Gibb, Post-Gazette Staff Writer








North Allegheny High School coach Jim Rankin quickly corrects a questioner.

"Willie Knapp wasn't a good football player," he said. "He was a great football player."

The Franklin Park resident was a both-ways, beefy lineman who could explode with speed and bench press 400 pounds. In 1997, the year Knapp graduated from North Allegheny, he was tagged as one of Pennsylvania's best, playing in the Big 33 Football Classic. He rated honorable mention on USA Today's All-USA team and was picked for the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette's Fabulous 22 regional all-star team.

"There was nothing that Willie couldn't do in football," Rankin said early this month. "He was very strong, very explosive."

But Knapp's most explosive performance came not quite two months ago, two years after he played his last down of college football, during a late-morning traffic stop on an Indiana, Pa., street that squeezes through the Indiana University of Pennsylvania campus.

The yellow Volvo that Knapp was driving caught a campus police officer's attention when it made an illegal left turn, police say. When Sgt. Gregory Davis got out of his cruiser, approached Knapp's car and, for openers, told Knapp that he should be wearing his seat belt, Knapp shot back: "I'm not ...10 years old. ... I won't be told when to wear my seat belt."

In moments, police say, a raging, cursing Knapp was out of his car, headed toward Davis.

Knapp ignored Davis' warnings to stay back and kept coming through a blast of pepper spray, a police report says.

And suddenly, by police accounts, there was 6 feet, 310 pounds of Willie Knapp atop Davis, straddling the unarmed police officer, choking him with both hands and screaming, "I'm going to kill you."

It took two other officers to break the hold, pull Knapp away and handcuff him. Knapp, who told a district justice that he had no criminal record and no previous drug or alcohol involvement, wound up facing a stiff list of charges topped by attempted homicide and aggravated assault.

The news was a perplexing twist, Rankin said.

On Oct. 27, the case twisted anew.

IUP police filed additional charges, saying that the day Knapp was arrested, he was packing banned anabolic steroids, drugs sometimes used by bodybuilders to gain muscle mass and stamina -- drugs that researchers say can rocket users into rage. Among the drugs taken from the Volvo was a container labeled "Finaplix-H, implant for feedlot heifers," police say.

"These are substances that could cause heart or liver damage ... or cancer," said Dr. Linn Goldberg, professor of medicine at Oregon Health Sciences University and an expert on anabolic steroids. "And they can make you mad. They can cause uncontrolled aggression."

Indeed, campus police are considering whether Knapp's eruption was powered by steroids.

"With steroids, there's a tendency to just snap," campus police Sgt. Leonard Jendrejeski said. "It could have just been the traffic citation that caused it. It could have been all the things totaled together."

Three years ago, though, Knapp was making his name purely in the sports pages.

He had gone off to the University of Rhode Island, slightly disappointed that he'd be playing football for a Division I-AA school instead of going to the top-rung I-A.

Knapp was a starter his freshman year -- "an aggressive kid, to an extreme," said assistant coach Carnelius Cruz, one of the few holdovers from the 1997 coaching staff.

"The problem was that he didn't know how to turn off the aggression when he was off the field," Cruz said. "I know as a player, I learned how to turn it off away from the field. He couldn't. ... He got into fights with a couple of guys off campus."

Drug testing there showed no steroid use, Cruz said.

But after his sophomore year at Rhode Island, Knapp packed up, left and made a failed walk-on attempt at the University of Pittsburgh. He transferred to IUP two years ago, to a school that had tried to recruit him out of North Allegheny in 1997. But the side trip to Pitt would cost Knapp; under NCAA rules, it meant he would have to sit out a year before playing at IUP.

So, Knapp showed up at IUP's spring drills in 1999 and promptly left.

"He was in no condition to play football. He came in well over 300 pounds," IUP head coach Frank Cignetti said. "So, he figured, 'Why go through this if I can't play football this fall?' He packed it in. That was the end."

"He pulled his gear, then turned it in the next day," said Tom Rogish, assistant head coach.

Knapp stayed at school, though, his major undecided, taking classes through the end of summer term in August and working as a bouncer at the Coney Island, a downtown bar and restaurant.

"He's the kind of guy I wouldn't mind having as a bouncer," Jendrejeski said. "When he's in the doorway, the doorway's full."

And then, came a traffic stop Sept. 12.

Defense lawyer Thomas Ceraso of Greensburg will say little about the case yet but says he'll contest details of the attack at a preliminary hearing Nov. 30.

According to charges filed by IUP police Cpl. Rebecca Leeper, Knapp's confrontation with Davis began in earnest when, moments after the traffic stop, Davis said Knapp would be cited.

"Why don't you get a real job, you ...?" the criminal complaint quotes Knapp as saying. "Why don't you take off that badge and we'll settle it right here? ... I'm going to kick your ass. ... Take your uniform off and we can settle this right now."

As Knapp walked toward him and got within seven to 10 feet -- growing "louder, more vulgar," the complaint says -- Davis warned him to back off. At four to five feet, Davis, carrying only a collapsible nightstick and pepper spray, let loose with a 3-second blast of spray, police say.

"That [spray] was a triggering factor," Knapp said during an interview Nov. 2 in which he said he couldn't talk about most of the details.

