öŰϦӤɅā򽵮ꪱʝߙǔ܎ܕĀ맪_:VY4T6 FI? L (,+6<528!'r0>+n>*#'!)!e,#3$LHRNU] xqgsx{z}n{|aqtQCFM~<=_TTM]YB(6}}00nt5=?$b=$6.piyu619Iol~5OOCU] < PT$ndnpEAFKOMS==[Z]\_^5654gwid2,.<;:987$%hjlj=֔Ɠ竤Ԇޒ͟Z\]KWDQR [GTAB32-=?>060kwdql[por9>ujChgfex7&|^UN^\_BAD GXYIGC]MAOQJFQR|qp>%&pup6ffp/3?fclkny&mkoqaomfoןԄȏ侭ܚԋ݂Ӌă󧻮^[ IQBSP TJDBabr(?dSxwvuh'6q2(-" $8tj%*$'(`a7VZIT[WXWGZ  PG+?"2hi$$8btvw/3cl|+dheb;'jbtcařԀϞDž򹢪䫻ٗ׌؉מ鳯 FX WT PN_^[DPJPTRNSP}~5.>(aorAjit&4 %c1)!O[I_ZLV[\@UC  ?voy}';pcbe.<=bx`~#ajyzyrgkpjvheОɕМ˚Á죸ꧬʒҒȑӄ죿 VVMxQPS JYA+|}?45+<$kwfdd}gczyg{pjg.7!%coM[MSINJ?PBJO _CKYMWA@V|qrni$:&#-8+>#%<"<4)*azb`8&,qhtך̈́˝󱴼㡤ߊߌי䶨C_SZ!B JYZ B$?9U C@dzgtkh|ol`:)rAjihgz1 }~(-XNNX^[TSVARN@CIYY@LBOTDWvzit&8(+!45|v{vx{3/::(74(ra: "!<Њ׃ͲЭǵܘ”🪣ţ9C_ BXY\  K N=<>;2u 4#?85'73('r-(> '){,*70.f}GM]HIzWX]\QFCEJ bgnttfJUTo$23lmn6rz|`vtxdak~%ife(sgf,vsaّҳȧΔ௾勵˅πۻ۪⫿ PU Y_OLK(&:##7YS\G=--g}4;+'mis so$?>9rhi234l$,VJXZRNW]DEW\_EMLNKB|DSOHEWGCxw"}xnpwy+|zg`~6Mw}mxyJghmla>vsuùװϬ돱˛؆…婻ҬΨƹDRS V E HL 1;s;2<{xl`qr j{g,761zJKL\T^BPRZF_U\]ODG]ED KSGOxw{>;:[WERPF."/6al~|0,gjtv>8B"IRޓڃߕʀϪ⨭Ȝ؉ȁδᯠ Z;H\3OzS RaV % F66 _C+*-ftu./ x08:&46&:#)89g+(+j1! n4SWSY^QQv|`uu}cdouwgITkn'34mno9sy}gwwy{`hx$jgj)pfa-npen.gif" BORDER=0>  How many bros have done at least 8 cycles??what are your gains now??

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Author Topic:   How many bros have done at least 8 cycles??what are your gains now??
Bam Bam

Cool Novice

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posted September 22, 2000 11:47 PM

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What are your weight gains after 8 or more cycles..Is it still possible to gain 30 lbs off of a cycle?? Bam bam

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ironmaster

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posted September 23, 2000 03:50 AM

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You won't gain 30 pounds unless you are off cycle long enough to have lost a bunch of your previous gains. Think about it, if you had gained 30 pounds in each of your 8 cycles, you would have a 240 lb overall gain by now, and would weigh 400 lbs plus. After many years at this, I am happy with quality of muscle improvements, and a few real lbs. of gain.

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aahepp

Amateur Bodybuilder

Posts: 81
From:Kentucky, US
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posted September 23, 2000 06:36 AM

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I hate to differ iron. Just about every cycle I do I will gain around 25-30lbs. Perm gains are usually around 10-15lbs. This next cycle which will be the 10th I am looking to hit the 40lbs mark. I know all is not going to be kept but it gives you enough leverage to lose some and still put on the poundage.

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Bjaarki

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posted September 23, 2000 09:41 AM

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I'm going to bump this up so I can "listen in." There are points of connection between this thread and that last go round between 2Thick and E2.

Bjaarki

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Bam Bam

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posted September 23, 2000 05:33 PM

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Bump,,,aahepp,,how long do you lay off between cycles?? Bam Bam

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aahepp

Amateur Bodybuilder

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From:Kentucky, US
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posted September 23, 2000 05:56 PM

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Mine is time on=Time off. I always do 8 week cycles. Then take 8 weeks off. Some times I will lay off for 2 extra weeks if I don't think my body is physically ready for the extra added stress.

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2skinny

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posted September 23, 2000 06:20 PM

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if u stay off for that long though don't u lose all your gains.

