Girlies and Gear

[Tatyana]

Hey ladies,

I had to go and nick some info from a woman I know who does have a lot of personal experience with AAS.

I still advice caution, and I would prefer to see women manipulating diet and training techniques for the desired results.

A lot of maintaining mass while dieting is related to how you are training, there has to be some heavy work thrown into the mix, and dieting, well either dieting slowly, or hit it hard and fast (biochemical individuality).


Here is some more info about Winni and Anavar (and a few others as I find them) from someone who will remain nameless right now:

what is it that you are expecting from a cycle, did you do your research so you know what to expect, what is your goal (and is it a reasonable and appropriate goal for an AAS cycle) and is your diet & training already spot on? If no, don't bother. Come back in 2 years when you've got some time invested and have successfully applied discipline and consistency instead of relying on the drugs. No quicky fixes or magic pills.

I'm still going to go w/ the conservative approach and not recommend stacking stuff you've never used before. Women are immensely more sensitive to AAS than men so if something is overdosed or not what you think it is, that can really F you up. The next step is that only each individual will know how they react to each compound and whether or not they are ok w/ the sides they get. I'd start exactly w/ ver at 5 mg ED for 1.5 - 2 weeks and if no adverse effects, then up to 10 mg ED for 12-ish weeks. YOu can run this stuff at low doses for a relatively long time. (Not forever. but for longer than guys can.)

It is a huge jump in sides from var to primo so its not like its linearly stronger from var or something like that. Primo is often recommended for women as an option past anavar. Winstrol is another one, I guess because it has always tended to be widely available and more affordable than primo. Primo in past years has had a history of being faked a lot and its not cheap.


I think that the faking is happening less but dont' quote me. Both winstrol & primo are much more androgenic than anavar. Neither converts to estrogen so you dont' get the water retention from something that aromatizes sot hey are good for cutting. Sides like hair loss and acne are much more pronounced for primo and primo, though shorter acting than Equipoise, is still a longer clear time than wintrol or var. It takes about 5 weeks to actually 'kick in' as well... also much longer than var or winny.

For sides, you can expect the following of any AAS in varying degrees. Everything except var is going to have most of these sides:

- hairloss
- acne / oily skin / hair
- enlarged & more sensitive clitoris
- potential for vaginosis / yeast infections
- higher blood pressure - occassional bloody noses are not uncommon
- increase in bad cholestrol
- sometimes trouble sleeping (CNS stimulation)
- menstrual cycle will be interrupted
- sometimes something like a flu will hit when your body is acclimating to the presence of the new compound -- guys often talk about "sus flu" -- same thing.

If the compound converts to estrogen, you also get some estrogenic effects like water retention.

Generally everything related to increased presence of DHT.

I invite you to check out the link in the previous post about AAS half lives & clear times and also google "steroid profiles" to get more info. THere is a lot of info out there about the compounds themselves.

As I mentioned above, I'm just not a big fan of stacking stuff you've never used before, much less having never used anything... its always your own personal experiment - not trying to scare anyone,, but if shit happens what are you going to do? You're self-medicating w/ male hormones possible gotten from website selling stuff from Afghanistan.

That's not exactly a guaranteed and safe thing to stick in your body... so the woman using this stuff needs to be responsible for educating herself so she can make informed decisions and take an intelligent & conservative approach to each new compound she chooses to introduce into her system.


If something does happen or you decide you dont' like the sides, how soon before it clears your system and the sides go away? Its not like "The minute I see the first side effect, I'll stop." If you are using primo, for example, you can stop as fast as you want, you still have that compound in your system for the next several weeks. So the hair will continue to come out, your period won't show up for a while and you may get acne until its all clear.


Just saying you need to manage it at every step. It is on you - anyone else can recommend any cycle or any approach, even the husband / boyfriend / whoever w/ the best intentions. Its still YOU that has to deal w/ any sides.

 

[GUARDIAN]

Great post as always TAT! You should make some small modifications for new male/female AAS users and post it in the steroid forum. Thread of the week!

Hey ladies,

I had to go and nick some info from a woman I know who does have a lot of personal experience with AAS.

I still advice caution, and I would prefer to see women manipulating diet and training techniques for the desired results.

A lot of maintaining mass while dieting is related to how you are training, there has to be some heavy work thrown into the mix, and dieting, well either dieting slowly, or hit it hard and fast (biochemical individuality).


Here is some more info about Winni and Anavar (and a few others as I find them) from someone who will remain nameless right now:

what is it that you are expecting from a cycle, did you do your research so you know what to expect, what is your goal (and is it a reasonable and appropriate goal for an AAS cycle) and is your diet & training already spot on? If no, don't bother. Come back in 2 years when you've got some time invested and have successfully applied discipline and consistency instead of relying on the drugs. No quicky fixes or magic pills.

