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  Injectable test undecanoate

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Author Topic:   Injectable test undecanoate
Dr.Atlas

Amateur Bodybuilder

Posts: 143
From:Grand Rapids, MI USA
Registered: Feb 2000

posted October 03, 2000 10:50 PM

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I take it that injectable test undecanoate is a pretty new development. However all my searches about it find nothing but more questions. To set the stage, the following is a quote from a post from another board.--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"What's up Muscle headz. Let's talk about Andriol. I don't have any personal experience, but I do have a few articles off of roid.com and anabolex research.
Known Brand names: restandol, undestor

There are two issues in relation to Andriol. First, there exists a mythology that Andriol is totally useless. Second, many who purchase Andriol, have been grossly misled. This article debunks the myth and offers some solace to the misled. Many condemn Andriol through lack of knowledge without considering that, since WAR and others, including the medical community in most countries, regard Andriol as effective, then perhaps it has its uses. This misguided condemnation leads those who should be considering Andriol to ignore it. On the other hand, the over enthusiastic words of some writers in respect of Andriol have misled many novice BB to purchase Andriol when in fact it is unlikely to be the most appropriate Anabolic ******* for them. Unthinking condemnation is particulary unwarranted given that the principal agent in the ever popular Sus250 (ie 100mg test decanoate) is chemically identical to the Testosterone Undecanoate in Andriol. Chemically and mathematically, 1 bottle of Andriol is equivalent to 24 Sus, but in practical application and effectiveness they are poles apart. However, there are a variety of problems associated with the use of Andriol, not least of which is the fact that many capsules purchased by BBs are probably inert by the time they are purchased.

Description:

Andriol is an oral testosterone androgen compound whose prime agent is test undecanoate (TU). Andriol is supplied by its sole manufacturer Organon as an oval, reddish-brown, soft gelatine capsule, marked "ORG" and "D3V containing 40mg of TU in oleic acid. The capsule's non-medicianl ingredients are: gelatine, glycerol, iron oxide red, karion, sodium ethyl hydroxybenzoate, sodium propyl hydroxybenzoate and titanium dioxide. Andriol is supplied in bottles of 28, 56, 60 and 100 capsules dependent upon country of manufacturer. It is also supplied in foil strips in Brazil and Thailand.

Pharmacology:

Test Undecanoate an orally active test preparation, is a fatty acid ester of the natural androgen testosterone. Unlike other oral testosterone preparations, TU is able to by pass the liver via t-lymphatic system and is therefore orally bioavailable. Therapy with Andriol increases plasma levels of testosterone and its active metabolites, leading to a regular therapeutic effect. In eugonadal men, peak testosterone levels are reached in approximately 4 to 5 hours after after ingestion returning to basal levels after about 10 hours. In volunteers and hypogonadal (ie. low natural testosterone) men, 77 to 93% of an orally administered dose of TU was excreted in the urine and feces within 3 to 4 days.

Storage is Critical

It is probably true to say that some of the andriol available on the black market is useless and serves no purpose other than as a laxative. The reason is that, unless refrigerated, Andriol will become inert after 3 months storage at room temperature (ie up to 30 degrees C) Indeed, some claim that at room temp, it will become inert after 2 months. Prolonged storage at higher than room temp. will clearly shorten this period. Exposure to high temp will also cause the capsules to become misshappen and even to melt. Ideally, the bottle of capsules should be removed from the refrigerator about 24hrs before use, and once in use, the bottle should not be returned to the refrigerator (ie it should only be ingested when fully thawed out).

The Problem

The problem with Andriol is that it is very idiosyncratic. It does nothing for some, but for others it works for a variety of purposes. This idiosyncratic feature reflects both Andriol's delivery method and the nature of individual metablisms. Research has shown that, for some people, only 3% - 4% of the Andriol ingested survives to perform a useful function - for others the percentage is higher, but never 100%. It is possible that, for most people, less than 10% of the TU ingested survives to become bioavailable. Another problem associated with Andriol has been outlined by Mr. Dan Duchaine, who has suggested that, of the small percentage of Andriol that survives its journey through the gut to reach the lymphatic system, 70% is converted into DHT. The potential ramifications of DHT in the context of hairloss and prostate are well known to all BBs. However, the amount of DHT arising from normal doses of Andriol is unlikely to be significant, given the small percentage that survives ingestion. Nevertheless, that may account for the anecdotal, but unsubstantiated, claims of andriol encouraging male-pattern baldness. Even for those for whom Andriol does work, it takes trial and error over time to establish a viable dose amount and schedule. This dosage methology is time consuming and expensive and although feasible in the medical environment, it is less so in BB. The variability of Andriol's effectiveness partly explains why "Animal" on varix states that Andriol works and points to the overwhelming medical research supporting it, while Human..saurus-rex on Anabolex says to forget the medical evidence and that it does not work for BB. Both are correct: statistically, medically, chemically, scientifically, etc. Andriol does work, but often not in a manner that is useful for young, healthy BB.

