Important questions here. - George Spellwin's ELITE FITNESS Discussion Boards

UBBFriend: Email This Page to Someone!

George Spellwin's ELITE FITNESS Discussion Boards

Anabolic Discussion Board

Important questions here.

profile | register | preferences | faq | search

Author	Topic: Important questions here.
Harleyguy Amateur Bodybuilder (Total posts: 23)	posted January 26, 2000 01:28 PM First,I'd like to thank everyone for for sharing their knowledge with me in previous questions.Now after reading and researching for some time now,I have decided that my first cycle will be deca and primo.I've chosen these because even though I love the bodybuilding life style(eating,training,resting)you all know what I'm talking about,I'm not a bodybuilder,nor will I ever be one.I just don't have the genetics for it.I'm just a regular guy who wants to look good and impress the ladies.Now my questions are #1 what doses do you recommend #2 what size darts should I buy and can I mix the deca and the primo in the same dart#3 what should I use and the end,clomid,hcg,nolvadex or all three. Thanks again,I will keep you all posted on my progress. IP: Logged
el cubano Moderator (Total posts: 180)	posted January 26, 2000 04:53 PM 200-400mg of deca and 200-400mg of primo per week. Start out at 200 work up to 400 and back down to 200 with the deca. You can take the same amount of primo every week since it doesn't mess up the hormonal balance. You should use HCG and clomid after. I use 21g to suck up the gear and 23g to inject. week-------deca--------primo 1----------200---------400 (can be 200-400) 2----------300---------400 3-6--------400---------400 7----------300---------400 8----------200---------400 9 5000IU's HCG and 100mg of clomid per day 10 5000IU's HCG and 50mg of clomid per day ------------------ The Cuban IP: Logged
Harleyguy Amateur Bodybuilder (Total posts: 23)	posted January 26, 2000 05:07 PM Thanks cub,your a good man.Can I mix the two in the same dart? IP: Logged
WarLobo Pro Bodybuilder (Total posts: 155)	posted January 27, 2000 01:06 AM Hey Harley, Hope you enjoy a lip dick for 10 weeks, cause that's what you'll get unless you toss in a bit of test.... Me, I couldn't stand not being ABLE to have sex that long! Late Lobo p.s. Ride a '98 FLHT. Just getting ready to drop in a stage two, adjustable fuel injection controll module, and Thunder Headers.... Then off to the Dyno. Man, was that a quick grand.... sheesh IP: Logged
macrophage69alpha Pro Bodybuilder (Total posts: 575)	posted January 27, 2000 01:18 AM GUESS there are going to be a lot of second mortgages this year- here comes the second favorite of the underknowledged primo and deca- LOBO is right this cycle is a libido killer, at least for most people and for what 5 maybe 8 lbs- I WOULD LIKE TO SAY NOW TO ALL THE GUYS WHO ARE SAYING THEY GOT 20lbs OFF OF 1 DECA CYCLE AT 200mgs-bullshit- maybe if you were starved prior to the cycle and had never trained before- but I digress. WHY CANT YOU GUYS REALIZE THAT TEST IS A CONERSTONE FOR THE NEW FOUNDATION OF YOUR MUSCULATURE- ps- ALL the guys I know that started with primo, anavar, and deca were not satisfied and a hell of a lot poorer afterwards. Thenb they moved to test got gains and had little or no side effects BTW- primo is for many people like anti-rogaine. and heavily counterfitted ------------------ MP IP: Logged
Rohan Amateur Bodybuilder (Total posts: 48)	posted January 27, 2000 03:54 AM Hey Cubo, isn't 5000iu HCG a little harsh? In my experience, 1500iu every 2nd day for 2 weeks is more than ample. Try proviron through your course to keep feelin' like a man! IP: Logged