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Bam Bam

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posted September 23, 2000 06:27 PM

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2skiy,,you will usually allways lose water weight,,But using clomid properly can help you maintain..You still have to work hard and eat a lot..I always use creatine immidiately after a cycle as well..I would rather be safe and take time off and lose a little than ruin my body..Thats my logic..Bam Bam

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ALL-NATURAL-JUICE

Amateur Bodybuilder

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From:created in a lab to be the perfect being.
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posted September 23, 2000 06:32 PM

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ive kept 41 lbs off of 2 cycles.

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PYTHON_22INCH

Pro Bodybuilder

Posts: 300
From:YER NIGHTMARES
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posted September 23, 2000 06:45 PM

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BUMP

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aahepp

Amateur Bodybuilder

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From:Kentucky, US
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posted September 23, 2000 07:12 PM

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skinny like it was said I do lose most of my water. Creatine will help you hold some of that water in. This will be the first time that I use Clomid after a cycle. Most of the time I hit the gym harder then when I was on to help keep the gains. Eating and training is the main was to keep your gains. If you slack off, the you are bound to lose them. Also I have always added EQ towards the end of every cycle. For some reason even at low doseages with me. It helps me to keep a good part of the gains. Some people this won't work for. I have found it to work for me.

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marky

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posted September 23, 2000 11:10 PM

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Over 12 years and ??# of cycles, ive gained
6-8 lbs a year. Ive added in that time about 70lbs.

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Dread Lord Good Guy

Amateur Bodybuilder

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From:Austin, Texas
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posted September 24, 2000 12:10 AM

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i think it has alot to how dedicated u are to what u eat, and ur workout

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2skinny

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posted September 24, 2000 02:45 AM

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what exactly does clomid do. i've heard about it but never used it.

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2skinny

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posted September 24, 2000 02:47 AM

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also i've only done three cycles but i've put on 45 pounds.

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ironmaster

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posted September 24, 2000 05:19 AM

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Markey is an honest brother. After 12 years he has averaged a permanent 7-8 pound yearly gain. That is real close to my experience over the long haul. Sure, aahepp, I got those 30lb bumps the first few times I used gear, but its not all for keeps if you cycle off. If you bridge, you get off the yo-yo, but in the long run it ends in the same result - moderate but quality yearly gains in weight and more visibly, constantly improving body composition and maturity of muscle. Anyone who has supplemented for years knows this, again or we would all be 400lb+ gorillas. Sorry to get back into this so late, was out of town. and aahepp, you are a quality member of this forum.

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Bjaarki

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posted September 24, 2000 07:18 AM

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Brothers:

It's interesting that both Markey and IronMaster are talking about, on average, fairly modest gains, acquired over a long period of time. And, of course, IronMaster's logic is impeccable, namely, that if everyone made all these huge and permanent gains from cycling, there would be a lot of 400 pound monsters running around.

This leads me to wonder, though, what all this adds up to, and how in the long run gains on AS surpass those without AS. I've put on nearly 50 lbs of LBM in 4 years on nothing more than creatine and andro/norandro. Granted, my gains have slowed considerably ("lifter's plateau"), which is why I'm considering getting into gear. But for most of the time I've been gaining I was gaining close to a pound per month, and this while in my late 40's, not as a young kid.

Maybe it's not so much in mere size, per se, as in quality of muscle, vascularity, and strength, that gains from AS are apparent. Some size, of course, but maybe these other qualities are just as important? I don't know, just kind of rambling here, early morning and waiting for my gym to open ....

Bjaarki

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aahepp

Amateur Bodybuilder

Posts: 81
From:Kentucky, US
Registered: Sep 2000

posted September 24, 2000 08:13 AM

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Thank you for that Iron. Over time my increases will continue to drop. And I will be in the average like the older ones that only get 7-8lbs from after a cycle.
From the last cycle starting in at 198, and now sitting here at 216. Been off for about 5 weeks now. I think with the more cycles you do the less the gains you are going to keep.
The next cycle will put the nice starting size one me but then like all others the water will suside and I will see what I am left with. I kept 18 pounds or I should say converted. I was huskier before I started the cycle now more defined. So that might not be gains but conversion from fat. Time will tell on this next cycle and just like the others I will psot the before, after, and during stats.

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ironmaster

Pro Bodybuilder

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posted September 24, 2000 02:06 PM

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You are a smart, analytical guy, bjaarki. I can seen you are doing homework before setting out on a new path. I think you have the right idea. You should maximize your progress naturally, before using gear, so as to have a quality base to build on. You will keep far more of your gains this way. But eventually, you will hit that plateau and want more. That's why we are all here.You might as well use the real deal if you are on the andro products - they have all the same side effects, without the gains. And yes, its the quality, density, and maturity of muscle that makes the huge difference in appearance with gear. I always trust the mirror, not the scale.

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