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Author | Topic: Should the South have been allowed to secede from the Union? | ||
Elite Bodybuilder ![]() ![]() ![]() Posts: 813 |
Now this is not a post about slavery. It is a post about States rights. I dont believe in the injustices that were taking place in the South, but I do believe that States should have the right to secede from a government whos ideas do not ring true to their own. I believe that the decision to force a State to belong to the US, was the beginning of the downfall of State sovereignty. What rights do States really have anymore? Is there even a use for calling them States or should we just call our country America? If our country had to point to one moment that forever changed our Republic into a Democracy I believe this forcing of sovereign States to conform would be that moment- ![]() ![]() ![]() | ||
Moderator ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Posts: 1037 |
I agree it was the begining of a much more federalist government, today it seems the feds use funding as a way to get it's way.. like that horrible 55mph speed limit we had, and the 21 year old drinking age. ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ||
Elite Bodybuilder ![]() ![]() ![]() Posts: 1228 |
and the forbidding of same sex marriage...just thought i would stick up for ya... ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ||
Pro Bodybuilder ![]() ![]() ![]() Posts: 400 |
I don't think that would be a good idea. ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ||
Pro Bodybuilder ![]() ![]() ![]() Posts: 320 |
The Confederacy had a right to secede. It was brought back unlawfully by War. States' rights have been eroding ever since. The government now stries to say that it was all about slavery so that the South will seem EVIL to every one, and anyone who is pro-CSA will also therefore seem EVIL. The U.S. is headed for another Civil War soon. There are so many secessionist movements active today. 1.)http://www.newsmax.com/commentarchive.shtml Check out: 1.) http://members.tripod.com/cpt_peewee/index.html [This message has been edited by Weapon X (edited October 03, 2000).] ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ||
Pro Bodybuilder ![]() ![]() ![]() Posts: 400 |
I doubt that Weaponx ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ||
Pro Bodybuilder ![]() ![]() ![]() Posts: 320 |
You doubt what, bro??? Do some research, elaborate on what you disagree with, cite some sources, then let's talk. ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ||
Pro Bodybuilder ![]() ![]() ![]() Posts: 400 |
True Weapon, I haven't done any research so my point isn't all that valid, but haven't these types of groups been around forever? Do you really think we're heading for civil war? Just sounds like more 'armageddon' type talk to me. However, like you said, I've done no research. ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ||
Pro Bodybuilder ![]() ![]() ![]() Posts: 320 |
Yeah, Frack, no flame was intended. The fact is that under the Constitution, State's rights were much broader, and the "United States" was a nation depending upon the consent of each State which was a voluntary member of the Union. Any State was sovereign and could withdraw if it so chose. Well, the South tried to do so. (Remember that Slavery was VERY big business in the North at the time, so they were NOT morally superior as is now so often claimed.) The Secessionist groups are much more numerous, much more active, and much more organized now, I think. Some of the links I provided above were about the legality and philosophy of the secessionists, so check em out. Racial issues are going to feed this flame mroe than ever, as teh non-white population grows. Also, Mexicans are attempting to reclaim vast areas of America fo rthemselves. Check "Aztlan." ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ||
Moderator ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Posts: 1037 |
We did conquer Mexico in the 1840's because of the inclusion of Texas into the States and the States took NM, AZ, CA, NV from Mexcio. I would think Mexico still has a pretty good claim on those lands. We should have taken all of Mexico and moved the captial to Austin. ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ||
Pro Bodybuilder ![]() ![]() ![]() Posts: 320 |
Using that rationale, JohnnyO, we should give the USA back to England, or back to the Native Ameicans, along with Canada, eh? ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ||
Amateur Bodybuilder ![]() ![]() Posts: 188 |
weapon x, i'm not sure what you mean by this: >The fact is that under the Constitution, >State's rights were much broader, and the >"United States" was a nation depending upon >the consent of each State which was a >voluntary member of the Union. Any State was >sovereign and could withdraw if it so chose. did you mean "under the articles of confederation?" or are you implying that somehow the current constitution denies states' rights? (i.e. soveriegnty was abridged by amendments 13-27) to my knowledge the constitution said nothing explicit about secession. ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ||
Pro Bodybuilder ![]() ![]() ![]() Posts: 505 |
there is no such thing as state sovereignty anymore i believe there is a vote this year in alaska to legalize marijuana (not just for medicinal use either) if it passes the feds are gonna shit big fat jaggedy edged bricks and if the feds intervene how do you think alaskans are gonna take that ? one of these days the shit will hit the fan if the feds keep using all their bullshit strong arm tactics like withholding our confiscated earnings cuz our state doenst conform to their rules i cant wait till texas secedes from this fading republic called the usa
"What luck for the rulers that men do not think." at any rate what difference does it all make when most people dont give a damn, dont vote, dont stand for anything, dont mind working half the year just to pay taxes, all the while our federal govt keeps growing like some silent cancer ![]() ![]() ![]() | ||
Pro Bodybuilder ![]() ![]() ![]() Posts: 587 |
This is why I think a vote for Harry Browne for President will help those of us who believe in returning power to the states while keeping us together.... ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ||
Cool Novice ![]() ![]() Posts: 39 |
An interisting book to check out on this subject is "Civil War II" by Thomas Chittum. It discusses many of the points outlined in this thread, foremost of those being the cycle of land stealing in the American Southwest and the continuing desire of many Mexicans to reclaim the land they stole from the Indians in Texas, Arizona and California from the Anglos who in turn stole it from them. ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ||
Pro Bodybuilder ![]() ![]() ![]() Posts: 505 |
its a good thing mexico doesnt own any more land than it does it would just be a bigger third world country if it did the mexicans should thank us and the indians should kill us hehe ![]() ![]() ![]() | ||
Elite Bodybuilder ![]() ![]() ![]() Posts: 642 |
These are the initial terms of surrendur of the Confederacy. X has a point. No mention of repatriation to the union. Can anyone find anything else that might lead a final document that says the states were repatriated! Complete exchange between Lee and Grant.
Very respectfully, ------------------ ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ||
Pro Bodybuilder ![]() ![]() ![]() Posts: 320 |
Visigoth: You hang out at nasty sites! ![]() Dirk: How do I gets signed up? ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ||
Pro Bodybuilder ![]() ![]() ![]() Posts: 505 |
http://www.federalist.com/ ![]() ![]() ![]() | ||
Pro Bodybuilder ![]() ![]() ![]() Posts: 320 |
Thanks, DD. ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
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