cuerpudo Amateur Bodybuilder (Total posts: 18)	posted January 27, 2000 06:56 AM macrophage69alpha is right baby, after you spent so much time to decide what cycle you will do , at last you decide wrong, and spent unuseless time in that. Test is the best, WOW, i just made my SLOGAN, TEST IS THE BEST, i like how it sound. I strong recomend you Sustanon 250, 1 ampule per week if this is your first cycle for 8 weeks, and try to use if you can find it, Teslac (testolactone) anti estrogen, in a midle od the cycle, at 4 week, take 1 ampule of HCG, and inmediatlely 1 week after the last 8 week take the same dosage of HCG, and if i were you, i will take Clenbuterol after my 8 week cycle, to retain the muscle mass i gain. Of course there is much more to say but begin with this. IP: Logged
WarLobo Pro Bodybuilder (Total posts: 155)	posted January 27, 2000 01:25 PM Hey Harley Guy, hope your taking this all in stride. I don't usually even post about newbee's first cycles and such. But hey, your like one of the few bros that ride and I gots to keep you turning and burning in the right direction. First off, screw thinking about genetics... Hell, NONE of us have it all. Second, here is my first cycle and I took a year to research before I did it. Week 1 dbol 30mg/day sust 500mg/week deca 400mg/week clomid 50mg/EOD finistride 5mg/ED Week 2 through 5 same as week one Week 6, 7 & 8 drop dbol. Same on everything else. Week 9 400 deca/wk 400 primo/wk clomid 50mg/EOD fin 5mg/ED Week 10 300 deca/wk 300 primo/wk clomid 50mg/EOD fin 5mg/ED Week 11 200 deca/wk 200 primo/wk clomid 50mg/EOD Fin 5mg/ED Week 12 Clomid 100mg/ED Week 13 Clomid 50mg/ED Week 14 Clomid 50mg/EOD Gained near 30lbs. Strong as hell, kept a solid 15 and droped a inch on the waist - two months after (that was WAY cool). Very, very few sides. Used Nizoral shampoo (OTC) and made sure to take two showers a day to help with the acne, which was not bad at all (due to fin). And take Milk thistle and N-acetyl Cysteine for liver function while on the dbol. Blood work after one month showed NO category less than excellent. CASE CLOSED. You can't argue with the results, little to no sides, and top notch lab results. Do what you want, but don't ever go half way. Waist of time & money. Email if you wish Late Lobo p.s. Say what you will about the dbol and deca. I just love that kick in the ass quick acting dbol. And this old geezer need his deca... Every week Well, only 34 but dern if don't like how the deca works on them joints [This message has been edited by WarLobo (edited January 27, 2000).] IP: Logged
WarLobo Pro Bodybuilder (Total posts: 155)	posted January 27, 2000 07:36 PM Bump and Grind, Bump and Grind baby Late Lobo IP: Logged
2Thick Pro Bodybuilder (Total posts: 346)	posted January 27, 2000 07:42 PM Deca and Primo will be a great first cycle. It will give decent size from it. You will need 3cc 22g x 1.5" syringes if you have high body fat % or are very muscular and 3cc 23g x 1" syringes if you are lean. Yes, you can mix Primo and Deca in the same syringe. Jon ------------------ Check out my Injection and Syringe Info Site= www.angelfire.com/biz5/syringes IP: Logged
macrophage69alpha Pro Bodybuilder (Total posts: 575)	posted January 27, 2000 08:02 PM YEAH IT WOULD BE A GREAT CYCLE IF YOU ARE WOMAN!!!!!!!!!!! My GOD can we get away from these misconceptions about primo- it is so safe, it cuts you up, no side effects- TO THIS I SAY BULLSHIT- primo is just a weak anabolic that is more likely to cause hair loss than test. DECA- this is better and works well when stacked with androgenic AS- which primo is not- it however is not without side effects and it tends to be more suppresive than test. The other problem being that DECA- like anadrol- is a progestin and can cause gyno (even when using anti estrogens). though this usually occurs only at higher doses 600mg and over- But remember 600mg of deca is about as anabolic as 300mg of test- you do the math. ------------------ MP IP: Logged
carlos7 Amateur Bodybuilder (Total posts: 29)	posted January 27, 2000 08:31 PM 500mg sos 300mg deca , follow by clomid and clen is an ok cy. carlos IP: Logged
coolhandluke Pro Bodybuilder (Total posts: 163)	posted January 27, 2000 08:38 PM macrophage69alpha is right. Good job. Bump. Luke IP: Logged