Police say Knapp hit Davis in the face, knocked him down, jumped on him, then grabbed Davis with a two-handed choke hold that kept the policeman from breathing.

Davis, bruised, cut and swollen, was able to return to work. Knapp wound up in Indiana County Jail without bail, then was released three weeks later, when President Judge William Martin set bail at $150,000 and let Knapp go home to Franklin Park, where he is under electronically monitored house arrest. He also is under orders to get outpatient treatment for drug abuse and take anger management classes.

The second part of the case -- the drug connection -- wasn't added until Oct. 27, when state police chemists finished analyzing pills and liquids taken from bottles and hypodermic needles found in a duffel bag in Knapp's car.

The criminal complaint lists the drugs as trenbolone acetate, testosterone propionate, methandrostenolone and oxymetholone. All are anabolic steroids, in the same restricted category with some barbiturates and considered by the federal government to have potential for abuse, a risk of low to moderate physical dependence and a chance for high psychological dependence.

Jendrejeski says police didn't test Knapp to see if had taken the drugs. Knapp won't discuss them. Ceraso won't say if his defense might weave in the drugs as the explosive that ignited the attack.

"These drugs don't take a mild-mannered person and turn him into a raging monster. They don't turn Clark Kent into a bull," Goldberg said. "But pretty aggressive people can get out of control when they use them. And what happened here was aggressive, a person exhibiting an alpha male response on an unarmed officer ... choking him. ... It doesn't make a lot of sense."

Not to anybody.

Back at North Allegheny, Rankin is nothing but subdued as he hashes through the details.

"It's a sad thing. I feel sorry for the police officer. I feel sorry for Willie Knapp," he said. "I think that, somewhere, Willie just lost his vision of what he wanted to do. Football was a large part of what he wanted to do."
 
BBkingpin said:
"These are substances that could cause heart or liver damage ... or cancer," said Dr. Linn Goldberg, professor of medicine at Oregon Health Sciences University and an expert on anabolic steroids. "And they can make you mad. They can cause uncontrolled aggression."

Expert my ASS! If he were an expert, he would not say that Fina causes cancer or liver damage.



Indeed, campus police are considering whether Knapp's eruption was powered by steroids.

"With steroids, there's a tendency to just snap," campus police Sgt. Leonard Jendrejeski said. "It could have just been the traffic citation that caused it. It could have been all the things totaled together."

They mention in the article that he was an asshole with a short temper before he used steroids. Why would that inbred cop still blame gear?
 
Fuck Knapp. He is obviously an imature idiot and needs to go to jail. What sucks is here is another jerk who can't control his temper. He will blame juice for his actions even though his past history proves it's him not the drugs. This asshole has just made it harder for the rest of us.
 
ROLGOR said:
Fuck Knapp. He is obviously an imature idiot and needs to go to jail. What sucks is here is another jerk who can't control his temper. He will blame juice for his actions even though his past history proves it's him not the drugs. This asshole has just made it harder for the rest of us.

Hit the nail right on the head. Why would anyone feel sorry for this fuck. Cop told him he should wear a seatbelt. I don't think that's cause to choke anyone.:)
 
I agree, what a dick! The cops should have shot his stupid ass. Thats all we need is another immature punk giving the anti-juicers more ammo for their shitty cause.
 
I saw this thread yesterday and I wasn't gonna respond but being an ex police officer, I really never like it when people deem it necessary to call police "pigs" or campus police "rent a cops." No, many of them aren't pefect in your eyes and never will be, but I wonder how you'd feel if that was your brother or father who was being attacked by this irresponsible ex jock who has no business using juice if he can't even control his temper in a non stressful situation. Would you call them pigs too? Just as you do, these men and women also have families and are entitled to come home to them each night as you do with yours.

With that being said, having started off my career as a University Police officer and then moving on to municipal police, I have to ask what individual would become a police officer these days and choose to join a police department which carries nothing but OC spray and a baton? The article said these were the only items that this officer carried. Who in their right mind would make a traffic stop, approach a vehicle unarmed, and then attempt to enforce a law. IMO this department and its officers are asking for trouble. The ex football player should count his blessing because had he done this stupid shit to a county or municipal police officer, you can bet your ass he probably would have been shot.
Unfortunately, this dude won't take responsibility for his actions and will blame it all on his "addiction" to AAS.

Later
Syphon
 
Syphonfilter said:
I saw this thread yesterday and I wasn't gonna respond but being an ex police officer, I really never like it when people deem it necessary to call police "pigs" or campus police "rent a cops." No, many of them aren't pefect in your eyes and never will be, but I wonder how you'd feel if that was your brother or father who was being attacked by this irresponsible ex jock who has no business using juice if he can't even control his temper in a non stressful situation. Would you call them pigs too? Just as you do, these men and women also have families and are entitled to come home to them each night as you do with yours.

With that being said, having started off my career as a University Police officer and then moving on to municipal police, I have to ask what individual would become a police officer these days and choose to join a police department which carries nothing but OC spray and a baton? The article said these were the only items that this officer carried. Who in their right mind would make a traffic stop, approach a vehicle unarmed, and then attempt to enforce a law. IMO this department and its officers are asking for trouble. The ex football player should count his blessing because had he done this stupid shit to a county or municipal police officer, you can bet your ass he probably would have been shot.
Unfortunately, this dude won't take responsibility for his actions and will blame it all on his "addiction" to AAS.

