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Opinions please. Welcome to Plateauland. Population: Pintoca

pintoca

New member
OK cutting colleagues...

I have had the luck of enjoying 7 months non-stop of fat-loss Nirvana. It didn't come for free, I did my research and worked hard for it, but the pay off has been great, far exceeding my initial expectations.

Nevertheless, the time has come for the inevitable to happen: For the past 2 weeks I have notice neither my weight or bf% going anywhere, they just sit there... The funny thing is I CAN TELL my upper body is looking leaner (I can see things in my arms/delts I could not see before and somethings are happening in my back also... You can also tell the leg is composed of 2 muscles now, with a separation in the middle) Saying the fat scale is off could be a simple solution, but the thing has worked for 7months, why should go kaputt from one day to the other? (not like is running MS software or anything)

I knew this would happen sooner or later (luckily it happened later) and have been thinking what to do once the moment came, so lets take a look at my options:

1. Check my diet: I believe 100% my problem is adaptation and not starvation: I've been eating in the range of 2000-2200 cals (low carb days, 5x week) and 2500-2700 cals (high carb days, 2x week) for 7 months straight, I took no break in December or anything... so my body most likely learnt how to deal with this amount of cals.

2. Increase cardio: :) The option that always come to mind... problem is I am already doing cardio 6x/week at 75-83% MHR for 45 min. I have thought about the possibility of moving my cardio to the morning on an empty stomach, but I am sleeping 4-5 hours tops everynight as it is, so cutting into that is not an option. Cardio will need to remain in the evenings... Could try a combination of HIIT and steady state too, to spice things up

3. take a break: Based on what I observed it happened after taking a 10 days unplanned break, is to up cals to maintenance level, keep lifting and reduce cardio.. then come back with everything I have. Shock Therapy of sorts.

So those are the 3 things I can think of right now. For me it is clear that breaking a plateau is always a matter of being stricter on your diet (cheat less) and training harder (the exception being if you are in starvation or overtrained, neither of which I feel). To break adaptation you need to do things differently.

Right now I think I will stick to the following plan (unless you come up with some good suggestions).

1. Up cals to maintenance (close to 3000 for me) level for 2 weeks, continue with lifting schedule (5x week) and use the surplus carbs to increase working weights. Reduce cardio to twice per week. After the 2 week period, resume diet (2100x5 & 2550x2) and change cardio routine to include a mixture of HIIT and Steady state (avoiding the ellptical, since it has grown too easy after 7 months... I am now an Elliptical Black Belt of sorts)

The ratios I plan to use are: 35% P, 50% carbs, 15% fat (my basic carb up ratios)

So, what do you all think should be my next move?
 
pintoca said:
OK cutting colleagues...

I have had the luck of enjoying 7 months non-stop of fat-loss Nirvana. It didn't come for free, I did my research and worked hard for it, but the pay off has been great, far exceeding my initial expectations.

Nevertheless, the time has come for the inevitable to happen: For the past 2 weeks I have notice neither my weight or bf% going anywhere, they just sit there... The funny thing is I CAN TELL my upper body is looking leaner (I can see things in my arms/delts I could not see before and somethings are happening in my back also... You can also tell the leg is composed of 2 muscles now, with a separation in the middle) Saying the fat scale is off could be a simple solution, but the thing has worked for 7months, why should go kaputt from one day to the other? (not like is running MS software or anything)

I knew this would happen sooner or later (luckily it happened later) and have been thinking what to do once the moment came, so lets take a look at my options:

1. Check my diet: I believe 100% my problem is adaptation and not starvation: I've been eating in the range of 2000-2200 cals (low carb days, 5x week) and 2500-2700 cals (high carb days, 2x week) for 7 months straight, I took no break in December or anything... so my body most likely learnt how to deal with this amount of cals.

2. Increase cardio: :) The option that always come to mind... problem is I am already doing cardio 6x/week at 75-83% MHR for 45 min. I have thought about the possibility of moving my cardio to the morning on an empty stomach, but I am sleeping 4-5 hours tops everynight as it is, so cutting into that is not an option. Cardio will need to remain in the evenings... Could try a combination of HIIT and steady state too, to spice things up

3. take a break: Based on what I observed it happened after taking a 10 days unplanned break, is to up cals to maintenance level, keep lifting and reduce cardio.. then come back with everything I have. Shock Therapy of sorts.

So those are the 3 things I can think of right now. For me it is clear that breaking a plateau is always a matter of being stricter on your diet (cheat less) and training harder (the exception being if you are in starvation or overtrained, neither of which I feel). To break adaptation you need to do things differently.

