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can guys really make this much progress in one year natrually?

I would guess not .


Brad.
 
that gyno looks like it "could" be teenage gyno. Do i think he is natural? Not for a second.
BUT....IF he is, then a) he has great genetics, b) he eats like a horse
also c) training at defrancos gives him the best chance to make those kind of gains if he is ever gonna. That place is fucking nuts. Cushing's training is ungodly intense.
 
how did he even get rid of that gyno in a year? The second pic is kind of hard to tell if he still has it or not, but it doesn't look like he does. And people would probably know about it if he had it surgically removed.........is there some wonder cream out there now floating around for that?
 
I can say this much, When I was younger I was able to gain weight and mass just by doing push ups here and there... my body gained muscle that easy for some odd reason... so I think that he could be natty
 
Those front delts and traps... that's some serious juice right there, the muscle looks too mature for someone who wouldn't be juicing.
 
Sure it's possible. That doesn't mean he did it that way.

He's a 24 year old athlete with a great coach. Why not? Once I revamped my training, supplementation, and diet I gained 20 pounds of muscle in one year, drug free, at age 38.

I recently had a client ask me what stack I used before I took a certain picture that was on a website. I told him I'd never taken a steroid in my life up until that time. I think he got a little pissed. lol

We're all a little jaded by the lies and exaggerations. But that doesn't mean it can't be done. In many ways, I've seen guys progress BETTER while training naturally than guys who were juicing. That's because they worked harder and the guys using gear didn;t know what the fuck they were doing and just let the drugs give them the results -- which they promptly lost.

When it comes to professional sports though, I imagine they're all going to use whatever advantage they can.
 
here is an early pic of him obviously through puberty. Obviously no gyno. Now teh pics that red showed in college with the gyno. I think the answer is pretty evident.
fbjk2d.jpg
 
now that I look more into the pic at the bottom, this dude is not really that big... the only one ware he looks like his size is up is in the top pic
 
lolololol.
urban active is alright.

competitive edge in avon lake used to be my Godsend but now it's closed.

Best gym i've ever been to. Drew lindsay was the freakin' man!
 
A co-worker of mine had the best genetics I ever saw...young kid 23yo 6-4 250. He used to play football at a major university but he quit..I think it was in Florida somewhere. Comparing the 2 I can honestly say this kid in the pics here is def juiced like I said in my other post. My co-worker was big but didnt have any major muscles bulging out like the front delts or anything...and when he cut down to 225 he was shredded....fuck in a,,,I wish I had his genetics not to mention that he was just strong naturally.

SO it is posibble to be genetically big and strong ...hell yea but the difference is that even if my co-worker stopped lifting which he did from time to time, he was still big and relativbely lean and not shrink like this kid in the pics...that's the difference.
 
Varga said:
A co-worker of mine had the best genetics I ever saw...young kid 23yo 6-4 250. He used to play football at a major university but he quit..I think it was in Florida somewhere. Comparing the 2 I can honestly say this kid in the pics here is def juiced like I said in my other post. My co-worker was big but didnt have any major muscles bulging out like the front delts or anything...and when he cut down to 225 he was shredded....fuck in a,,,I wish I had his genetics not to mention that he was just strong naturally.

SO it is posibble to be genetically big and strong ...hell yea but the difference is that even if my co-worker stopped lifting which he did from time to time, he was still big and relativbely lean and not shrink like this kid in the pics...that's the difference.
Click to expand...

Yeah all that bulging muscles doesn't really go together with "natural"
 
He looks totally natural to me, shows what a good diet dialed in will do for you.


RADAR
 
Not even Reg Park or Steeve Reeves had that kind of bulging front delts with all those years of training, show me pics proving me wrong!
 
cush was a beast at bergen catholic and the rumors from teammates and opponents was he was geared to the teeth. training with joe d. does make miracles happen, but not like that. and joe d. is vehimently against aas use. hes a bigtime natural lifter.
 
I love a juice board discussing the use of AAS in college athletes. I wish when I was in college I could have had training like he does! Good luck to him!
 
not sure if that's gyno or not.. but i'm glad his chest fat is gone..

and .. um..
no he can't do it naturally..

think about the amount of food he'd have to eat while on to do that growth..

now think about how much he'd have to eat doing it naturally..

that's why i say he was on..
 
Nelson Montana said:
Sure it's possible. That doesn't mean he did it that way.