Later
Syphon

He wont blame it on AAS -- his lawyer will! A criminal defense lawyer will use anything available. There is a special place in Hell for them. Also, I don't think he would've attacked an armed officer. BTW, I have cops in the family and think the world of some of them -- but not because they're cops. But cops can be fucking jag-offs. I've had coppers drive me home after pulling me over when I was driving hammered -- in my home town. But then, I've had cops in other cities threaten me with a ticket for not crossing at the intersection ("Does that look like the intersection to you??? You want a ticket??") -- total joke! -- but some just like to push the power that a badge and gun and the threat of prison or fines gives them. It depends on the mentality of the cop. Give a mental midget a gun and a badge and watch what happens.
 
Syphonfilter said:
I saw this thread yesterday and I wasn't gonna respond but being an ex police officer, I really never like it when people deem it necessary to call police "pigs" or campus police "rent a cops." No, many of them aren't pefect in your eyes and never will be, but I wonder how you'd feel if that was your brother or father who was being attacked by this irresponsible ex jock who has no business using juice if he can't even control his temper in a non stressful situation. Would you call them pigs too? Just as you do, these men and women also have families and are entitled to come home to them each night as you do with yours.

Later
Syphon

In my experience of over 10 countries, 30 US states and Canada, police in North America have mostly added to problems instead of resolving them.

I know plenty of good guys that are in law enforcement, but as a group, LEOs are only useful in blatant criminal activity where another person's life liberty or property is in danger. Any other situation, they are useless and mostly assholes.
 
This idiot proves Genars point..natural selection has stoped working....another classic 1 liner...lol...

This idiot deserves to take it up the ass in soem good old quality jail time.....especialy for being so irresponsible as to add to the sterroid propaganda.....either way ..i would give this asshole a sentance and a beating that he would not forget.....
 
this is exactly why they need to get rid of that stupid seat belt law.
too many cops getting strangled and not enough dumbasses going through the windshield head first.

it is a shame to see such horrible things happen to such a nice young man, that Knapp had real class from what that article described.
 
BBkingpin said:


He wont blame it on AAS -- his lawyer will! A criminal defense lawyer will use anything available. There is a special place in Hell for them. Also, I don't think he would've attacked an armed officer. BTW, I have cops in the family and think the world of some of them -- but not because they're cops. But cops can be fucking jag-offs. I've had coppers drive me home after pulling me over when I was driving hammered -- in my home town. But then, I've had cops in other cities threaten me with a ticket for not crossing at the intersection ("Does that look like the intersection to you??? You want a ticket??") -- total joke! -- but some just like to push the power that a badge and gun and the threat of prison or fines gives them. It depends on the mentality of the cop. Give a mental midget a gun and a badge and watch what happens.

I fully can understand your point and I'm not here to argue, what I'm saying is that for someone to call a police officer a pig without ever having met that person, never mind the fact the guy had the balls to get out there in the street and make a traffic stop not wearing a gun or anything else for that matter. I sure as hell would not have gone to work if they told me, "Hey, guess what, you're going on patrol for 8 hours today with no weapons." The debate about good cops and bad cops will go on forever, but I hear far less about the good cops and people are quicker to motherfuck you because of the simple fact that you wear a uniform without ever having see how you operate. You get jaded towards society in general doing this job, hell even being EMS. As far as being a mental midget a badge and gun and watching what happens, that's true, but give that same mental midget great genetics, large muscles, arrogance, and no respect for anyone but themselves, and you have the same person, just no badge and gun.
 
ROLGOR said:
Fuck Knapp. He is obviously an imature idiot and needs to go to jail. What sucks is here is another jerk who can't control his temper. He will blame juice for his actions even though his past history proves it's him not the drugs. This asshole has just made it harder for the rest of us.


I totally agree.
 
Syphonfilter said:


As far as being a mental midget a badge and gun and watching what happens, that's true, but give that same mental midget great genetics, large muscles, arrogance, and no respect for anyone but themselves, and you have the same person, just no badge and gun.

Exactly! So, don't give him a gun and a badge. We are obviously in agreement here. Just wanted to clarify the point being made.
 
2Thick said:


In my experience of over 10 countries, 30 US states and Canada, police in North America have mostly added to problems instead of resolving them.

I know plenty of good guys that are in law enforcement, but as a group, LEOs are only useful in blatant criminal activity where another person's life liberty or property is in danger. Any other situation, they are useless and mostly assholes.


Wow, I didnt know you were a cop in over 10 countries, 30 states, and Canada. You must be 100 years old by now! Oh, you weren't a cop? Just another twit that thinks he knows everything about that profession from watching COPS on TV? How soon we forget 9/11. I'm also so tired of seeing our law enforcement officers chastized by Liberal swine that think they know everything, yet don't know shit about the real world. For all of you that hate the police and are drones of the biased Liberal press, please don't ever call the cops when you need something! My family and friends that I have in law enforcement are some of the best people I have ever met. I sure wouldn't want their job putting up with the sissy bitches that do nothing but ridicule them, but are the first to call them when they need something!
 
