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Can winny aromitize to estrogen? Even at a high dose?
- Thread starter ajc
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No,it is chemically impossible.Aromitase cannot fit into its particular structure...If anything you may be getting some P/R stimulation from the deca....
Winstrol is extremely mild, as you already know.StANOZOLOL IS INCAPABLE OF AROMITIZATION....
About the chest shaving, the hair is growing back now and it might be the hair around the nipple that feels itchy. I had the same thing happen a few months back. i was freaking out...lol..
As for Deca and progesterone, it is only a theory.
I say that deca induces estrogen and not progesterone so 300kleen could be correct.
As for Deca and progesterone, it is only a theory.
I say that deca induces estrogen and not progesterone so 300kleen could be correct.
ajc-It is an individualistic response...It works great for some,in others the progestins seem to overpower it...It all depends on each individuals receptor binding capacities....In some users the progestins bind much more aggressively than the stanozolol metabolites,and they still get activation of P/R's...
LOL @2Thick...Would you like to explain to me what basis you've arrived at this conclusion on?Stanozolol lacks the carbon structure for aromitase to bind to,this is simple scientific FACT,I'm curious how you think this can be overridden....
Okay,now I hear you...His original question was does it aromitize,and my answer was no,which I think you and I agree on...As for test/estrogen levels coming from an indirect route,that is possible...Just want to make sure no one starts believing that stanozolol metabolites bind with aromitase directly,converting into estrogen,because that would be just plain false....
ajc
New member
2Thick said:
Actually, I only did 300mg the first week and immediately changed my mind, so I jumped it up to 400mg. I wasn't going to taper down, but I've changed my mind.
I'm going to do 300mg this week, 300 next week (week 8), 200mg week 9, and 100mg on week 10...then I'll start a primo bridge at 200-300mg week for 6 or 7 weeks and then I'll go off for a while.
It may just be from the hair growing back, but I'm not counting on that to be the case.
ajc said:
It is sweet to see someone listen to my advice
Seriously, keep an eye out for other symptoms because it is the aggregate of symptoms that point towards gyno and not necessarily one or two.
Why are you bridging then taking a break? Clen would do the same thing.
METHYL MIKE
New member
OH I SEE_when one of us NORMAL folk post a question, we get a bunch of shit answers with a little help from you more knowledgeable bros, but when someone like ajc posts, all you gurus go fucking apeshit. Damn it sucks to be an "amateur bber".
ORGANON CANON
New member
HUCKLEBERRY FINNaplex said:
This is 100% correct. Winny can't convert into estro, it's impossible. I'm running 1g a week of winny right now (not 'cause I'm mad at my liver) and I am gyno prone. I have nothing, not even an itch. It's obviously the deca. Are you close to the end of your cycle?
ajc
New member
2Thick said:
It is sweet to see someone listen to my advice
Seriously, keep an eye out for other symptoms because it is the aggregate of symptoms that point towards gyno and not necessarily one or two.
Why are you bridging then taking a break? Clen would do the same thing.
I guess it's not really a bridge. The reason I'm using the primo is to get me through this summer without losing hardness or size.
CYPRIOSQUATS
New member
I was about tot say the same thing as mike. I think every post should be you guys shooting the shit. That is how i learn shit.
METHYL MIKE
New member
cut down on the Deca ASAP
AJC, i don't intend to come between the 4 of you (the four muscetiers, LOL). But if i where you, i would stop with the Deca ASAP. In fact i had the same problem 2 years ago, and almost gave away the last 4 Norma Deca's in my possesion. Traded them for some Clenburerol (Spiropent).
So for me, never ever Deca again. Sorry 2Thick, i know how you like Deca. But not everybody react the same on it.
AJC, i don't intend to come between the 4 of you (the four muscetiers, LOL). But if i where you, i would stop with the Deca ASAP. In fact i had the same problem 2 years ago, and almost gave away the last 4 Norma Deca's in my possesion. Traded them for some Clenburerol (Spiropent).
So for me, never ever Deca again. Sorry 2Thick, i know how you like Deca. But not everybody react the same on it.
METHYL MIKE
New member
I agree jeff-some people, like decaman, make some awesome gains off it, but then some people are like my roomate. He recently ran 400 milligrams every week for 6 weeks and didnt gain anything-no size, strength, fat loss etc. Also he had some bad libido problems, which i helped him clear up with a few amps of sten. Now, obviously everyone is different, but i think deca really isnt that great of a drug, unless youre some weird freakish mutant and gain 20 pounds off a deca only cycle!!
"Because it raises your natural testosterone....unless I am mistaken.... I am talking about inducing estro production not converting to estro."
UMMM...2THICK, how is 50mg of Winstrol ED + 400mg of DECA per week gonna increase endogenous test levels? AJC is essentially suppressed at these levels, and since stanazolol does not aromatize, the only possibility is Nandrolone converting to estrogen (which is low), combined with it's possible progestagenic activity (it is a 19-nortest).
UMMM...2THICK, how is 50mg of Winstrol ED + 400mg of DECA per week gonna increase endogenous test levels? AJC is essentially suppressed at these levels, and since stanazolol does not aromatize, the only possibility is Nandrolone converting to estrogen (which is low), combined with it's possible progestagenic activity (it is a 19-nortest).
S
Stew Meat
Guest
2Thick said:
Come on, Thick, you know better than this... surely.