I'm still going to go w/ the conservative approach and not recommend stacking stuff you've never used before. Women are immensely more sensitive to AAS than men so if something is overdosed or not what you think it is, that can really F you up. The next step is that only each individual will know how they react to each compound and whether or not they are ok w/ the sides they get. I'd start exactly w/ ver at 5 mg ED for 1.5 - 2 weeks and if no adverse effects, then up to 10 mg ED for 12-ish weeks. YOu can run this stuff at low doses for a relatively long time. (Not forever. but for longer than guys can.)

It is a huge jump in sides from var to primo so its not like its linearly stronger from var or something like that. Primo is often recommended for women as an option past anavar. Winstrol is another one, I guess because it has always tended to be widely available and more affordable than primo. Primo in past years has had a history of being faked a lot and its not cheap.


I think that the faking is happening less but dont' quote me. Both winstrol & primo are much more androgenic than anavar. Neither converts to estrogen so you dont' get the water retention from something that aromatizes sot hey are good for cutting. Sides like hair loss and acne are much more pronounced for primo and primo, though shorter acting than Equipoise, is still a longer clear time than wintrol or var. It takes about 5 weeks to actually 'kick in' as well... also much longer than var or winny.

For sides, you can expect the following of any AAS in varying degrees. Everything except var is going to have most of these sides:

- hairloss
- acne / oily skin / hair
- enlarged & more sensitive clitoris
- potential for vaginosis / yeast infections
- higher blood pressure - occassional bloody noses are not uncommon
- increase in bad cholestrol
- sometimes trouble sleeping (CNS stimulation)
- menstrual cycle will be interrupted
- sometimes something like a flu will hit when your body is acclimating to the presence of the new compound -- guys often talk about "sus flu" -- same thing.

If the compound converts to estrogen, you also get some estrogenic effects like water retention.

Generally everything related to increased presence of DHT.

I invite you to check out the link in the previous post about AAS half lives & clear times and also google "steroid profiles" to get more info. THere is a lot of info out there about the compounds themselves.

As I mentioned above, I'm just not a big fan of stacking stuff you've never used before, much less having never used anything... its always your own personal experiment - not trying to scare anyone,, but if shit happens what are you going to do? You're self-medicating w/ male hormones possible gotten from website selling stuff from Afghanistan.

That's not exactly a guaranteed and safe thing to stick in your body... so the woman using this stuff needs to be responsible for educating herself so she can make informed decisions and take an intelligent & conservative approach to each new compound she chooses to introduce into her system.


If something does happen or you decide you dont' like the sides, how soon before it clears your system and the sides go away? Its not like "The minute I see the first side effect, I'll stop." If you are using primo, for example, you can stop as fast as you want, you still have that compound in your system for the next several weeks. So the hair will continue to come out, your period won't show up for a while and you may get acne until its all clear.


Just saying you need to manage it at every step. It is on you - anyone else can recommend any cycle or any approach, even the husband / boyfriend / whoever w/ the best intentions. Its still YOU that has to deal w/ any sides.

 

[gymdiva20]

Hi tatyana,
Did your friend say anything about NPP (nandrolone phenylpropionate) specifically in comparison to winny and primo? Has anybody used this before and with what results?
(I read the aas sticky that talked about it being a good alternative)

 

[Thandie]

Thank you Tatyana for taking the time and gathering this information.
In my case I don't want to stack, just want the Anavar for cutting.

I am normally very smal, so adding size is not easy. I've been eating tons of carbs/protein in order to get some muscles. Therefore need something to cut without losing the size. I've already done it natural, but by the time I get cut I'm 104lbs and I want to be a bit bigger for this contest.

Thanks again!

Thandie

 

[Tatyana]

Thank you Tatyana for taking the time and gathering this information.
In my case I don't want to stack, just want the Anavar for cutting.

I am normally very smal, so adding size is not easy. I've been eating tons of carbs/protein in order to get some muscles. Therefore need something to cut without losing the size. I've already done it natural, but by the time I get cut I'm 104lbs and I want to be a bit bigger for this contest.

Thanks again!

Thandie

BBing is all about illusion, so when you are dieted down, you will look a lot bigger and more muscular.

I know people have thought I was MASSIVE in comp pics, when I am actually about a UK size 4-6, and look really tiny in clothing.

I have also met a few of the current IFBB pro female BBers, and it always surprises me at how TINY they are when you meet them.

No steroid is really for 'cutting', they are all designed to build muscle.