Most cops were the fat goofy types that never got a lick of ass in
high school, Im glad that buddy put a woopin on his ass. The thought of the whole incounter puts a smile on my face. Most cops
are rude and have a major attitude. Of course you will meet one in every now and then thats pretty cool. I like the way this guy handled himself.
 
mr jones said:
Most cops were the fat goofy types that never got a lick of ass in
high school, Im glad that buddy put a woopin on his ass. The thought of the whole incounter puts a smile on my face. Most cops
are rude and have a major attitude. Of course you will meet one in every now and then thats pretty cool. I like the way this guy handled himself.

And where is it that you get your stats from?? You must know many of the 600,000 men and women that make up this nation's law enforcement, is that the case? I would bet that the only dealings you've had with police is by being slammed on the ground for being a smart ass. It's dealing with people like you day in and day out that gives many police officers their negative attitudes. The one day that you or any of your family members really need the police just remember your statement you made here, in fact, tell the officer that you love when officers are hurt and killed and that you hope one day they meet the same fate as the hundreds of police who die every year doing a job that you couldn't, wouldn't, and shouldn't do. Oh but I forgot, you're probably an internet tough guy who is invincible and can fight armies with a single hand. Believe me, I've tried to see things from your point of view, after reading your post over and over again, but I just can't stick my head that far up my ass to see it your way.

Sometimes it is better to keep your mouth shut and let everyone think you're smart, than to open your mouth and remove all doubt. Too bad you opened your mouth.
 
tee said:



Wow, I didnt know you were a cop in over 10 countries, 30 states, and Canada. You must be 100 years old by now! Oh, you weren't a cop? Just another twit that thinks he knows everything about that profession from watching COPS on TV? How soon we forget 9/11. I'm also so tired of seeing our law enforcement officers chastized by Liberal swine that think they know everything, yet don't know shit about the real world. For all of you that hate the police and are drones of the biased Liberal press, please don't ever call the cops when you need something! My family and friends that I have in law enforcement are some of the best people I have ever met. I sure wouldn't want their job putting up with the sissy bitches that do nothing but ridicule them, but are the first to call them when they need something!

He did not say that he was a cop in all those countries. .
 
I couldn't imagine being so enragged as that I would go after a cop. talking about serious jailtime for that. "IF" he did have gear in his vehicle, I would have been too freaked that they might find it to get in a rage. Hell, call me a softy...


Whiskey
 
Gun control idiots take note: Had the officer been armed would have Mr Knapp complied and not face some big jail time? If he hadn't he would be dead and rightfully so. If Mr Knapp had been in a fender bender with a citizen, he could have killed somebody. Clorine for the gene pool. He makes life hard for us guys, may his booty spokes roll the odometer in jail.
 
Syphonfilter said:


Believe me, I've tried to see things from your point of view, after reading your post over and over again, but I just can't stick my head that far up my ass to see it your way.

LMFAO!!! As far as you Mr jones you are a fucking moron. Believe me the're are some cops out there who do need and would get they're asses kicked everyday without the badge and gun. The're are also a lot of cops who are good descent people unfortunately the assholes are the ones that leave the lasting impression because they are so disrespectful of the people they deal with. IMO
 
ROLGOR said:
Fuck Knapp. He is obviously an imature idiot and needs to go to jail. What sucks is here is another jerk who can't control his temper. He will blame juice for his actions even though his past history proves it's him not the drugs. This asshole has just made it harder for the rest of us.

Exactly, it's idiots like Knapp that ruin it all for the rest of us, and have made gear use illegal.
 
Syphon, reading this post I see a very obvious thing.

A - This board attracts teenagers.

B - It obvious none of these guys have ever been in a fight themselves, and are trying anything and everything to help their insecurities online by acting like badass'es.

C - Since both A and B are true it seems, they are unable to respect law enforcement.


I won't make any specific replies, because I see stupidity running through the roof. I know it is pointless for me to argue with some of you, simply because you are bitches, and as every guy knows - you can't win a verbal arguement with a bitch! Won't happen, can't happen.

I will however make a few points in one story.

You go shopping at a local 7-11 type store to pick up a bag of chips, a box of condoms, or a 2 liter of Pepsi, whatever. You are paying for it. Two men in ski masks come in, put two bullets in you, take your wallet, and money. They proceed to fire at the clerk. The Clerk is hit three times, but is still breathing. You feel a cold chill run over you body, as you realize one of the bullets hit your liver, and blood is spilling onto the tile. No matter how big you were, no matter how much you could squat, no matter how much shit you could talk online, there you lay, on the ground, dying! Your friend in the car is shitting bricks. The patrol unit two blocks away heard shots fired, and came into the lot. The officer rushes out of the car. You lose feeling in your fingers and toes. You begin to feel light headed. You feel a cold metalic taste in the back of your throat. Who's going to be the first person to put down the men that shot you, not giving a shit whether you lived or died, and get immediate medical attention for you?

A - Your pussy friend in the car, with a pants load of protien bi-product (since he himself is also a badass, juicing, tough guy, who can talk even more shit than you when called upon to do so in a bar).

or

B - The police officer who walks into the situation KNOWING he may end up next to you, but unlike you, be shot in the head and instantly killed. The police officer, the pig, the rent-a-cop, the donut fat ass that didn't get "A lick of ass in high school." Yeah that guy. The guy that came TO the gunshots, and didn't run from them.