AJC asked if Winny could aromitise at high dossages. And you tell him yes but not at those dossages...
Huck, you were on the money... Winny is not capable of aromitization at any dossage.
And so you say Winny will raise natural test... please let me in on your logic behind that one. AR have a higher affinity toward winny than natural test. Therefore the testosterone that is being produced will not have as many free receptors to bind with and therefore will leave more in circulation to bind to receptors in the hypothalamus and cause a feedback response which will shut down testosterone production... also, as I understand it, stanazolol will also bind directly to the hypothalamus androgen receptors causing shutdown of natural testosterone... Explain yourself please...
BTW, the pyramid technique is old school... I don't understand why you keep advising people to do this. Deca will taper itself. Stop at the last and highest dose. It's going to take 3-4 weeks before its levels are low enough to allow natural hormone production to resume. Tapering at the end will only keep a low level of exogenous hormone in the system which is not high enough to increase anabolism, but is low enough to delay the onset of the HPTA. This will result in greater risk of loosing gains post cycle as the longer natural hormone production is suppressed, the longer it takes for it to resume. One shoud NEVER taper anything that is going to take longer than 12 days to clear the system. This includes high dosses with enthanate.
-Stew
S
Stew Meat
Guest
Peech, you can't always trust those little write ups. But that one happens to be an accurate description.
-Stew
-Stew
Magic11----Alot of people had the same results from some of the Jurox winny----Someone did a test on it and it was test suspension----I read a post awhile back where some dude gave his girlfriend some and she gained 12 pounds and had alot of water----And the fact that it stung real bad----Your shit was suspension.
can you drink the Winny?
Talking about Winstrol oral and Winny V is nice, but aren't we forgetting something, lik Winstrol Depot Zambon. The Rolls Royce amonst the Winny's.
If the oral is bad for the liver, so is the injectable when drinking it. Yeah, i know, i should keep my mouth shut.
Talking about Winstrol oral and Winny V is nice, but aren't we forgetting something, lik Winstrol Depot Zambon. The Rolls Royce amonst the Winny's.
If the oral is bad for the liver, so is the injectable when drinking it. Yeah, i know, i should keep my mouth shut.
Peeches said:yes, that I did! Sorry, but that's what I learned. If you want to drink winny, why not go with the winstrol V tabs? Orals are harsh on your liver, but that's why they make milk thistle to protect you. I'm just stating what I learned about drinking winny.... Peech (can we close this can of worms now?
The can cannot be closed.....
I agree, I think people should inject...
I guess what I mean is:
If you have a bottle of winny and a bottle of tabs, they are both 17aa, so why would a liquid orally be not as effective as a tab?
The liquid I am talking about is vet grade stana by RWR here in Australia.
Blonski
POP THAT CAN!!! Worms, worm and more worms!!!!
If you have a bottle of winny and a bottle of tabs, they are both 17aa, so why would a liquid orally be not as effective as a tab?
The liquid I am talking about is vet grade stana by RWR here in Australia.
Blonski
POP THAT CAN!!! Worms, worm and more worms!!!!
Peeches said:yes, that I did! Sorry, but that's what I learned. If you want to drink winny, why not go with the winstrol V tabs? Orals are harsh on your liver, but that's why they make milk thistle to protect you. I'm just stating what I learned about drinking winny.... Peech (can we close this can of worms now?
Sorry, but I have to flame this.
25% loss BWAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!
By injecting Stanozolol you omitt ONE PASS
by the liver. This translates to about a
3-7% loss MAX.
And 2Thick, please on't tell me you actually agree
with 25% because thats just ludicrous.
Godspeed
"I meant estrogen levels....you know that...."
2THICK, I am still confused. Please elaborate on your statement:
"Because it raises your natural testosterone....unless I am mistaken.... I am talking about inducing estro production not converting to estro"
What raises your natural test levels? What is inducing estrogen production?
2THICK, I am still confused. Please elaborate on your statement:
"Because it raises your natural testosterone....unless I am mistaken.... I am talking about inducing estro production not converting to estro"
What raises your natural test levels? What is inducing estrogen production?
In regards to winny losing 25% of its potency, I don't know how true this is, but I know that MS/RETRO has stated reading this in a study. She is pretty bright and I would not go upon calling her a liar, so i'll take her word for it. BUT, if this is true, then all one would have to do is add liquid to counterbalance the difference. I am still a big believer in drinking the winny as opposed to injecting it and causing that much scar tissue damage any day of the week, even if one has to add hormone to make-up the minute difference. Plus, there is no real chance for abscess and inj. pain. I know MS has tried to find that study but to my knowledge has not been able to find it again. Therefore, if anyone knows of this study please post it here or E-mail me of its reference so I can pull it. This will be a great study to pull for future reference. Thanks!
MR. BMJ
"THE INTIMIDATOR"
MR. BMJ
"THE INTIMIDATOR"
There is no difference between the pills and the liquid except for their physical states. If the 25% thing is true about the loss of hormone, it will happen not only to the liquid but also the pill forms as they are the same. The 25% thing I am assuming on because it has been mentioned by a knowledgeable person that I trust with facts and info. Whether or not it is true or not, I don't know, and yes, some studies can be wrong, so right now I am just assuming all this until I see the study. Therefore, if it is true, you would also have to add more of the pill form to also make-up for the difference in loss. Hope I made sense. If the 25% thing is not true, then of course none of this will matter much.
MR. BMJ
MR. BMJ
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