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Thick dog- in your past life you were a cock polisher with gap teeth.

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Originally posted by havoc:
Shagwell- you should take your brand of humor and package it as a sleeping aid. I only smoke 2-3 times a week inhaling no more than 5 hits a week barely smoking any herb at all due to its high grade attributes. I do believe Jesus utilized herb in a proper fashion, all the lies of today were not around then or even 100 years ago so no one had a bad or negative outlook on herb such as the brainwashed people of today. Anything else I can school anybody on today just let me know.

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Please excuse my assumption dear havoc...although you continous reference to the plant and sigs have lead me to believe you worship it on a daily basis...

However, it was not an attempt at humor, for I was inquiring your knowlegeble reference ont eh herb to find out if it was ever referenced in the bible.

All have references to herb whether its the herb I inhale or not, some references are speaking of all herbs, this is what every Rasta follows.

I find it odd that a man who preached such goodwill would rule his followers with such an iron fist and commit such acts as destroying the moneylenders stalls at the synogouge.

I do not beleive he was the son of any god. I do not beleive he healed anyone. I do beleive he tried to reform the Hebrew religion and paid for it with his life.
A persecuted reformer? Most likely. The messiah? Hell no.

If you havoc believe in his words and actions and as a result it makes you a better person, sobeit. All the power to you. But do not assume by making bald statements that the rest of us think the same.

The reason he went after the money changers:

I know why the moneychangers were there. The point was.....he wasnt' turning his cheek too gaddman far, now was he? Cant see the Dalai Lama doing shit like that.

The majority of Jesus life was not chronicled, sure He made his mistakes but during the time His life was not chronicled is when the trial and error took place, He became perfect and only realized He was the Son of God after John Baptized him. You say don't assume you believe like me or others well I say to you the same. I am on the money with my shit, its my life so why wouldnt I be. When a person reaches a perfect state of being(Buddha, Elijah, Muhammed, Jesus and other Avatars) they are lighter if you will and ascend because they are on another plane that only they can understand(enlightenment). Any other schooling just let me know. Much love

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Originally posted by havoc:
fairy garbage.

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Originally posted by kat:

astrology done correctly is as much of an unproven, yet logical THEORY as religion. It is one of the few things that has proven its logic to ME many times over. I do not insist or ask anyone else to believe it, and it is just one of many theories I subscribe to.

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snakes are my friends

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Originally posted by kat:
the only women involved were there merely to do "womanly" things..cook clean his damn feet, etc.

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On the contrary, Kat, women played some of the most important roles in the Bible. You are making a lot of ignorant generalizations in this thread. I support you for believing what you want to believe, and you sound like a good person. But you have some fundamental misconceptions about the Bible, Jesus (who NEVER called hismelf "Son of God"), and Christianity.

P.S. I am currently working toward my masters in theology, in case you are wondering how I could be drawing such conclusions.

When I'm finished my own thesis on the matter I will send you a copy that will illustrate clearly enough that YOU are the one talking through your hat sir, not me.

1) I am not slighting your intelligence. If you've read up and come to different conclusions, fine.

2) Only two people (according to the bible) have been bodily assumed into heaven. One was the prophet Elijah. The other was the Virgin Mary. A woman who's significance is outweighed by none other, either man or woman.

3) The first people to discover that jesus was not in his tomb (and thus the first people to proclaim the risen christ to the rest of the world) were women. Three of them, actually.

4) I have made a lifetime (albeit a short one) of thinking for myself. Most theologians I read, I disagree with. Even the biggies: Augustine, Aquinas, Ignatius, etc. My personal theology is highly unique.

While we are on the subject, what is your take on the theory that Judaas was actually a zealot sent to spy on Jesus because they zealots were going to assassinate him but wanted to know first if he was "the messiah"?

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Originally posted by kat:
...I just wrote 2 monster posts and I cant' be fucking bothered to fight you on it cause you are obviously one of those university boys who believe whatever your professor puts in front of you.

[This message has been edited by kat (edited March 07, 2001).]

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As I said before, my theology is fairly unique. I have yet to have a professor who I have agreed with on more than the occasional point.

I don't know why you're being so defensive with me. You, who claim to be so open and original in her thought proccesses, then go on to say things like "YOU are the one talking through your hat." If I am supposed to respect your thoughts on the matter (which I do), do I not deserve the same respect?

so, this is usually the same point at which i get peeved at Matt due to my own inability to argue a point....I apologize.

I still say that women served "traditional" womens roles...if they didn't, then the Christian church could not have effectively kept women in a submissive societal position for so long. It is only since secularism has rebounded that the role of women has become more equal in society.

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Originally posted by kat:
you still didn't answer my question then of why Magdaleine was not a disciple....the reason why the women were at the tomb is because they were the only ones with balls enough to come out of hiding.....The so-called "disciples" were busy shitting their pants in hiding.

While we are on the subject, what is your take on the theory that Judaas was actually a zealot sent to spy on Jesus because they zealots were going to assassinate him but wanted to know first if he was "the messiah"?

I'm divided...makes sense to a point, but then there is other theories that have valid points as well.

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Kat-- it is my belief that the "truth" of those times are inaccurately represented in the Bible. Obviously, the Bible was written by the dominant patriarchy who had a political agenda. Thus, it is biased.

To answer your question, I believe Mary Magdaline WAS a disciple. In the gospels, several authors repeatedly refer to "the one whom Jesus loved best". It is clear from the context that this individual was NOT one of the named disciples. It is my belief that this individual was a woman (perhaps Mary Magdaline, perhaps not). But, the powers that be never would have allowed a women to be elevated to such an incredible position in relation to Jesus, thus, they don't use her name, but refer to her as "the one whom Jesus loved best."

I agree, much of the Bible is arranged to empower the patriarchy. But I think reading between the lines shows the women were very important to Jesus.

As for Judas, I really haven't given it much thought. I've heard that theory before, but don't have enough information to make a solid decision.

Hail Mary,

full of grace,
the Lord is with you

Blessed are you among women
and blessed is
the fruit of your womb, Jesus

Holy Mary, Mother of God,
pray for us sinners

Now and at the hour
of our death. Amen.

Thanks Stone Cold...I'm overly sensitve to being called stupid...I have to work on that.

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Originally posted by StoneColdGold:

2) Only two people (according to the bible) have been bodily assumed into heaven. One was the prophet Elijah. The other was the Virgin Mary.

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