Right now I think I will stick to the following plan (unless you come up with some good suggestions).

1. Up cals to maintenance (close to 3000 for me) level for 2 weeks, continue with lifting schedule (5x week) and use the surplus carbs to increase working weights. Reduce cardio to twice per week. After the 2 week period, resume diet (2100x5 & 2550x2) and change cardio routine to include a mixture of HIIT and Steady state (avoiding the ellptical, since it has grown too easy after 7 months... I am now an Elliptical Black Belt of sorts)

The ratios I plan to use are: 35% P, 50% carbs, 15% fat (my basic carb up ratios)

So, what do you all think should be my next move?

Would it be possible for you to switch to running. A treadmill I guess would work , I'm just not a huge fan of low impact cardio. Time for a change there I think.

Go to bed earlier so you can do cardio with an empty stomach in the morning.
 
Yep, I agree with the threadmill, since it has some sort of cushioning which makes it easier on the knees (I tried running on the street fort 1 week and at the end of it could barely walk). Will need to buld it up though, guess I can make up for speed with the incline.

About the sleep, believe me, I would LOVE to be able to go to sleep earlier and sleep undisturbed, but having a 4month old boy in the house is not really helping that :) He just opposes his parents sleeping the night through. That will get better eventually (hopefully) and then I will start doing early morning cardio.

Thanks for the input man.
 
A few simple ideas that always work for me in a plateau:

switch up diets (i.e. from a CKD to a high protein diet)
increase carb up days (I think you are already doing these)
switch up cardio, as gj said
switch up training routine (different split, different days, different number of days, different type of training)
 
How long has your weight stalled for? Is it possible that you may have gained ome LBM and lost some fat at the same time? This is unlikely if you are all man, I know.

Assuming this isn't the case, you've probably got a good understanding of your body now since you have been monitoring calories and cutting for a while. To be honest I like your idea of eating at maintenance for 2 weeks and reducing cardio to 2 x week just to shock the system and break the monotony.

Otherwise, you may want to alter the macros in your diet for a couple of weeks. You could try CKD or something similar if you can hand those extreme type of diets.

And I don't now about you, but when I run for an extended period of time, I lose too much lean mass. It's not good for the joints, either. My cardio consists of either swimming or cycling.
 
KillahBee said:
A few simple ideas that always work for me in a plateau:

1. switch up diets (i.e. from a CKD to a high protein diet)
2. increase carb up days (I think you are already doing these)
3. switch up cardio, as gj said
4. switch up training routine (different split, different days, different number of days, different type of training)

Thanks Killah, my comments are:

1. I don't really think I could do well on a CKD, I have eaten relatively low fat my whole life and when I eat something that feels too fatty in my mouth, I feel like puking... thanks my mom for that...

2. I will do that, upping to around 3000 cals now.

3. Will do that too, moving to the threadmill now, with an incline

4. 1 week ago I did that too, I have now a 3 days split (legs, chest/shoulders/triceps, back/biceps/traps) I do legs once a week (the DOMS kills me for at least 4 days) and repeat my other 2 days ever 72 hours. This is completely new to me.
 
|D_J^B_J| said:
How long has your weight stalled for? Is it possible that you may have gained ome LBM and lost some fat at the same time? This is unlikely if you are all man, I know.

Assuming this isn't the case, you've probably got a good understanding of your body now since you have been monitoring calories and cutting for a while. To be honest I like your idea of eating at maintenance for 2 weeks and reducing cardio to 2 x week just to shock the system and break the monotony.

Otherwise, you may want to alter the macros in your diet for a couple of weeks. You could try CKD or something similar if you can hand those extreme type of diets.

And I don't now about you, but when I run for an extended period of time, I lose too much lean mass. It's not good for the joints, either. My cardio consists of either swimming or cycling.

Right now, it has been only 2 weeks, so I am taking measures now to avoid this being a long rut.

I think I will stick to the 2 weeks to 4 weeks "mini-bulking" phase, because that is what is going to be. With the difference I will go only up to mainteance cals (3000 cals). I will most likely not gain any LBM, but hopefully I will shock my body into doing something different.

The more I think about it, the more I realize that 7 months straight might be a bit overdoing it, talk about diminishing returns.
 
Pintoca,
Congrats on all of your success with weight loss. Over the last few years I got my bodyfat down from 25% to 10% at 200lbs. It takes a while so don't give up. I was wondering if you ever tried cutting your calories even further for a couple of days and then going back to 2500. This has worked for me whenever I hit a sticking point. As long as you don't loose any strength in your lifts you should be fine. Best of luck.
 
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