WHO IS IT? Who will be there when you REALLY need someone? When you life is almost over and the only thing that can save it is something that takes more courage than your friencd could muster? Who will come to your aid?

Remember, you just got done sitting on elitefitness.com, talking shit about cops, and how lazy they were. Hell he won't help you, right?

Do you want to know how the story ends?

"Patrolmen Jameson opened fire on the suspects. In the exchange of shots fired, officer Jameson was struck 4 times, once in the left shoulder with a .45 caliber round, and 3 times in the left leg by 9mm rounds. Both suspects were killed in the exchange. Officer Jameson immediately called for 3 EMS units, as back up units arrived."

This entire story, and that last quote were taken directly from Public Records in the city of Cleveland, in the State of Ohio, from 11/17/98. The situation occured at 5670 Dension Avenune, Cleveland Ohio - in the second district. The man's friend who was still in the car as the backup units arrived, signed a complete statement as to the events as they occured. Two, loaded, 9mm semi-automatic pistols were found in that mans car.

In other words, the guys friend had two guns, and did nothing about it. The Patrol officer had one weapon, was struck four times, and saved this man's life. This type of situation could have happened to any one of you. Think how many times you've stopped at a 7-11 type store, even in only the afternoon. It happens, it's domestic terror.

Having shared that little story, I will let you go on with your bickering, and your hard ass talk, and your tough guy comments. I know that you won't sit back and think about if you were the one laying there, would one of your friends get shot once, let alone four times, to have just a chance of saving your life? No, that's to much to ask you guys to think about. After all, we are at elitefitness.com. It's the internet baby, we can talk all the shit we want. Fuck yeah! Fuck those pigs! Fuck those donut eating motherfuckers in the ass!

Let's hope that you never are the one laying on the ground, wondering if you will be living, or if you will be dying... hoping that one of those fatass, no pussy getting pigs, comes to put himself in great harm, to have just the slimest chance of saving your hardass-smartass, tough guy life.

If that ever does happen though, be sure to tell them what you think of them while they are taking bullets for you, and while they are busy calling for emergency medical units to come rush you to the nearest hospital. Because after all - cops are the enemy, right?
 
Last edited:
tee said:



Wow, I didnt know you were a cop in over 10 countries, 30 states, and Canada. You must be 100 years old by now! Oh, you weren't a cop? Just another twit that thinks he knows everything about that profession from watching COPS on TV? How soon we forget 9/11. I'm also so tired of seeing our law enforcement officers chastized by Liberal swine that think they know everything, yet don't know shit about the real world. For all of you that hate the police and are drones of the biased Liberal press, please don't ever call the cops when you need something! My family and friends that I have in law enforcement are some of the best people I have ever met. I sure wouldn't want their job putting up with the sissy bitches that do nothing but ridicule them, but are the first to call them when they need something!

I used to be a federal LEO you miscreant. Yeah, you almost made sense for a minute.
 
Richard_Riddick said:
Syphon, reading this post I see a very obvious thing.

A - This board attracts teenagers.

B - It obvious none of these guys have ever been in a fight themselves, and are trying anything and everything to help their insecurities online by acting like badass'es.

C - Since both A and B are true it seems, they are unable to respect law enforcement.


I won't make any specific replies, because I see stupidity running through the roof. I know it is pointless for me to argue with some of you, simply because you are bitches, and as every guy knows - you can't win a verbal arguement with a bitch! Won't happen, can't happen.

I will however make a few points in one story.

You go shopping at a local 7-11 type store to pick up a bag of chips, a box of condoms, or a 2 liter of Pepsi, whatever. You are paying for it. Two men in ski masks come in, put two bullets in you, take your wallet, and money. They proceed to fire at the clerk. The Clerk is hit three times, but is still breathing. You feel a cold chill run over you body, as you realize one of the bullets hit your liver, and blood is spilling onto the tile. No matter how big you were, no matter how much you could squat, no matter how much shit you could talk online, there you lay, on the ground, dying! Your friend in the car is shitting bricks. The patrol unit two blocks away heard shots fired, and came into the lot. The officer rushes out of the car. You lose feeling in your fingers and toes. You begin to feel light headed. You feel a cold metalic taste in the back of your throat. Who's going to be the first person to put down the men that shot you, not giving a shit whether you lived or died, and get immediate medical attention for you?

A - Your pussy friend in the car, with a pants load of protien bi-product (since he himself is also a badass, juicing, tough guy, who can talk even more shit than you when called upon to do so in a bar).

or

B - The police officer who walks into the situation KNOWING he may end up next to you, but unlike you, be shot in the head and instantly killed. The police officer, the pig, the rent-a-cop, the donut fat ass that didn't get "A lick of ass in high school." Yeah that guy. The guy that came TO the gunshots, and didn't run from them.

WHO IS IT? Who will be there when you REALLY need someone? When you life is almost over and the only thing that can save it is something that takes more courage than your friencd could muster? Who will come to your aid?

Remember, you just got done sitting on elitefitness.com, talking shit about cops, and how lazy they were. Hell he won't help you, right?

Do you want to know how the story ends?