IT'S STRONG POINTS

Andriol's real strong point is in medical applications. For instance, the efficacy of Andriol for use in androgen replacement has been established in so many studies that it is beyond dispute. Similarly, Andriol's lack of toxicity and safely in long term use (up to 10yrs) has also been clearly established.

ANDRIOL IS PERHAPS BEST SUITED FOR THOSE BB WHO:

1. have a definite medical need e.g. liver function problems, depression, thyroid problems, low natural testosterone, other hormonal imbalances, osteoporosis and infertility.

2. are aged over 35, and thus have declining natural testosterone levels. There are those who advocate that the majority of men over 40 should adopt a regular androgen supplementation regime using a mild form of testosterone such as andriol.

3. BBs who are more concerned with extreme safety and are less concerned with quick results and expense.

Except for the above, arguably, Andriol is not cost-effective relative to the other relatively safe options available e.g. primo-depot.

There does appear to be a correlation between Andriol's anecdotal effectiveness and age - older BB consider it more useful than younger BB. This reflects the natural age-related decline in testosterone. This decline is, at its extreme, represented by the medical condition of hypogonadism (nuts shrinkage, hehehe), for which one of the popular treatments outside the USA is Andriol. For age -related male testosterone deficiency which has not falled to the level of hypogonadism, namely the "viorpause" or "andropause", again Andriol, or alternatively the testosterone patch, is the treatment of choice of endocrinologist in many countries. This area of low normal and sub-normal ntural testosterone levels, Andriol is especially useful for the older BB.

Testosterone Undecanoate in injectable form, although not generally available, is far less idiosyncratic that the capsules. Indeed there is strong evidence to show that injected TU is far superior to, for example, test enanthate. TU cream also has its uses, for example it has been shown to stimulate the growth of female pubic hair. It has also been shown that Andriol, taken in conjunction with Nolvadex can significantly improve male fertility. One of the most interesting things about TU is that it causes a significant decrease in the level of Sex hormone binding glogulin (SHBG) which for most males is to the good. Since SHBG interferes with the bioavailability of testosterone and perhaps other *******s, this leads to the speculation that perhaps TU could be used in combination with other more anabolic *******s as a synergist. It is debatable whether Andriol is a useful general treatment in relation ti AIDS, but this reflects the multi-faceted nature of AIDS rather an adverse comment on Andriol. There are some indications that Andriol may be useful is assisting to normalise the test levels of Aids suffers. Current medical guidelines for the normalisation of serum test in HIV suffers recommends 3 - 4 capsules per day as an alternative to treatment with 200 - 400mg of test enanthate every 4 wks.

HOW TO USE IT IF YOU'RE STRUCK WITH IT

1. Use for Depression: Depression is an area where the average BB might find Andriol useful. It has been shown from the work done on hypogonadal men that Andriol relieves and indeed can eliminate the depression induced by low serum T levels. Given that many BB suffer, among other things from depression and low natural test levels when coming off a heavy cycle, Andriol could have a role as a heavy cycle taper. There are also indications that Andriol relieves depression in males with normal test levels. Of course. Andriol is an expensive anti-depressant, St. John's Wort works for many just as well and is cheaper.

2. Use for Taper: even those who do not suffer from cycle termination depression would find Andriol and effective, but expensive taper. For example, taper out of Sus250 with primobolan and Andriol, reducing the primo at a rate such that the final taper element is low Andriol at low dosage.

3. Use for Bridge: In this respect it is perhaps more useful than 50mg deca and certainly safer that test enanthate. however, in a bridging role Andriol will not allow the recovery of the natural test production nor allow receptor recovery if taken at high doses.