2Thick Pro Bodybuilder (Total posts: 346)	posted January 27, 2000 10:15 PM Macro, Let me get this straight. You think that Primo is for girls. Have you ever used Primo? Well I have and I gained 12lb on 200mg/week for 8 weeks using Primo. Also, I have gained 5-10lb on creatine and kept it. I am halfway between an ectomorph and a mesomorph, so I do not retain water very easily. I would like to know what you think is a good first cycle. I would guess that you would recommend something like D-bol or some test. Well, that is way too harsh for a newbie. Anabolics are the way to go at the beginning. You may disagree, but it's probably just the methyltest talking. Jon IP: Logged
macrophage69alpha Pro Bodybuilder (Total posts: 575)	posted January 27, 2000 11:25 PM 2thick- is that for too thick in the head? I did not say that primo was for girls- I said that at those dosages it would only be of benefit to women- it was also to some extent a joke. Yes some small gains might be made on such cycles- but I will say this if you gained 12lbs of muscle in 8 weeks on 200mgs of primo per week then one of three things has happened- #1 your scale is broken #2 you were underweight to begin with #3 muscle and fat are the same to you. --------------------------------------- OKAY now that I got my ranting out of the way some serious questions- how much did you weigh at the beginning of said cycle? what is your height and frame type? had you been dieting, taking time off from training or lost weight prior to cycle? however that being said unless you are blessed with tremendous genetics-OLYMPIAN GENETICS- I dont think that a cycle at those dosages will result in 12 lbs of muscle. Most people that I know that have used primobolan have considered it a waste of money- with a few exceptions who happened to be extremely gifted genetically- which believe it or not is extremely rare. One of those guys placed 7th at the NABBA MR, Universe- not that this is an end all be all competition but it shows the caliber of physique+ genetic potential that I am talking about. ------------------ MP IP: Logged
macrophage69alpha Pro Bodybuilder (Total posts: 575)	posted January 27, 2000 11:47 PM 2THICK just a little side note "Test is to harsh" so what you are saying is that the hormone that is naturally produced in every male is too harsh to start with- WHAT THE HELL DO YOU THINK HAS BEEN PUMPING THROUGH YOUR VEINS SINCE IN THE WOMB WHERE IT WAS DECIDED YOU WERE TO BE A MALE CHILD. maybe thats a little dramatic, but I like the effect. ------------------ MP IP: Logged
2Thick Pro Bodybuilder (Total posts: 346)	posted January 27, 2000 11:50 PM Macrophage= large parasitic bacteria; Your name does you justice. That's pretty funny, I used to bust out jokes like that in high school, too. You didn't answer my questions, but i think I am better off for it. I would like to remind you that everybody is different, and reacts differently to gear. Basically I am trying say that opinions are like assholes; everybody has them and they all stink. Peace bro, Jon [This message has been edited by 2Thick (edited January 28, 2000).] IP: Logged
2Thick Pro Bodybuilder (Total posts: 346)	posted January 27, 2000 11:53 PM Yes, test is natural, but not at 1 gram! I also like dramatic twist. Jon IP: Logged
macrophage69alpha Pro Bodybuilder (Total posts: 575)	posted January 28, 2000 12:09 AM I PREFER LATIN- "BIG EATER" you really should not take my posts personally I was just emphasizing my point(perhaps overemphasizing) to answer the parts of your question that I did not? WELL I DO NOT USE OR CONDONE THE USE OF ANABOLICS. THAT BEING SAID I AM AN ONLY CHILD BUT MY TWIN HAS TAKEN PRIMO 300mg/week-end of cycle- it did not even help him keep his gains. I too was a big fan of the safe anabolics until I saw what little most people got out of them and that they lost most of that. I too contemplated the "safest stack possible" looking for anavar, primo and masteron- though at first anavar and primo because they were orals. What would I recommend for a beginner? well at least 200mgs of test stacked with 200mg of deca or if they really want 