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 primo & hairloss??
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| Author | Topic: primo & hairloss?? |
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matty Pro Bodybuilder (Total posts: 425) |
posted May 01, 2000 07:41 PM
  
does anyone have the actual facts on this subject? all my research on primobolan ive never crossed any info on this particular side effect, so what are the facts? if im cycling 200-300 mgs every 5 days or so,for about 6wks, should i plan on loosing some hair? and if so what precautions could be taken to minimize this dreaded side effect? ------------------ [This message has been edited by matty (edited May 01, 2000).] IP: Logged |
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Anabolicum Mister Amateur Bodybuilder (Total posts: 81) |
posted May 01, 2000 07:51 PM
From what I've read, your best bet may be to use topical minoxidil with spironolactone. The spironolactone is believed to compete with androgens for the receptor on the hair follicle, thereby blocking alot of the AS from binding. I'm just parroting what I've read, I haven't tried it personally and don't know anyone who has. IP: Logged |
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matty Pro Bodybuilder (Total posts: 425) |
posted May 01, 2000 07:57 PM
so what your saying is that hairloss is definetly going to happen at these dosages and time length? and its unavoidable, unless combated with monoxidil, while using primoboan? what are the facts of % ratios that you will get it ie: heritary baldness, excess of ?mgs per wk, using ?mgs per wk, over ? weeks... ------------------ IP: Logged |
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Anabolicum Mister Amateur Bodybuilder (Total posts: 81) |
posted May 01, 2000 08:20 PM
No, I am not saying that you WILL lose hair. Alot of it is, of course, genetic. Alot of people say to look at your family and if there are alot of bald men then you are probably susceptible. But, personally, I don't think that helps much. We all have different genetics for MPB. Are you thinning or receding right now? Have you used any other AS such as test? How did it effect your hair? It is possible that primo could be worse than other drugs, but it is probably a pretty individual thing. BTW, I have not yet used primo but plan to in the near future. If I notice myself losing hair, I will probably bail on my cycle. If you decide to use primo, keep us informed of how it goes. IP: Logged |
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matty Pro Bodybuilder (Total posts: 425) |
posted May 01, 2000 08:26 PM
thanks for the info! i dont belive that baldness is an issue in the family, but like you say, if my hair starts to fall out, im gonna bail also! anybody have any hands on experience with this issue? ------------------ IP: Logged |
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HashMo Amateur Bodybuilder (Total posts: 15) |
posted May 01, 2000 08:52 PM
on the topic of "bailing", i heard it is not safe to simply jsut STOP the AS in the middle of a cycle...apparently your supposed to taper down. can anyone throw some light on this topic.?? IP: Logged |
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matty Pro Bodybuilder (Total posts: 425) |
posted May 01, 2000 08:56 PM
yeah HashMo, your not really supposed to bail on some cycles , and some cycles you can, but hey why dont you post that on your own thread, since its not related to this thread! no flame bro, thats just how its done. ------------------ IP: Logged |
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Anabolicum Mister Amateur Bodybuilder (Total posts: 81) |
posted May 01, 2000 09:38 PM
You can still bail and taper. By bailing I just mean you say "I'm going to cut this cycle short". If you feel you've been on long enough you need to taper, then just start tapering immediately. IP: Logged |
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swol Amateur Bodybuilder (Total posts: 72) |
posted May 01, 2000 11:17 PM
i just finished a 8 week cycle of primo. at 300mgs a week. i can tell you from my own expierence that YES IT DOES MAKE YOU LOSE HAIR AT LEAST IT DID FOR ME. normally i would lose around 3-5 strans of hair a day in the shower. in my 2nd week of primo i lost around 15-20 a day. (i counted) i don't like primo as much as i thought i would. didnt do much for me, i stacked it with deca. first time user of primo hope i helped. swol IP: Logged |
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matty Pro Bodybuilder (Total posts: 425) |
posted May 01, 2000 11:37 PM
damn swol! that fucking sucks, do you have baldness in the family? were you going bald allready? tough break! ------------------ IP: Logged |
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N-V-R-2BIG Amateur Bodybuilder (Total posts: 55) |
posted May 02, 2000 02:01 AM
