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  WHO CAN GIVE ME PROOF THAT DECA CAUSES PROGESTERONE!!

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Author Topic:   WHO CAN GIVE ME PROOF THAT DECA CAUSES PROGESTERONE!!
BigJay81

Guru

Posts: 3701
From:LIFT UNTIL YOU DIE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Registered: Jan 2000

posted December 06, 2000 02:16 AM

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I HAVE NEVER SEEN PROOF THAT IT CAUSES PROGESTERONE.
SCIENTIFIC ONLY.

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Lift
Until You Die!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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the truth

Elite Bodybuilder

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From:
Registered: Jun 2000

posted December 06, 2000 02:24 AM

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It doesn't cause it, it exhibits cross-reactivity at the receptor level.

I believe the 19-nortestosterones are classified as progestins. They are female, not male, hormones.


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BigJay81

Guru

Posts: 3701
From:LIFT UNTIL YOU DIE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Registered: Jan 2000

posted December 06, 2000 02:29 AM

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SO IT DOESN'T CAUSE IT.


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Dr. Juice

Cool Novice

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From:
Registered: Dec 2000

posted December 06, 2000 02:31 AM

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Nandrolone does not cause progesterone, it is a progestagen as well as an androgen. This means it has progestagenic activities in various tissues. Stanozolol also binds to progesterone receptors but it is not an agonist (does not activate them).

I will not quote a study since you want scientific proof:

"progestagenic activity was detected and measured in T, DHT and three synthetic androgens: nandrolone (19-nortestosterone). 7 alpha-methyl 19-nortestosterone (MENT) and mibolerone (7 alpha, 17 alpha-dimethyl 19-nortestosterone) (DMNT). While progestagenic effects of T and DHT required relatively high concentrations (microM levels), the synthetic androgens stimulated AP activity at nM or pM levels. These effects seem to be mediated by the progesterone receptor (PR), since they are completely abolished by the antiprogestins RU-486, ZK-98299 and ZK-112993, but not by the antiandrogen OHFl"

That just said T & DHT are no where near as progestagenic as 19-nortest which is nandrolone. Deca is nandrolone deconate.

[This message has been edited by Dr. Juice (edited December 06, 2000).]


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HUCKLEBERRY FINNaplex

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From:Timbuktu
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posted December 06, 2000 02:31 AM

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No,rather it "behaves" like it on certain receptors(i.e. breast tissue in certain individuals)


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BigJay81

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Posts: 3701
From:LIFT UNTIL YOU DIE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Registered: Jan 2000

posted December 06, 2000 02:34 AM

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FIRST OF ALL YOU BETTER STICK AROUND I FOUND A NEW BEST FRIEND.

SECOND--THIS IS WHAT I GOT FROM THAT. ITS THEIR BUT IS NOT ACTIVE, IF THIS IS SO WHAT MAKES IT ACTIVE IF EVEN POSSIBLE.

IF I AM WROND COULD YOU PLEASE EXPLAIN A LITTLE MORE. I'M STILL LEARNING AND WANT TO KNOW AS MUCH AS I CAN.
JAY


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BigJay81

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From:LIFT UNTIL YOU DIE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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posted December 06, 2000 02:37 AM

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AAHHHH NOW I GET IT IT "MIMICS" PROGESTERONE
ITS NOT PRODUCED BY IT BUT PRODUCES THE SAME SIDES AS PROGESTERONE.

ONE LAST QUESTION??

IF IT JUST ACTS LIKE IT THEN NOLVADEX WOULD WORK TO CLEAR IT UP?


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MS

Elite Bodybuilder

Posts: 1058
From:Somewhere in the South Pacific
Registered: May 2000

posted December 06, 2000 02:40 AM

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Are you asking for proof OTHER than scientific?? That's how your question reads. Sorry bro, in this world ther is EITHER proof (in other words scientific) OR anecdote (in other words my friend got itchy nipples while taking Deca).

The best comparison I can make is that many steroids are anabolic or androgenic even though they're NOT testosterone. You could technically call some of these roids "testosteronic" just like you can call Deca "progestenic". In other words, in some receptors Deca can act sorta like progesterone even though it's NOT progesterone.


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Dr. Juice

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posted December 06, 2000 02:41 AM

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Jay in simple terms nandrolone pops into the progesterone receptors and says hello lets party.