400mgs of primo (that is plus the 200mg test). I believe in clomid at least eod in any cycle even smaller ones- to maintain test production and to stave off any possible estrogenic effects. for heavier cycles especially with aromatics cytadren 1 tablet a day or arimidex 1/2 tab eod. with clomid ed. I am not trying to insult those of you who advocate starting small (dosage wise) it is just my experience that most people are disatified with the results. Your example of 12lbs on primo being a reality only for the smallest percentage of the population. AND probably not the best starting point for those with less gifted genetics. IP: Logged
2Thick Pro Bodybuilder (Total posts: 346)	posted January 28, 2000 12:27 AM I know that you weren't insulting me personally. I was just playing along. I wanted you to know that I have been training for 8 years and 6 years of it has been Olympic weightlifting. I eat, sleep, and live to lift. Maybe my diet, training and rest had more to do with my gains than just the gear by itself. The reason I am so vigilant about beginning with small cycles is because people overdo it sometimes. They inflict damage on their bodies (that may or may not be permanent). To be honest, I know that starting off with test might have its advantages, but I believe in baby steps. BTW, I am not talking about Primo tabs, but Primo depot. Also, I do not consider myself gifted when it comes to bodybuilding, but even in high school, I could bench 295lb at 152lb. I am very meticulous when it comes to training and diet. That is why I gain the weight. Too many newbies think gear is a magic pill and that is why encourage them to take it easy. After their first cycle, they usually figure it out for themselves. Jon IP: Logged
macrophage69alpha Pro Bodybuilder (Total posts: 575)	posted January 28, 2000 12:35 AM well said but I still think test is the cornerstone of almost any good stack. even for beginners. I also beleive that beginners should make sure that they have all the tools including Knowledge and the appropriate accessory drugs to minimize any possible side effects. If they dont have that then they have no business play with anabolics. but of course they will anyway. ------------------ MP IP: Logged
2Thick Pro Bodybuilder (Total posts: 346)	posted January 28, 2000 12:41 AM Your point is well taken. Jon IP: Logged
WarLobo Pro Bodybuilder (Total posts: 155)	posted January 28, 2000 12:44 AM Well, Well, Well, quite a thread going here don't we. I just would like to point out that I seem to be one of the few here (besides Macro) that believe in test... yada yada yada. I have always tried to be very open minded to new ideas. HOWEVER, have any of you who advocate the "safety" of a deca/primo stack thereby referring to the "unsafe" use of test done ANY blood work to prove it to your self. Or have you read about it "on the web"???? HUMMMMM?????? Well I have comrades, and as I've posted, NOT ONE was out of range. Glucose, LDH, Cholesterol, TSH serum, Hemoglobin, Platelet Count, Lymphocytes and two fricking other categories. If done properly test is one of the safest and best roids out there. But I even went fricking nuts by your standards and used dbol/deca/sust stack. Yes, there will folks who can gain off of primo - and I used it to taper off. But what are the odds you are the genetically gifted person who can? Is it cheaper? NO. Does it provide better gains mg per mg? NO. Is it counterfeited? YES. Now realize that many new folks here have not even begun to reach their natural potential. Hell, they would grow on horse grass. Very few I think have a solid five years of hard natural training. I might be wrong, but I think I'm closer to the truth on this. We can argue away till we're blue in the balls on this. We have each stated our respective cases clearly enough. It is up to the newbies on which path they wish to follow.... Late Lobo IP: Logged
