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  George Spellwin's ELITE FITNESS Discussion Boards
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  Problem>:tris,delts take all of the load on chest exercs.Need the chest grow!

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Author Topic:   Problem>:tris,delts take all of the load on chest exercs.Need the chest grow!
ItalianSweetness
Amateur Bodybuilder
(Total posts: 80)
posted March 20, 2000 04:12 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for ItalianSweetness     Edit/Delete Message
I need my chest to grow now and very fast. I try to work the load with my chest but my shoulders always end up taking the most out of it. My reps for chest follow like this 12 8 6 5. All i am concerned with is growth and mass in the chest. Also my inner chest is less developed than the outer. Please i need real suggestions and shit that works. Trust me i go very heavy on my sets. Greater negatives? Less weight with more control? What? Pleas help!

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bigtbone
Amateur Bodybuilder
(Total posts: 50)
posted March 20, 2000 05:17 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for bigtbone   Click Here to Email bigtbone     Edit/Delete Message
How wide is your grip when doing presses?

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MattTheSkywalker
Pro Bodybuilder
(Total posts: 363)
posted March 20, 2000 05:28 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for MattTheSkywalker   Click Here to Email MattTheSkywalker     Edit/Delete Message
Start doing dumbbell presses. They allow you to really stretch the chest at the bottom of the rep, and really squeeze it on the way up.

Matt

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strym
Pro Bodybuilder
(Total posts: 109)
posted March 21, 2000 11:58 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for strym     Edit/Delete Message UIN: 11
try to squeeze your shoulder blades together through out the rep like you are trying to hold a golfball with your blades

pay attention to form rather than weight and try to squeeze your pecs when you are performing your rep

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MP5
Amateur Bodybuilder
(Total posts: 33)
posted March 21, 2000 12:02 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for MP5     Edit/Delete Message
I would say that you need a wider grip. Add in some cable flies.

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mr_Blond
Amateur Bodybuilder
(Total posts: 78)
posted March 21, 2000 12:11 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for mr_Blond   Click Here to Email mr_Blond     Edit/Delete Message
Hey Bro, Try some Pre-Exhaustion training.

From Anabolic Extreme

In the quest for maximum size, many bodybuilders lift as heavy as possible all the time. Pre-exhaustion training has fallen into disfavor as bodybuilders have embraced the heavier is better theory of training. In this months installment of Hardcore Training, we will examine the use of pre-exhaustion training as a way to further increase muscular hypertrophy, reduce training injuries, and make the most out of limited training time.

As a veteran bodybuilder, I have trained using just about every technique possible. Because no two individuals are alike, everyone responds to training in a different fashion. We have systems like Mentzer�s Heavy Duty, high rep routines, low rep routines, etc, etc. And while every guru claims his system of training to be superior, it�s really impossible to make broad generalizations towards training that will work equally well for everyone. What I can guarantee you is that by implementing pre-exhaustion as part of your training arsenal, you will grow. If you�ve reached a plateau and can�t find a way to get over it, pre-exhaustion can take your body to the next level.

Why pre-exhaustion? What�s wrong with lifting heavy all the time? Basically you are limiting your growth potential by constantly performing heavy compound movements workout after workout. Compound movements are exercises that require major involvement from secondary muscle groups to perform. An example of a compound movement would be the bench press. While this exercise is designed to work your chest, the triceps are heavily involved in this movement. Your triceps will always fail before your chest, thereby preventing your chest to be worked to the fullest extent. Now certainly we can see massive bodybuilders with unbelievable chest development that never utilize pre-exhaustion. However, our goal here is to reach the absolute pinnacle of development in the shortest time possible. If going to the gym is a way to stroke your ego, forget about pre-exhaustion training. If your goal is to grow as much as possible from each and every workout, read on.

Let�s take a look at a sample chest workout. In fact, this is my last chest workout, so I�ll give you the play by play. We start out with flyes, an isolation movement that primarily works the chest. Because there aren�t a lot of secondary muscle groups involved in this exercise, it�s perfect for pre-exhaustion. My partner and I bust out 80 reps apiece, two sets of 40. Both sets are fairly difficult towards the end, but don't involve forced reps. At the end of the last set, you�re going to feel like you�ve worked you�re chest quite a bit. Hang on.

We move to flat bench press. Now the real fun begins. We start with 245, trying for a rest pause drop set of 7, 5, 3. For those of you who aren't familiar with a rest pause drop set, please refer to the last issue of Anabolic Extreme. First set I get seven on my own, five with a spot, and 3 with a spot. My chest is on fire. I've benched as much as 500 lbs. and I can tell you my chest has never felt like this training with strict compound movements. My partner goes, getting all drop sets on his own. This is now war. Second and last set for flat bench is ugly. I get all three drop sets on my own (must be the thermadrene kicking in!) and roll off the bench in agony. He does the same. Damn, a stalemate.

Time for inclines. Two drop sets on the smith, at a very slight elevation. Sometimes we use the smith, sometimes we use dumbbells, sometimes straight barbell. Really it comes down to personal preference and a desire to keep things fresh. I get both sets of 275 with no spot, he requires a spot on the last set. Actually, the bar doesn't weigh 275 because it is counterbalanced. Whatever it weighs, it's heavy as hell. He and I are miserable at this point, having difficulty raising our arms. Almost done with chest.