 

[Tatyana]

I have to re-post this as I think that the info from Amazon Doll is invaluable

I would look to your diet and training first, when you have that sorted, you can have it sorted for life, whereas there are some experts in the area of steroids, such as William Llewellyn (author of all the anabolics 200_ guides), who have said that women may only keep their gains from anavar for 6 months.

My first coach also used gear, she was an IFBB pro, and she has told me a lot of scary scary stories.

One thing that always sticks out in my mind is that a lot of women do not get sides until they come OFF the cycle, and that could be anywhere from 6-9 months later.

Seriously consider this before you choose to use or not to use.

Here is a post from another female bodybuilder, Amazon Doll who is experienced with steroids.


I've done my fair share of cycles over the years and know quite a few women that have as well.

Here are some things that I have come to believe:

For Females: Keeping Virilization to a Level you can Live With while Using anabolic androgenic steroids.
By Amazon Doll.

1. If you start to get sides while you are on a cycle, there is no guarantee that the sides will go away once you stop.

2. By using fast acting esters, you can drop the cycle immediately and maybe, just maybe the sides will go away. 90% of the time they do......but not always.

3. As soon as you get sides you don't want to live with, drop the cycle. Maybe the sides will go away, maybe not. Figure out ahead of time what will YOU be willing to live with for the rest of your life and if you get to that point with your sides, don't go beyond them. Stopping the cycle then may prevent further sides.

4. That sore throat is not allergies or a cold or you over-training, it is the thickening of your vocal cords and it may not ever go back to the way it was before your cycle

5. Lets say (hypothetically) you do 3 cycles and you get rid of 98% of your sides at the end of each one. You will still have 6% more masculinization than before you ever started doing them. That's only 3 cycles....what does 5 years of cycles look like on you?

6. All the women I know that have used steriods look it somewhere on their body.

7. Before you decide to use anabolic androgenic steroids figure on this: No matter how small your cycles, you will have probably always have: some hairs to pluck on your upper lip or chin, your clit will be a little larger, that squeaking in your voice is the beginnings of voice changes and it might not go away.

8. Don't let anyone tell you that Anavar - oxandrolone - is safe as far as sides. My voice is very effected by Anavar - oxandrolone - and my clit is as well.

9. Women! You will gain weight when you do a cycle. If you can't handle a few pounds, maybe this stuff is not for you. Water weight combined with muscle growth will make you look bigger & thicker. Your face may get puffy even if you are dieting while on. Most women don't look very "pretty " while on.

10. Dieting while on will not give you new muscle growth, just help you hold some muscle you have while you cut. Most cutting can be done with proper diet & exercise and not have the chances of virilization anabolic androgenic steroids gives.

11. Not eating enough protein and at regular intervals throughout the day, will be like throwing your gear down the toilet but keeping the potential sides. Proper training & eating up to, during and after is your cycle will help you hold the gains you made. Don't do what so many do and fall off the training & nutritional wagon once your cycles over or you loose it all and the sides stay.

It's all about fine tuning the diet because a female will get sides and I don't care what anyone says, a female will get sides.

 

[Tatyana]

Anabolic and Androgenic Ratings of Steroids

Definitions of ANABOLIC on the Web:

Pertaining to anabolism, the metabolic process of building tissue from simpler molecules.
www.amfar.org/cgi-bin/iowa/bridge.html

The building up in the body into more complex substances from simpler ones. Part of the Lipo-Oxidative Control System involving the balance of anabolic / catabolic processes in the body. ...
livingbalance.us/glossary.php

Synthesis, opposite of catabolic. Relating to, characterised by or promoting anabolism.
www.project-aware.org/Health/Osteo/osteo-gloss.shtml

Promoting anabolism. Specifically, an agent or function that stimulates the organization of smaller substances into larger ones. Examples: making a starch out of sugars, a protein out of amino acids, or making triglycerides out of fatty acids are anabolic functions. ...
www.healthsuperstore.com/glossary/glossary-a2.aspx

promoting anabolism
www.steroidtips.com/steroidterms.htm

of or related to the synthetic phase of metabolism
characterized by or promoting constructive metabolism; "some athletes take anabolic steroids to increase muscle size temporarily"
wordnet.princeton.edu/perl/webwn

Anabolism is the metabolic process that builds larger molecules from smaller ones. One way of categorizing metabolic processes, whether at the cellular, organ or organism level is as 'anabolic' or 'catabolic', which is the opposite. ...
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anabolic


Definitions of Androgenic on the Web:

This refers to the hormones which stimulate the sebaceous glands to produce sebum.
www.acneway.com/glossary.html

of or related to the male hormone androgen
wordnet.princeton.edu/perl/webwn

Androgen is the generic term for any natural or synthetic compound, usually a steroid hormone, that stimulates or controls the development and maintenance of masculine characteristics in vertebrates by binding to androgen receptors. ...
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Androgenic

The higher the number the more androgenic or anabolic the compound is.