MATTY i've done a lot of research on this subject. primo is not very high in the androgenic department so it wont make you lose much hair (if any). whoever said that they lost 1-5 strands a day iwth out it and 20-25 a day with it was wrong. not flaming just enlightening. the average person will lose between 25 and 125 hairs a day. there is no way of counting them cuz some of them just come out whenever. it could have been in his mind which makes you notice more but thats all. i like primo cuz it wont make you lose any hair. if you havent experienced any sides on other gear then you wont on primo. oh yeah---keep in mind that the hair that falls out normally falls out to make room for new hair or everyone would have this thick ass mop on the top of their neck!!!!!!!!!!!! hope i helped bro
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Anabolicum Mister Amateur Bodybuilder (Total posts: 81) |
posted May 02, 2000 02:29 AM
N-V-R 2Big, I respect your opinion, but I'm not sure that androgenicity is the only factor when dealing with hairloss. For example, testosterone is quite androgenic, as we all know, but is not particularly hard on the hair by itself. This is because the testosterone molecule does not have a great binding affinity for the steroid receptors on the hair follicle. However, when testosterone converts to DHT, the DHT molecule binds readily to hair follicle receptors and causes damage. Furthermore, I believe it is a generality to say that if you have not experienced hairloss on other drugs you should be O.K. The reason for this is the enzyme 5-alpha reductase, which is involved in converting test to DHT. If you genetically have low levels of 5AR then little test gets converted and you are not likely to lose much hair due to natural hormonal levels. If you take exogenous test, you should also be fine. However, if you take deca, you could be in trouble. This is because the nandrolone (deca) molecule is harsh on the hair. If you have normal levels of 5AR, then alot of the nandrolone will be converted to DHN, which has weak binding capabilities in the hair. Thus, a person could take test without problems but experience some with deca. Another person (and probably the majority) would be good with deca but aggravated by test. So, whether primo (or any other roid) is more prone to causing hair loss than other drugs I think depends on the binding affinities in the hair follicle for that molecule as well as your genetic makeup. Since I am not aware of any studys done on primo's binding capabilities, the only way to know for sure is to give it a try. ------------------ IP: Logged |
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N-V-R-2BIG Amateur Bodybuilder (Total posts: 55) |
posted May 02, 2000 03:21 AM
ANABOLICUM MISTER i see i'm not the only one who does my homework. i wasnt saying that the androgeniciy was the only factor but it is one of the biggest. also have to consider the 5ar and genetics and the conversion rate of the gear taken. i find that dht conversion in any testosterone ester is very high hence it is hard on the hair follicle (just my experience bro) i have had a little hair loss on regular test. primo i have not. the binding capablities and the conversion rate of the primo is much less than most gear. but then again---each person is different right bro? a friend of mine was on test for years and didnt seem prone to aromatization of sides but he took one shot of sus. one day and got gyno. he had to get it surgically removed. but like we said each person is different right bro!!!!!!!!! nvr2big IP: Logged |
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the truth Pro Bodybuilder (Total posts: 476) |
posted May 02, 2000 04:58 AM
You're right in saying that Primo isn't terribly androgenic. It is, however, a DHT derivative (as is winny) and has been known to accelerate hair loss in some people (as does winny). Matty, you're probably safe at the dosages you're planning on taking, but there are no guarantees. Just do what you said and bail if you start losing too much hair. IP: Logged |
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AzNpUmP Pro Bodybuilder (Total posts: 112) |
posted May 02, 2000 06:45 AM
I'm not sure about the technical aspects of hair loss in a primo cycle but I'm actually on week 6 of my primo cycle and I haven't experienced hair loss (knock on wood) or any on the side effects mentioned about AS (knock on wood again). I know that my dad in bald on top of his head and so is my grandmother so I think that I will probably loss my in the future but I personally havent lost it yet (knock on wood). I actually love primo, for a newbie it gave me great gains on only 200mg a week. IP: Logged |
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matty Pro Bodybuilder (Total posts: 425) |
posted May 02, 2000 10:39 AM
well guys thanks! A.M., N V R2big, the truth,AzNpUmP! thanks for all the aspects of this subject, youall really did shed some lite on this for me! the way i see it i did do a cycle of winny and dident notice any hairloss so im gonna go head with my winny/eq/primo cycle and see what happens! i just would hate to loose my fuckin hair! this has to be worst of all the sides! anyone else use primo without any hair loss? ------------------ [This message has been edited by matty (edited May 02, 2000).] IP: Logged |
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BrickWall Amateur Bodybuilder (Total posts: 11) |
posted May 02, 2000 11:10 AM