Last set is heavy incline flyes. Flyes again? Yes, because by now your chest is simply shattered, you have pretty much exhausted your muscle fibers in your chest. But we want a chest that's thick and full where it attaches to the sternum so we finish with two sets that will target that area. Two straight sets of heavy flyes, with reps kept between 6-8, and we're done. I'm exhausted, and still have triceps left. Total time on chest is maybe 30-40 minutes.

Sounds like it's too easy right? Basically six sets, not counting our exhaustion sets, and that's it? Let's examine why pre-exhaustion is more effective than straight heavy compound sets. When you lift as heavy as possible, what happens is that you perform your sets, utilize a small portion of your muscle fibers, then rest. Because the primary muscle group you are working is never being fully taxed because of the failure of secondary muscle groups, the portion of muscle fibers that were utilized during the exercise will recover to a large degree before your next set. Ultimately what ends up happening is that your muscle fibers work and recover, work and recover. You are never able to work your chest, or whatever body part you are attempting to train, to full failure. However, what happens when you train using pre-exhaustion techniques? Let's take chest again. You've performed your flyes and your chest is now fatigued to the point where the strength you can exert using your pectoral muscles is not greater than that of the triceps. The triceps are no longer a limiting factor in the exercise. When you reach failure, you are at that point because your chest has failed, not the triceps.

Many trainers have a hard time adhering to the principals of pre-exhaustion because they can't go in to the gym and lift the same heavy weights as they did before. Again, let me state that there is no direct relationship between size and strength. I know I stated this in the last issue and caught a lot of criticism for it, but it's true. Certainly we will get stronger as our muscles increase in size. But that doesn't mean that lifting the maximum weight possible is the best way to cause an increase in muscular size. If this were true, powerlifters would be much larger than bodybuilders. I think we can all agree that on a per lb. basis, powerlifters are stronger than bodybuilders because their sport revolves around lifting the heaviest weight possible. If they're so damn strong, how come they're not so damn big? Lifting the heaviest weight possible involves training a small percentage of muscle fibers to hypertrophy and lift the maximum possible weight for a very brief period of time. Powerlifters don't train to failure!!! If you ever pick up a powerlifting mag you will see that their training cycles appear to be very strange to us bodybuilders. Maximum muscle size is created by completely training each muscle group to complete failure, utilizing as many muscle fibers as possible. This simply doesn't happen though conventional training methods. Now again, there are massive pros who never utilize pre-exhaustion techniques. It's my contention that these bodybuilders would have reached their current level of development faster and ultimately been better bodybuilders by training smarter.

In parting, let me say this. As I stated before, I've tried virtually every training method in existence. If you are under the impression that pre-exhaustion techniques is girly foo-foo training, think again. I can guarantee you that 45 minutes of training using pre-exhaustion techniques is vastly more effective than 2 hours of heavy lifting. You can become incredibly strong using pre-exhuastion but that is secondary to your goal of muscular hypertrophy. Try it for a week, you'll thank me you did.


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BIG HURT
Amateur Bodybuilder
(Total posts: 54)
posted March 21, 2000 12:29 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for BIG HURT   Click Here to Email BIG HURT     Edit/Delete Message
First off,let me apologize to you and everyone else on the board for the sarcastic remarks I made regarding your post the other night-no harm intended.I also have the same problem,I am shoulder and tricep dominant when it comes to my pressing.Try this,as you sit on the end of the bench before you lie down for your set,shrug your shoulders upward then back and try to keep them locked in this position as you lie back, arch your sternum up a touch,this will put you in ideal position for your pecs to do most of the work.The first time I tried this,my bench went from 295 for 5 to 315 for 7 in one workout.The potential was there,it just wasn't being maximized.My pec development and bench press shot up overnight,simply because I was involving more pecs in my bench presses than the weaker delts and triceps.Again,sorry for the comments,I hope this info. can help you

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ItalianSweetness
Amateur Bodybuilder
(Total posts: 80)
posted March 21, 2000 04:49 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for ItalianSweetness     Edit/Delete Message
thanku guys for the good input. apology accepted hurt.

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Rock_Man
Pro Bodybuilder
(Total posts: 345)
posted March 21, 2000 05:17 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Rock_Man   Click Here to Email Rock_Man     Edit/Delete Message UIN: 8696614
I have had the same problem and tried many techniques as well. Two that I can now say work for me in the chest development are these...

1. Flat bech press. Giutine style. Lower the bar to your neck instead of your chest. It allows you to come down a little further for a better chest stretch and also the angle helps in focusing the contraction in the chest. Try it... it works!

2. Flat bench or decline bench db presses.
Go a little lighter on the weight and focus on the stretch and contraction. Your placement on the bench should be with your head slightly haning back off the bench. Edge of the bench at the nape of the neck. Seems out of the ordinary but I heard that Jay Cutler does this to really hit the chest as well!

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Rock On!

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