He's a 24 year old athlete with a great coach. Why not? Once I revamped my training, supplementation, and diet I gained 20 pounds of muscle in one year, drug free, at age 38.

I recently had a client ask me what stack I used before I took a certain picture that was on a website. I told him I'd never taken a steroid in my life up until that time. I think he got a little pissed. lol

We're all a little jaded by the lies and exaggerations. But that doesn't mean it can't be done. In many ways, I've seen guys progress BETTER while training naturally than guys who were juicing. That's because they worked harder and the guys using gear didn;t know what the fuck they were doing and just let the drugs give them the results -- which they promptly lost.

When it comes to professional sports though, I imagine they're all going to use whatever advantage they can.
Click to expand...


This is absolutely true!! I didn't start using steroids until I was almost fifty. I looked as good as this guy, the picture of him doing the farmers walk, when I was in my twenties. It's like Arnold said, "steroids help you maybe ten percent. The rest is hard work." What kills me is all the first timers on here that write out their cycle and ask "How much do you think I will gain?" This has got to be the stupidest question I have seen on this forum and it comes up over and over again. It's not what you put into your body it what you put out with your body.
 
I really dont get it why some of you think that this so called "special training" will get anyone ready for the NFL..lol
It's all about our bodies ability to adapt and grow in ways we want to grow or most likely will not grow the way we want them to grow...and if the hormons are not there you will die trying...reagrdless of food, sleep or special training you may receive.

Why do you think ppl take steroids...if it could have been done naturally no one in their right mind would be interested in steroids but that's not the case as we all know!
Very few ppl have the genetics and hormonal output to make big gains...very few. Most of us cheat..lol
 
Varga said:
I really dont get it why some of you think that this so called "special training" will get anyone ready for the NFL..lol
It's all about our bodies ability to adapt and grow in ways we want to grow or most likely will not grow the way we want them to grow...and if the hormons are not there you will die trying...reagrdless of food, sleep or special training you may receive.

Why do you think ppl take steroids...if it could have been done naturally no one in their right mind would be interested in steroids but that's not the case as we all know!
Very few ppl have the genetics and hormonal output to make big gains...very few. Most of us cheat..lol
Click to expand...


"special training"? have a little respect for defranco. dude would run circles around you in the gym without aas and then be able to explain why describing every motor unit that was used. the "special training" gets these guys prepared to blow up the combine and pro days. check his track record of guys hes prepared. flawless. until you have even the slightest clue who you are insulting, keep your ridiculous LOL'S to yourself.
 
judging by the two pictures I would have to say I believe him to juice. I mean come on if you were going to the nfl why wouldn't you take everything in your power to do so? Come on guys...
 
He obviously was on the juice in high school than got off for a while(in the gyno pic) and then went back on(in the last pic).
 
"

It is difficult if not impossible to make a clinical diagnosis with only remote visual inspection, but based on the pictures I have seen I would be curious to see what his HgH levels are. Not just because HgH does not show up on the test panels they currently run for PEDs, but because of what I see as symptomatic acromegaly. HgH often causes the lower jaw and hands to continue growing, even in post pubescent adults with mature growth plates.

Again, not conclusive, but the gynecomastia and acromegaly are legitimate symptoms of a pituitary issue or PED usage.
"

Anyone else agree???
 
timtim said:
"special training"? have a little respect for defranco. dude would run circles around you in the gym without aas and then be able to explain why describing every motor unit that was used. the "special training" gets these guys prepared to blow up the combine and pro days. check his track record of guys hes prepared. flawless. until you have even the slightest clue who you are insulting, keep your ridiculous LOL'S to yourself.
Click to expand...

Dude WTF? Who was talking about defranco?
Why did you neg rep me?
My whole fuck in point is that u need to have a good genetic make up to be able to train at the elite level! THis dude made some gains very questionable to be done natually judging from those pics. I wasnt questioning the training method just the fact that many ppl think that you can take any person with shitty genetics and make them NFL players...if that's the case everybody would be a freak in superstar!
And just because a trainer is against the use of AAS doesn't mean shit...ppl who think they can get away with it will still use it...look at Manny Ramirez!!
Although admirable that you defend defranco, I wasn't taking about him, bud!!
 
Nelson Montana said:
He's a 24 year old athlete with a great coach. Why not? Once I revamped my training, supplementation, and diet I gained 20 pounds of muscle in one year, drug free, at age 38.
Click to expand...

I Agree. A guy in his prime muscle building years with a top level strength and conditioning coach could easily do this.