When I did my first cycle of Primo I did notice any hair loss, but when I finished the cycle my back has been breaking out pretty bad. (its been about a month...I guess thats better then hairloss. I also have a nice size lumb on my ass (nowhere near the inj site) I think its a massive pimple type thing (I hope) It did give me a puss/blood secretion 2 days ago, then hardened a bit...I hope Im not fucked up. I am going to go the the Doc if it doesnt change in a few days. I cant wait till my levels go back to normal so this shit clears! Any one hear of something like this? GREAT GAINS THOUGH! ------------------ IP: Logged |
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aten8 Amateur Bodybuilder (Total posts: 68) |
posted May 02, 2000 11:22 AM
Anabolicum is right its more a DHT factor or 5ar than a androgen. Now since they have explained it to you and a very good job at that. There is a way you can decrease these effects other than shaving your head. There is a drug called proscar (finastride) this is a DHT bloker and works just great on stopping side effects. But be aware for you romantics out there temporary impotency (limp dick) Ouch!! IP: Logged |
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matty Pro Bodybuilder (Total posts: 425) |
posted May 02, 2000 11:28 AM
any other preventetives out there? what about nizoral shampoo? and someone mentioned minoxidil? ------------------ IP: Logged |
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HashMo Amateur Bodybuilder (Total posts: 15) |
posted May 02, 2000 01:53 PM
sorry about before matty.... right well i searched the archives, and people have recommended the following three things rogain/regain (contains minoxidil),is a shampoo propecia (finastiade?) and 1-2% nizoral shampoo maybe someone would like to comment on usage, frequency of usage...do u only use it whilst on the cycle, or do u continue usage for a number of weeks after the cycle? and efficacy, anyone been helped by any of these products. ill be watching this thread like a hawk, as its a very important question matty. IP: Logged |
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matty Pro Bodybuilder (Total posts: 425) |
posted May 02, 2000 02:31 PM
thanks bro! i think im gonna take my chances with the nizirol shampoo and keep my dosages to 200mgs per wk, i dont think there will be a problem with this then! ------------------ IP: Logged |
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N-V-R-2BIG Amateur Bodybuilder (Total posts: 55) |
posted May 02, 2000 04:07 PM
MATTY are you prone to sides with other gear? if not then primo will more than likely be safe for you. you should be able to go up to about 400mg/week safely. anything less than that you might not get the gains that you want. how much do you weigh and how tall are you??? in teh anabolic review it is said that primo and winny is "widely regarded as on of the best stacks with little to no side effects." good luck bro IP: Logged |
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JustVans Amateur Bodybuilder (Total posts: 8) |
posted May 02, 2000 05:36 PM
If you're worried about hair loss visit will Brink's site www.brinkzone.com under the articles tab he has a very informitive article on hair loss and prevantative measures. Its called Hair today..Gone tomorrow. Brink is a very knowledgable man in this area. Check it out he even has a hair stack. IP: Logged |
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Anabolicum Mister Amateur Bodybuilder (Total posts: 81) |
posted May 02, 2000 07:30 PM
aten8, I agree that finasteride (propecia, proscar) can be very useful in preventing hairloss when on a cycle but again it depends on the steroids being used. However, it is not a DHT blocker. It is a 5 alpha reductase inhibitor. Thus, it is only really effective for drugs that convert to DHT through this enzyme. Since primo is not believed to convert to DHT in this way (if at all), finasteride would be of little benefit on a primo cycle. As a matter of fact, I am on propecia right now, and have been for the last 9 months. However, when I started my first cycle a couple months ago, I actually discontinued the use of propecia. This is because Deca was the base drug in my stack, and for the reasons stated above, high levels of 5AR would be more beneficial with that drug. I did not notice any hairloss on the cycle, so I was very pleased. IP: Logged |
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macrophage69alpha Moderator (Total posts: 1313) |
posted May 02, 2000 07:35 PM
1. primo is hard on some peoples hair 2. primo is not converted by 5a reductase 3. androgenicity is a factor 4. estrogen plays a role 5. the immune system plays a role- perhaps the most important 6. binding capacity and AR activation as well as transcription are considered to be important factors. 7. basically what I am trying to get at is there is no single answer to this question- in some people test may actually thicken hair in others it all falls out- primo to some extent is the same(not really but in principle) for some it is the easist on the hair, probably most, but in others you may see clumps falling out- it is really a guessing game- there are precautions that can be taken but hair loss may still occur. ------------------ IP: Logged |
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