2Thick Pro Bodybuilder (Total posts: 346)	posted January 28, 2000 12:50 AM War, As I have stated in my previous post, I am not against the use of test. I am merely in favor of using less harsh chemicals for the first cycle. Therefore, reducing the risk of irrevocable damage being done by the user. Jon IP: Logged
macrophage69alpha Pro Bodybuilder (Total posts: 575)	posted January 28, 2000 01:14 AM Lets face it the only real irrevocable damage that can be done is either the loss of hair- and with all the new hair drugs out there- well i am willing to say that it is somewhat irrevocable. OR gyno which as we all know is 99% preventable. and probably not really irrevocable. However if you have not reached your growth potential- any anabolic can stunt your growth. so I guess the loss of tallness is irrevocable. I would say that elevated liver values and even liver damage from the use of 17 alkylates are neither all that damaging nor permanent. but that is just my 2 cents. ------------------ MP IP: Logged
Harleyguy Amateur Bodybuilder (Total posts: 23)	posted January 28, 2000 07:33 AM Well,it's seems I started a little debate here.Although all of this information is greatly appreciated,just think of how confused me and all the other newbies reading this post are.It took me six months of and literally hundreds of hours of reading to come to my deca/primo decision.I was gonna start my cycle in two weeks,but I'm DEFINETLY gonna postpone it now.Like I said I'm confused,I want to be absolutely positive and confident that my first cycle decision will be the right one.I don't want to look back in a few years wishing that I could of done it differently.Although I am still leaning towards the deca/primo stack,I feel that after listening to the opions of experienced users with very different opions,that ONLY FIRST HAND EXPERINCE WILL DETERMINE WHAT IS BEST FOR ME. P.S. Hair loss is not a concern,I'm completely bald I shave my head daily. IP: Logged
cuerpudo Amateur Bodybuilder (Total posts: 18)	posted January 28, 2000 08:06 AM I do agreed with test, Remember my slogan, TEST IS THE BEST, and i have another one, THE DRUG DOESN�T KILL YOU, IGNORANCE DOES IT. So my partners, hear what people with experience and knowledge have to say, and remember, read a lot, but read good staff, not magazines, read books. I think Warlobo and Macro has too much to share with us, and i am glad some guys like them chat with us. ------------------ Hi, i would like to share my experience and knowledge with you, and, of course, learn from your experience and knowledge of bodybuilding, make contacts and friends. IP: Logged
WarLobo Pro Bodybuilder (Total posts: 155)	posted January 28, 2000 12:19 PM Bang for your buck. Since I figure none of us here has an unlimited cash stash, I'd like to continue this thread on a monetary point. Lets say just for shits and grins Harley guy says WTF, I want to be sure my first cycle gets me some size... So he goes with an all American type dbol/deca/sust stack with clomid EOD. Plain and simple - for a good eight weeks on test. No fancy taper, One shot a week (well maybe two shots... but I digress) And I'll even toss in some Nova - just in case he is prone to gyno. Week 1 through 5 25mg dbol/day 500mg sust/wk 400mg deca/wk 50mg clomid/EOD Week 5 & 6 500mg sust/wk 400mg deca/wk 50mg clomid/EOD Week 7 500mg sust/wk 300mg deca/wk 50mg clomid/EOD Week 8 250mg sust/wk 200mg deca/wk 50mg clomid/EOD Week 9 100mg clomid ED Week 10 50mg clomid ED Week 11 50mg Clomid EOD Total Gear Amounts 175 dbol tabs 17 sust amps And two 10cc 200mg/ml of Deca 52 clomid tabs so three packs should do it And a pack of No Gyno tabs Total Gear Costs Kind of subjective, but I'll average it for what I can get it for. Ballpark guys and no bulk ordering too... (that sucks) Dbol $140 (now it's expensive to order small) Sust $204 Deca $200 Clomid $30 Nov $15 Shipping ect. $30 pins, oh what, $20 per 100? So for just under $650 he has a cycle that WILL have the potential to put on a solid 15 lbs. of muscle after all is said and done. Can any one figure the price of a primo/deca cycle at 400mg/400mg a