"Patrolmen Jameson opened fire on the suspects. In the exchange of shots fired, officer Jameson was struck 4 times, once in the left shoulder with a .45 caliber round, and 3 times in the left leg by 9mm rounds. Both suspects were killed in the exchange. Officer Jameson immediately called for 3 EMS units, as back up units arrived."

This entire story, and that last quote were taken directly from Public Records in the city of Cleveland, in the State of Ohio, from 11/17/98. The situation occured at 5670 Dension Avenune, Cleveland Ohio - in the second district. The man's friend who was still in the car as the backup units arrived, signed a complete statement as to the events as they occured. Two, loaded, 9mm semi-automatic pistols were found in that mans car.

In other words, the guys friend had two guns, and did nothing about it. The Patrol officer had one weapon, was struck four times, and saved this man's life. This type of situation could have happened to any one of you. Think how many times you've stopped at a 7-11 type store, even in only the afternoon. It happens, it's domestic terror.

Having shared that little story, I will let you go on with your bickering, and your hard ass talk, and your tough guy comments. I know that you won't sit back and think about if you were the one laying there, would one of your friends get shot once, let alone four times, to have just a chance of saving your life? No, that's to much to ask you guys to think about. After all, we are at elitefitness.com. It's the internet baby, we can talk all the shit we want. Fuck yeah! Fuck those pigs! Fuck those donut eating motherfuckers in the ass!

Let's hope that you never are the one laying on the ground, wondering if you will be living, or if you will be dying... hoping that one of those fatass, no pussy getting pigs, comes to put himself in great harm, to have just the slimest chance of saving your hardass-smartass, tough guy life.

If that ever does happen though, be sure to tell them what you think of them while they are taking bullets for you, and while they are busy calling for emergency medical units to come rush you to the nearest hospital. Because after all - cops are the enemy, right?

Nobody's talking about the hypothetical hero you just conjured up. People on this thread are criticizing the cops who act like tough guys toward people who didn't hurt anyone and aren't deserving of that treatment. You dont have to treat someone like an asshole because they aren't wearing a seat belt! Also, as to your little story you wrote, the person is usually dead before the cops are even called. Why do they wait for back up for a routine traffic stop these days?? Most cops don't throw their lives into jeopardy. How many heroes are there really????? Most people (cops or otherwise) wont take on a big guy or a tough guy. But if a pussy gets out of line, whack!!!! Same with cops. Throw them into the ghetto and they drive around all night with their windows rolled up until they get a call and then they wait until 3 or more squad cars arrive for back-up. Just because a person has a badge doesn't make them brave. Brave people or heroes were born that way or like that before they became cops. And just like the rest of society, those kinds of people are few and far between. A police uniform doesn't turn someone into Superman.
 
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WOW - if that is the average intelligence of a member of this board, I see why you guys have so many registered users, yet so few active members.

I only read the first sentence and the last sentence in your obviously vastly intellectual scripture there, but I can tell by it's premise that you fit into both A and B categories.
 
R_R- I respect you bro, so I am not going to get in a pissing match with you. But since you gave a heroic example, let me also show an example of the other side of the coin.

Me, my cousin, and two girls were leaving a nightclub in the city of Baltimore. The parking lot outside broke out in fights. As we were getting into our car to leave, a group of guys tried to rob us for our money. Since me and my cousin refused to give it to him, one pulled a gun on me, while another one beat my cousin with a club. They proceeded to smash the windows of the car, until me and my cousin were able to jump in the car and the girls peeled away. BTW, In the meantime, there was two cops across the street watching too damn scared to help. When we went to them for help, they just made us follow them to the station for a statement. During this time they were complete assholes to us, the victims. Some cops are heroic, and some are assholes. I never have committed a violent crime, yet I have been treated like shit many times by cops. Too many cops get a boner from the feeling of power over you. But yeah, many cops are OK
 
Richard_Riddick said:
WOW - if that is the average intelligence of a member of this board, I see why you guys have so many registered users, yet so few active members.

I only read the first sentence and the last sentence in your obviously vastly intellectual scripture there, but I can tell by it's premise that you fit into both A and B categories.

Sorry about the profanity. I took it out. I didn't read your post fully until now. My dad took a bullet in the knee and his partner took two in his arm and side and they killed the assailant, pumping him with 7 bullets between them. This is taken from the police dept citation. They were both hospitalized and my dad's partner was lucky the bullet (.32 cal) did not hit his heart. They first saw the guy and his friend going into a bar at closing and follwed him in there. He was arguing with the bartender and they took him out of the bar. Outside, the man opened fire and struck both my dad and partner. His friend hid in a doorway. It turned out that the man was out on parole for armed robbery and the commander stated that the people in the bar owed the 2 cops a lot because a parolee doesn't carry a gun unless he intends to use it because if they are otherwise caught with it, they lock them up and throw away the key. I know that most cops have never even fired their guns. My dad is one of the exceptions. So, don't use cops like my dad and this Officer Jameson as examples of the typical cop.
 
