Bodybuilding is the developmetn of an aesthetically pleasing physique. generally, this means muscle development and the absence of fat.

Compound movements (muscles working together) are essential to mass building and strength development. Isolation is important to give muscles their shape and appearance.

Compound movements are the cornerstone of training.

Looking for peoples opinions and why they feel that way.

Dips, lean forward, elbows wide, I feel that more in my lower, outer pecs, yes I feel it in other places, but It does feel like its isolating right where I want it to in my pecs.

so to your dip question, i do shoulders and tris on the same day, i enjoy it, but i gotta say i dont feel dips much in my delts. and this is becaue of what Gil mentioned. techinque.im a techinque freak i admit it, id rather do the exercise 100% right than throw on the poundage. i dunno, maybe thats why im weak. but if i do em with my ody straight as a bin, and my elbows STRAIGH back i feel it in my tris..and ONLY my tris.

To your biceps question, certain exercies are known to build for instance a higher peak, a wider biceps, a longer biceps. this is the challenge of bodybuilding, choosing and exercise program wich gives you the results you want. the preacher curls, all the different one are supposed to give you a higher peak..specially the singel arem db one, where you place the elbow on your inner tigh...for instance..

hey, nobody has yet found out whats best, i say everything goes..schock the shit outta your body and you WILL get results.

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"Pain, is just weakness leaving your body"

"...damn you for not giving my TEST" - Metallica

"After this show i'll be fat and happy again.....If i make it to the show...." - Lee Priest

"Lets put some weight on the bar.." - Shawn Ray

it is impossible to change the genetic shape of a muscle. all you an do i make the muscle bigger (or smaller). preacher curls will not make your bi's longer, concentration curls will not make your bi's have a better peak. still using bi's for an example, you can create the illusion of a better peak, by developing the brachialis (runs under the biceps). chest is different, you can work the upper and lower chest, becuase they are two different muscles. the upper is hit with incline presses, and flye movements, the lower is hit with flat press and flye movements. many poeple think there is a upper, middle, and lower chest. the same part of the chest is worked with flat presses, as with decline presses. you only "feel" the decline presses more in the lower chest becuase the delts and lats are less invloved. i picked the most common examples to explain here, but the same is true for other muscle groups.

i also believe that compound exercises are the only exercises you need. isolation exercises have their place, but i still think you could use compound exercises differently to get the same effect. for example: if a bodybuilder wanted to add size to his chest, without adding size to his delts, flyes could help this. but, so could decline presses. they have almost the same effect, although they do use the delts more than flyes.

as for working the body as a whole, i also do this very often. for now, no, but in the past and future, yes. thepush/pull/legs split is the my main split. it always worked well for me, so i use it. right now i'm using a one bodypart a day (except arms), 5 times a week split. i like this becuase, i can put maximum intensity and effort into every bodypart. i still use all compound exercises though.

the bodyweight versus barbell exercise arguement is also interesting. i just recently switched to undergrip chins, instead of barbll curls for my main exercise for bis. but i still think the barbell curl works better, becuase on undergrp chins, the lats are doing a lot of the work, that has a lot to do with you being able to use more weight on these then barbell curls. same with dips, chest does a lot of the work.

that was probably the longest post i have ever made. lol. hopefully this post will get some more feedback.

gentics only determine our limits to size and shape. Within those limitations we have a lot of roome ot maneuver.

Yes, you can make your bi's longer, as an example, to a point. genetics only determines that point.

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Originally posted by big bear 1959:
so pushdowns activate just as many fibers as closegrip benches or french press i dont think so.to recruit more fibers you have to take it farther than you did the last workout more weight more reps ect,

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I couldnt agree anymore! My point was that I dont think we need to really do isolation exercises. If we do say dips with tons of weight and always progress Im sure our whole upper body will grow, not just the chest.
I havent trained arms directly in 2-3 weeks and they feel more fuller already. My g/f just said they look bigger. If I do train arms it usually just 1-2 sets thats it for each.

About my comparison to dips and benches was that I could do dips with a total of 315lbs for 10 reps, but with the bench I can only rep out a few. So my theory was that dips would give me more muscle stimulation.

now as for partials or spot growth.
hypertrophy will occur in the portion of the cells that are stressed and damaged. if you are stimulating a muscle in a particular way so as to damage only the targeted portion (ie lower half of 21s or partial flyes) then that portion of the muscle that is involved in lifting it will be stressed and compensate by growing. its not making a muscle any longer, its just filling in some spaces under our "skin suit". hehe.
overall development is still acheived by compound movements of course. but the merits of isolation cant be thrown out to those looking only to refine.