Nolvadex is an anti-estrogen, so by itself it will not de-activate the progestagenic activity of nandrolone, since it is unlikely that it binds to the prog receptor. However, the complex interaction between nandrolone and estrogen metabolism in the breast is unknown. Therefore, anti-estrogens may have some effect in reducing feminization symptoms caused by the use of nandrolone or other progestagens. Also, it would be a very wise choice if estrogens or aromatizable substances are also being used.

[This message has been edited by Dr. Juice (edited December 06, 2000).]


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HUCKLEBERRY FINNaplex

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From:Timbuktu
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posted December 06, 2000 02:44 AM

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No,nolvadex competes for the ESTROGEN receptor,occupies it,and in doing so,de-activates by blocking estrogen from binding to it.Unfortunately this is limited to the estrogen receptor,so nolvadex is inneffective at the progesterone receptor.Winstrol does offer some hope in this area,as well as RU-486.


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BigJay81

Guru

Posts: 3701
From:LIFT UNTIL YOU DIE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Registered: Jan 2000

posted December 06, 2000 03:04 AM

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Thats just what I was looking for. Dr.Juice please stick around
And Huck thanks for your help as well.
I understand now and I am on my way. Thanks for passing along the info

------------------

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Until You Die!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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2legit2quit

Amateur Bodybuilder

Posts: 291
From:Anytown, USA
Registered: Mar 2000

posted December 06, 2000 03:09 AM

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Winny virtually erased my gyno from deca.


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MS

Elite Bodybuilder

Posts: 1058
From:Somewhere in the South Pacific
Registered: May 2000

posted December 06, 2000 01:43 PM

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First some basic steroid biochemistry: Estrogen upregulates it's own receptor plus the progesterone receptor, while progesterone downregulates both. Nature 254:337-339, 1975..

Next, just a few of the HUNDREDS of research papers showing Nortestosterone and it's derivatives are progestenic:

Abstract
To explore the regulatory mechanism at the critical period of the luteal-placental shift, the effects of various steroids and peptides on the production of progesterone by placental explants at 7-10 weeks were studied..������19-Nortestosterone (1-18 mumol) stimulated progesterone production 10- to 100-fold������������������� Thus, of all the compounds tested, only 19-nortestosterone stimulated progesterone production ������.. 19-Nortestosterone was found to be less efficiently aromatized compared to other androgens. These observations suggest that C18 and C19 steroids may be important in the regulation of progesterone ���������..

And why the bros tell you to also take some winny:

Abstract
������������Binding of stanozolol to both cell types could be partially displaced by progesterone, indicating that stanozolol binds to the progesterone receptor������������ Nortestosterone, had no effect on binding of stanozolol to either cell type�����These results indicate that the inhibition of DNA synthesis by stanozolol is elicited through the progesterone receptor���������

Abstract
Testosterone and 19-nortestosterone derivatives were evaluated in a developmental scheme designed to identify
competitive progesterone antagonists������� Compounds that displayed significant binding to the rabbit uterine progesterone receptor were followed in biologic tests for progestational, antiprogestational, and
abortifacient activities. Of the seven compounds tested for both progestational and antiprogestational activity, only
one, 5 alpha-dihydronorethindrone, behaved exclusively as an antagonist. Five other 19-nortestosterones
(19-nortestosterone, 17 beta-hydroxyestra-4, 9(10)-dien-3-one, norethindrone, norethindrone acetate, and R 2323)
proved to be mixed agonists/antagonists������������

And so on and so forth. I am dumbfounded that any one could doubt Deca's ability to act as a progestenic drug!


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KODIAK99

Elite Bodybuilder

Posts: 1223
From:New York, NY USA
Registered: Aug 2000

posted December 06, 2000 01:51 PM

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I agree it does. . .but does RU-486 block it?

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If you are going to be a bear. . .be a big fucking bear!!!!!


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E2

Moderator

Posts: 5614
From:VALHALLA
Registered: Mar 2000

posted December 06, 2000 01:57 PM

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Thank you very much guys!!

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[This message has been edited by E2 (edited December 06, 2000).]


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2Thick

Moderator

Posts: 4916
From:
Registered: Jun 2000

posted December 06, 2000 02:08 PM

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That didn't prove much. The functions of the human body are very complicated and no final conclusions can be drawn from any research done to this day.

Those studies that MS posted were done on female rabbits and other female animals.

Finally the dosage used on these animals exceeds 1000mg of Deca per week for 7-10 weeks so you of course adverse sid effects appear when you abuse it.


Use your heads guys!!


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