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BBkingpin said:


Nobody's talking about the hypothetical hero you just conjured up. People on this thread are criticizing the cops who act like tough guys toward people who didn't hurt anyone and aren't deserving of that treatment. You dont have to treat someone like an asshole because they aren't wearing a seat belt! Also, as to your little story you wrote, the person is usually dead before the cops are even called. Why do they wait for back up for a routine traffic stop these days?? Most cops don't throw their lives into jeopardy. How many heroes are there really????? Most people (cops or otherwise) wont take on a big guy or a tough guy. But if a pussy gets out of line, whack!!!! Same with cops. Throw them into the ghetto and they drive around all night with their windows rolled up until they get a call and then they wait until 3 or more squad cars arrive for back-up. Just because a person has a badge doesn't make them brave. Brave people or heroes were born that way or like that before they became cops. And just like the rest of society, those kinds of people are few and far between. A police uniform doesn't turn someone into Superman.


You've been civil so far BBkingpin so I will reply in kind. First off, you're wrong: "People in this thread are criticizing cops who act like tough guys........" No, people in this thread as in any other thread that concerns police are rushing in to say fuck the police, fuck the pigs, he deserved it. None of us were there and know exactly what transpired between the two, but I can tell you that University Police as a whole are not aggressive people as it is highly discouraged by the higher ups. Where did the article say the officer acted like an asshole. I've walked up to cars that I stopped for running red lights and I've asked "Is there any reason you didn't stop for the red light?" Does that make me an asshole? Because I don't smile am I an asshole? Do you know how many times before I could even get out the words, Hello I'm officer so and so .....that I was met with "What the hell are you stopping me for?!!" or how many times someone has jumped out of a car and ran at me, scaring the living shit outta me, or bent forward while driving before pulling over making me wonder what they are reaching for.

True, the person may already be dead, but who is it who comes in and clears the building not knowing whether or not anyone is still there waiting to ambush them. Waiting for back up on a "routine" traffic stop? I hardly believe this to be true. Neither I, nor the tons of other officers I knew and know, waited for back up before approaching a vehicle on a simple traffic stop. However, you aren't taking into account several things: time of day, location of the traffic stop, how many people are in a car, is the license plate showing a hit for criminal activity. Is there something wrong with waiting for back up? No, there isn't. No, most cops won't throw their lives into jeapordy, they do that enough simply by wearing a uniform and going to work as many people simply don't like them because of that uniform and wouldn't hesitate to kill or hurt them. Saying that most cops won't take on a "big or tough guy" is somewhat vague. Our job isn't to "take on" people. This isn't boxing, it's not UFC, this is life. Who constitutes a tough guy? The small Asian dude in the pool hall? or the big bodybuilder in the club? Every single cop I've known wouldn't hesitate when the chips were down to go toe to toe with someone who may be their better, it is/was our job. The one officer I knew who froze up in a situation was told to never come on my scene again. What is it you want from a police officer, do you want them to cater to your every need and be superhuman, because I hate to break it to you, they can't and they aren't. As far as driving around in a ghetto at night with the windows rolled up I say to you, So what. What do windows up or down have to do with anything, why bother making traffic stops in high crime areas because no one should be told what to do right? Wear your seat belt, signal your turns, put on your headlights, etc., etc. And as far as waiting for "3" other cars to show up for back up on calls, again, so what. In the ghetto as in everywhere else, there's safety in numbers, especially when you go in an environment where you're not wanted, but you go anways. What's wrong with relying on the people you work with so that you can go home after your shift? Nothing
You are right without even knowing what you're saying. A badge doesn't make you brave, so you're forgetting, these men and women aren't superhuman, they are simply human who put themselves in a position of danger every day yet at the same time, you and others out there like you expect them to be superman and that it's okay if they get their asses beat. Your attitude comes across as such that you expect police officers to have no fear of anything. If this is the case then I feel sorry for you, for to fear is simply to be human, to have no fear is simply to be stupid and a death scene waiting to happen. If I ever met a police officer in my life who said they didn't fear a thing, he is a police officer who I would not count on for anything and would stay away from. With that being said, if you aren't able to set that fear aside while doing this job then you should find another career. So in a sense, you are right, "a police uniform doesn't turn someone into Superman" but 90% of these men and women who go out in the streets every day are supermen and women because they put up with everyone else's judgement about them, all the criticizing, all the hate, and they do it day in and day out knowing that the 10% of police officers that don't give a shit about the job are the ones everyone on these internet sites are lumping them in with.
 
Okay, I read the whole thing. We could go on and on about the virtues of the job and those that give it a bad name. And, let's not forget the civilian who is an asshole after the cop is being polite. Some cops are good cops and some are bad and some are just showing up for a pay check. A final example. I had a good friend in high school and college. We did not go to school together but hung out. He was never in a fight in his life. He was still my friend. It did not matter. I was a boxer and pretty good. I had no atitude and was friends with everyone. Both our dads were cops. He became a cop and all of a sudden he was a different person. Big attitude and now always argumentative. He wanted the safest district in the city and got it. He brags about how he and his partner take turns taking naps in parking lots until they have to respond. Then he berates another cop we both knew (that worked the same district as my friend) for requesting and getting a transfer to a rough district -- by coincidence, the same one my dad got shot in. It's not an easy job but it has its advantages. Some work harder than others. I didn't mean the officer that approached this kid Knapp was an asshole. I meant that a lot of times police will stop someone -- not this idiot Knapp -- and, if it's for a seat belt, how can you not be pissed off. Then you wait 20 minutes pulled over on the side of the road while more squads pull up and everyone drives by and you look like a criminal. It isn't necessary. One time at school I got pulled over for an out of state license plate. Some cops just pull anyone over and use the pretextual stop sanctioned by the U.S. Supreme Court. They don't respect anyone's privacy and then go looking in your car, asking people if they can look in the trunk, knowing full well they have no right w/o a warrant but also knowing that 9 out of 10 law-abiding civilians do not know there rights or are unsure and will fail to assert them. Some cops INFURIATE me -- notwithstanding all of the arguments that can be made for how rough their job can be.
 