As a woman, if you have concerns about virilisation, or developing more male characteristics, then highly androgenic compounds should be avoided.


Compound:------------------------------Androgenic------Anabolic
1-Testosterone--------------------------100------200
Anabolicum Vister(Quinbolone)(oral Boldenone)--50------100
Anadrol 50(Oxymetholone)-------------45------320
Anadur(Nandrolone Hexyloxyphenylpropionate)--37-----125
Anatrofin(Stenbolone Acetate)---------107-144-----267-332
Anavar(Oxandrolone)-------------------24------322-630
Andractim(Dihydrotestosteron)--------30-260-----60-220
Andriol(Testosterone Undecanoate)----100------100
Androderm(Testosterone)---------------100------100
Androgel(Testosterone)------------------100------100
Boldabol(Boldenone Acetate)------------50------100
Cheque Drops(Mibolerone)--------------1,800------4,100
Danocrine(Danazol)----------------------37------125
Deca-Durabolin(Nandrolone Decanoate)--37------125
Deposterona(Testosterone Blend)-------100------100
Dianabol(Methandrostenolone)-----------40-60------90-210
Dimethyltrienolone------------------------10,000+-----10,000+
Dinandrol(Nandrolone Blend)------------37------125
Durabolin(NPP)----------------------------37------125
Dynabol(Nandrolone Cypionate)---------37------125
Equipoise(Boldenone Undecylenate)-----50------100
Esiclene(Formebolone)-------------------No Data Available
Genabol(Norbolethone)-------------------17------350
Halotestin(Fluoxymesterone)------------850------1,900
Hydroxytestosterone---------------------25------65
Laurabolin(Nandrolone Laurate)---------37------125
Madol(Desoxymethyltestosterone)------187------1,200
Masteron(Drostanolone Propionate)-----25-40------62-130
Megagrisevit-Mono(Clostebol Acetate)--25------46
MENT(Methylnortestosterone Acetate)-------650------2,300
Mestanolone--------------------------------78-254------107
Methandriol(Mythelandrostenediol)-------30-60------20-60
Methyl-1-Testosterone---------------------100-220------910-1,600
Methyldienolone----------------------------200-300------1,000
Methylhydroxynandrolone(MHN)----------281------1304
Methyltestosterone-------------------------94-130------115-150
Metribolone(Methyltrienolone)-------------6,000-7,000------12,000-30,000
Miotolan(Furazabol)-------------------------73-94------270-330
Myagen(Bolasterone)-----------------------300------575
Nilevar(Norethandrolone)------------------22-55------100-200
Omnadren(Testosterone Blend)-----------100------100
Orabolin(Ethylestrenol)--------------------20-400------200-400
Oral Turinabol------------------------------None------100+
Oranabol(Oxymesterone)------------------50------330
Orgasteron(Normethandrolone)-----------325-580------110-125
Parabolan(Tren Hexahydrobenzycarbonate)-500------500
Primobolan(Methenolone Acetate)----------44-57------88
Primobolan Depot(Methenolone Enanthate)-44-57------88
Prostanozol------------------------------------n/a------n/a
Protabol(Thiomesterone)--------------------61------456
Proviron(Mesterolone)-----------------------30-40------100-150
Sanabolicum(Nandrolone Cyclohexylpropionate)-37------125
Steranabol Ritardo(Oxabolone Cypionate)--20-60------50-90
Superdrol(Methyldrostanolone)-------------400------20
Sustanon 100 & 250--------------------------100------100
Synovex(Testosterone Propionate & Estradiol)-100------100
Test 400---------------------------------------100------100
Test Enanthate/Cypionate/Propionate/Susp & Blends-100------100
THG(Tetrahydrogestrinone)-------------------No Data Available
Tren Acetate/Enanthate & Blends------------500------500
Winstrol(Stanozolol)---------------------------30------320



Compound Androgenic Anabolic

Andriol(Testosterone Undecanoate)----100-----------100
Androderm(Testosterone)--------------100-------- -100
Androgel(Testosterone)-----------------100------- -100
Equipoise(Boldenone Undecylenate)-----50------100

 

[xrsist]

a girl i knew ran var @ 5mg ED for 4 or so weeks if i remember correctly, she had a very strict diet and she looked amazing afterwards

 

[Tatyana]

Bump

 

[heatherrae]

Man, that was excellent info from amazon doll.

Thanks for finding that Tat.