4. Use for Stack: For example, deca+primo and/or anavar. But in such cases Andriol should be viewed as a supplement to and not as the backbone of the stack. Here one would be seeking to benefit from the SHBG suppression and synergistic effects referred to above. Andriol can be stacked with any gear. WAR suggest: Oxandrolone, deca, oral-turinabol and primo-depot.

5. Use for Pre-Training: Although there is no consensus as to dose, it is often suggested that the Andriol be taken 1 hour before a workout. There is no clear evidence to support Andriol's role in this regard. Given the nature of Andriol, it is doubtful whether ingestion one hour prior to training would serve any useful purpose.

MORE EFFECTIVE APPLICATIONS

Various suggestions have been made as to how Andriol might be more efectively applied. Taking it with Saw Palmetto or Proscar and taking it with grapefruit juice do have some logic to support them and may do some good. Indeed for those BB concerned about their prostate and/or potential hair loss, it is sensible to supplement and gear cycle with Saw Palmetto. The proven benefits far outweigh tha alleged marginal loss of gains that might arise from it's use.

Cost

The current mail-order cost of Andriol from Europe varies from $20 - $50 for 60 capsules. The pharmacy price of Andriol in Europe varies from $14 for 60 capsules to $42 for 56 capsules. Andriol is not currently available from pharmacies in the US.

Cautions

Although, Andriol is generally considered an almost benign AS at low to moderate doses, caution is necessary when taking it at high doses. Given the very idiosyncratic nature of Andriol, it is impossible to be precise as to what dose constitutes "high". WAR implies that high is in the area of 240 - 280 mg/day (ie 6 - 7 capsules/day). At high doses, particularly if sustained for an extended period, the normal BB using Andriol will be exposed to the usual risks associated with AS including suppression of the HPT axis, excess estrogen problems, skin changes, hair loss, prostate problems, etc.

The effectiveness of Andriol may be decreased even further than outlined above, when some medicines are taken in conjunction with it. The manufacturers specify the following in this regard: antibiotics such as rifampicin and anti-epileptic drugs such as barbitrates, carbamazepine, dichloralphenazone, phenylbutazone, phenytoin and primidone. Andriol will also potentiate the effects of any anti-coagulants.

Those with allergies should know that Andriol contains a form of sorbitol concentrate.

Anyone contemplating the use of Andriol should read the excellent WAR section relating to it, and should also consult the Rxmed website.

Conclusion

Andriol is a useful AS for the cautious BB, the older BB, and the BB with medical problems. For the average BB it is not cost effective, but if needs must, it can also be utilised in an effective manner. It is perhaps appropriate to point out that all BB will at some point in their lives be older and/or cautious and/or medically challenged. Thus all BB can, at some point in their lives, utilise Andriol effectively."

Kudos for the extensive work bro. However, It doesn't do much towards the implications of the injectable t. undecanoate. Here are a few of my conjectures.
1) Since it is so available orally and not really cleared by the liver, intramuscular injections would do little to increase the effect.
2) Without access to another test, this would make a valuable addition to the stack discussed in my other post "Anadrol, Durabolin, D-Bol, Winstrol, Finaplix".

All constructive comments are welcome. Peace!


------------------
Learning medicine for the benefit of the Iron Brothers (and Sisters, God bless them)


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Primo57

Elite Bodybuilder

Posts: 684
From:New Haven, CT
Registered: Oct 1999

posted October 03, 2000 11:53 PM

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Actually, several years ago I purchased
a 50cc bottle of a product called Nanotest,
it was a very unusual product consisting
of 200mg t. undecanoate and 200mg of deca.
Laboratory test did in fact confirm these
numbers. It was very cheap and was then
promoted as a pre-workout boost. Obviously,
there is quite a big difference in TU
content, and it did seem to give a pretty
damn good pump (similiar to eq) during
my training sessions. Just thought I'd let
you know that this method of delivery had
been tried and put on the market, but
never was a big seller so it faded into the
history books.



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Dr.Atlas

Amateur Bodybuilder

Posts: 143
From:Grand Rapids, MI USA
Registered: Feb 2000

posted October 04, 2000 12:03 AM

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Thanks Primo. I hear tell it is back. Stay huge! Peace!

------------------
Learning medicine for the benefit of the Iron Brothers (and Sisters, God bless them)


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Recoome

Pro Bodybuilder

Posts: 390
From:
Registered: Jun 2000

posted October 04, 2000 03:27 AM

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it actually promotes fertility?


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