As a matter of fact, just about anyone with some dedication and determination could do this without being in their prime or having a great coach...just as Nelson did.

I know trainers who routinely do this with clients. Hell I did the same thing after many years of training. Switched my training and did some things different with my diet, and gained 20 lbs in a year.

What's funny is how no one here (for the most part) believes it can be done, because they haven't done it/can't do it/ won't do it...whatever their excuse is.

Then we see all the posts from 22 year old, 6 ft tall, 170 pounders who have "tried everything" with their diet and training to gain weight, but "just can't gain anymore". They claim to have reached their natural limit and now need to do steroids. LMAO! People are too quick to give up. Takes too much work (actually doesn't if they would just do it right). They want the short cut, the easy way to that "beach body" in just 10 weeks. Summer is coming! Get your steroids!
 
ceo said:
I Agree. A guy in his prime muscle building years with a top level strength and conditioning coach could easily do this.

As a matter of fact, just about anyone with some dedication and determination could do this without being in their prime or having a great coach...just as Nelson did.

I know trainers who routinely do this with clients. Hell I did the same thing after many years of training. Switched my training and did some things different with my diet, and gained 20 lbs in a year.

What's funny is how no one here (for the most part) believes it can be done, because they haven't done it/can't do it/ won't do it...whatever their excuse is.

Then we see all the posts from 22 year old, 6 ft tall, 170 pounders who have "tried everything" with their diet and training to gain weight, but "just can't gain anymore". They claim to have reached their natural limit and now need to do steroids. LMAO! People are too quick to give up. Takes too much work (actually doesn't if they would just do it right). They want the short cut, the easy way to that "beach body" in just 10 weeks. Summer is coming! Get your steroids!
Click to expand...




Damn right CEO! Rome wasn't built in a day ,I trained a 20 yr old gave him eveything he needed except steroids, he was 6 ft 1 " weighed 150 lbs,in 3 yrs he went from benching 135lbs to 415 and gained an amazing 52 lbs of solid muscle.
So don't tell me it can't be done!

RADAR
 
well you might not have been giving him steroids, but are you sure he wasn't gettin em from somewhere else? I've never heard of that kind of a bench increase in 3 years.


RADAR said:
Damn right CEO! Rome wasn't built in a day ,I trained a 20 yr old gave him eveything he needed except steroids, he was 6 ft 1 " weighed 150 lbs,in 3 yrs he went from benching 135lbs to 415 and gained an amazing 52 lbs of solid muscle.
So don't tell me it can't be done!

RADAR
Click to expand...
 
redsamurai said:
well you might not have been giving him steroids, but are you sure he wasn't gettin em from somewhere else? I've never heard of that kind of a bench increase in 3 years.
Click to expand...

I can totally believe that. Gaining just over 17 lbs a year, and adding alomst 8 lbs a week to the bench? From a 20 year old? Yes, I know it didn't happen in steady gains like that, but I'm breaking it down that way. Sounds like he probably hadn't trained much if at all with a 135 bench. Show him how to eat right and how to train right, and I know it can be done naturally. Come on dude! This is so well within a believable realm.
 
In three years it can be done, but one year naturally nah... Unless he had a good size before and for some reason he had stop training, then after awhile he resumed training and through muscle memory it was easier for him to regain his previous size and quite more, that's what happened with many of us, included me. But that particular guy on the before and after photos making that much improvement (from scratch) in one year with that size quality and all achieved naturally (again from scratch) don't think so. There are some freaks out there who did it in the past and were very muscular without even touching a weight though, but this one...
 
redsamurai said:
well you might not have been giving him steroids, but are you sure he wasn't gettin em from somewhere else? I've never heard of that kind of a bench increase in 3 years.
Click to expand...

I know of one person that around 200lbs could bench over 400lbs in competition but it took him more than 3 years to get there.THe guy was in his late 20s I think, he was also taking some PHs at the time though but he could still do 400 natty
 
KoRiN said:
In three years it can be done, but one year naturally nah... Unless he had a good size before and for some reason he had stop training, then after awhile he resumed training and through muscle memory it was easier for him to regain his previous size and quite more, that's what happened with many of us, included me. But that particular guy on the before and after photos making that much improvement (from scratch) in one year with that size quality and all achieved naturally (again from scratch) don't think so. There are some freaks out there who did it in the past and were very muscular without even touching a weight though, but this one...
Click to expand...

It looks that he went from a blubber of fat to hard mature muscle in one year...he should write a book!
 
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