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Ok, you're right, this can go on and on, and I love a good debate, but I don't spend my life on the net, although it seems these days much of it is spent here or elsewhere. Yes, being a police officer does change you, it doesn't matter how good at boxing you are, or how much of a fighter you weren't in high school. Wearing a badge and a gun and uniform will change a person because if they don't learn to change just a bit, to become harder than average, they will be eaten alive. Your "friend" who falls asleep and brags about it is a police officer I have no respect for. Have we all fallen asleep on a slow shift on nights, probably so, I know I have. Most don't make a habit of it though. I'm gonna guess that you're dad had a pretty long career in law enforcement and I would bet, that although he is your father, he probably pissed some people off on the street at one point or another in his career maybe even for pulling someone over for a seatbelt violation, but now ask yourself, do I think my father would have deserved to have been beaten senseless, killed, or crippled over someone else's perceived notion of being "rude?" Probably not. The two greatest moments in my short five year career as a police officer were, 1) the children who waved at me and smiled as I drove by and 2) the people who walked up to me at my dinner and said "I'm sorry to bother you, but just wanted to say thank you for the job you do." Totally blew me away and made me glad that I chose to do that job. My guard dropped for that moment and I felt appreciated for once. I can say that not one of my supervisors ever made me feel like that.

Some will never understand and some will choose not to. And of course, no-one will ever like the police. Always said I shoulda been a firefighter.
 
what else did he have in his car?... a coke or candy bar?....just because he got pissed they assume it is the reason, what if he was simply in a pissed off mood
 
Well, like I have said on another board (since I went to multiple boards about this post) - there are good cops, there are not-so-good (bad?) cops. There is no racial barrier, they all are a mix. There are some cops that show up every day for the rush (which makes them very likely to lay it on the line, and do their best), there's others who show up because they feel being a cop, and protecting the innocent will make up for some form of lifetime guilt they've had, and there's others who want to feel like god, and want a paycheck on a regular basis. (I'd guess about 20-30% fall into the I wanna be god area.)

70-90% of the people I run into, not only onilne, but in person, talks shit about the cops. (normally they don't know what I do until after they are in handcuffs for selling coc, or crystal meth) However, a cop is more likely to put it all out there when called upon, to possibly save your life in a situation that requires someone step up to the plate, than the average guy who might be walking past that 7-11, or where ever.

Also, I've never met a guy on the straight and narrow of the law (pays his taxes, obeys the traffic laws, pays his bills) that has said "A cop beat the shit out of me," or "The cop treated me so badly I should have got out of the car and kicked his ass." Normally, in the first 45 seconds of a traffic stop (since it applies here), if you show the cop "Hey, I'm human, I may not think I did it, but I'll handle that in court. You just do your job, and Ill do mine." and treat them with the same level of respect, they will normally be 100% cool with you. Do you realize, when a police officer first approaches a vehicles, that he is SCARED SHITLESS OF YOU?!?! Especially if it's a night stop on a remote highway. He respects you to the point that he respect your ability to seriously fuck him up. Therefore, he has what the average person see's as an "Attitude," while in actuality, he just is trying to figure out if you are going to try to cause him harm.

I'm glad to see that Syphon and BB have kissed and made up though.... now stop that homosexual shit out guys!:D I'm kidding of course.... you are permitted to pursue your sex lives privately.......... (it's a joke!)
 
hey rick, do you think one day the general public is going to accept steriods? Dont waste your time on that crusade bro. If
you dont see the humor in a huge roid head whipping a cops
ass for telling him to put on a seat belt.....Well mabey Im just
a twisted dude.
 
mr jones said:
hey rick, do you think one day the general public is going to accept steriods? Dont waste your time on that crusade bro. If
you dont see the humor in a huge roid head whipping a cops
ass for telling him to put on a seat belt.....Well mabey Im just
a twisted dude.

No, he doesn't see the humor in it, nor do I. Nor do I see the humor if you were to get your ass whooped by someone larger than you, which is probably very likely. What I do see is one of two things: A) You like to get a rise from your comments or B) You're the by-product of a bad acid trip your parents took back in the day.
 
Syphon, I got just two things to say to you.

"It's all good" and "Break off nigga before I fade ya assssss."

:D

And no mr jones, I don't find any humor in that. In fact, if you want to turn the tables, I find about as much humor in that as I would in a police officer shotting (but not killing) an unarmed man for no reason. Basicly, I find it sick, twisted, disgusting, and really fucking stupid.
 
Syphon, I also find humor in guys talking smack behind computer screens......but anyway sorry you guys dont think its funny, more laughs for me. In the mean time dont forget to give your friendly
neighborhood cop a big hug. Im not going to get into a debate about this. I just thought the whole mental picture was funny.
 
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