week for eight weeks??? EEPS! Lets see.... Deca is about the same so 2 10cc bottles Primo 8 x 4 = 32 amps of primo. And what, about $17 bucks an amp sound fair? Assuming it is legit of course. Deca 200 Primo 544 Clomid 30 Nov 15 Shipping ect. $30 pins $20 That gives us a total of just under $850, not that's all that bad, but 200 bucks IS 200 buck. Now I even went with DOMESTIC prices so that our first time out would be a good one. Let me do a bit of bulk ordering, sub in Omna for the sust and for a grand I can get enough for THREE full cycles. Cause you KNOW one cycle is never enough. Hell, do a bit of over seas shopping and MAYBE sneak it down to $900. Hey, It's your MONEY Late Lobo [This message has been edited by WarLobo (edited January 28, 2000).] IP: Logged
macrophage69alpha Pro Bodybuilder (Total posts: 575)	posted January 28, 2000 06:07 PM bump I like the content of this thread ------------------ MP IP: Logged
WarLobo Pro Bodybuilder (Total posts: 155)	posted January 30, 2000 12:05 AM Burp IP: Logged
HARDBALL unregistered (Total posts: 155)	posted January 30, 2000 04:19 PM you guys fucking kill me...LOL IP: Logged
Harleyguy Amateur Bodybuilder (Total posts: 23)	posted January 31, 2000 09:50 PM Bump.Lots of good reading here!! IP: Logged
macrophage69alpha Pro Bodybuilder (Total posts: 575)	posted February 01, 2000 10:25 PM bump testo es besto ENGLISH TRANSLATION: STOP TAKING THAT PRIMO! ------------------ MP IP: Logged
2Thick Pro Bodybuilder (Total posts: 346)	posted February 01, 2000 10:47 PM Damn Macro!!!! You must have had some bad childhood experiences with Schering (Primo's producer) , because you spit venom on it at every chance. Just an observation... Jon ------------------ Check out my Injection and Syringe Info Site= www.angelfire.com/biz5/syringes IP: Logged
macrophage69alpha Pro Bodybuilder (Total posts: 575)	posted February 01, 2000 11:06 PM ACTUALLY IT IS JUST BASED UPON COST/BENEFIT ANALYSIS- PRIMO COSTS A LOT FOR WHAT YOU GET- THERE ARE A LOT OF BETTER DRUGS AND, BELIEVE IT OR NOT, TEST IS ONE OF THEM. I DONT HATE PRIMO AND IF IT WERE A LOT CHEAPER-i was going to say free- I MIGHT EVEN TAKE IT. MY PROBLEM IS WITH ALL THESE GUYS ASKING HOW THEY ARE GOING TO GAIN 10-15LBS OF MUSCLE AND THEN ASKING IF 200MGS OF PRIMO A WEEK IS ENOUGH. IF YOU ARE 17-18 YOU MIGHT SEE SOME DECENT GAINS WITH THIS AS IT WOULD BE A SUPPLEMENT TO YOUR ALREADY HIGH TEST LEVELS. BUT EVEN THEN ITS COST IS JUST TO HIGH. FOR THE PRICE OF 2-3 PRIMO AMPS YOU CAN GET 10CC OF TEST ENATHATE FROM BROVELL- TELL ME TRUTHFULLY WHICH IS REALLY THE BETTER DEAL? - SIDE EFFECTS INCLUDED. side effects that can be eliminated for the the price of 2-3 more primo amps by buying CLOMID and NIZORAL. PEACE ------------------ MP IP: Logged
2Thick Pro Bodybuilder (Total posts: 346)	posted February 01, 2000 11:15 PM Macro, No, I believe you are correct in respect to the cost/benefit aspect, but I will always include primo at the end of my cycles to help solidify my gains from (yes, I am going to say it) test. I will use test from now on in my cycles, but I do not regret my first (primo only) cycle. It foreshadowed what I could expect from gear. I'm sure you are speaking from hindsight, so your view is quite valid, but I will not step down from opinion that newbies should take it easy (at first). Jon ------------------ Check out my Injection and Syringe Info Site= www.angelfire.com/biz5/syringes IP: Logged
ASAP Amateur Bodybuilder (Total posts: 80)	posted February 01, 2000 11:54 PM Bump - said it before-saying it now-macrophage, You are the man. IP: Logged
WarLobo Pro Bodybuilder (Total posts: 155)	posted February 08, 2000 06:28 PM Can I get an AMEN!? IP: Logged
macrophage69alpha Pro Bodybuilder (Total posts: 575)	posted February 10, 2000 11:59 PM This is a Must Read- (especially for newbies or guys thinking about the first cycle) _____ bump------ ------------------ MP IP: Logged
Heemaan445 Pro Bodybuilder (Total posts: 167)	posted February 11, 2000 12:18 AM damn $650 for 15lbs.... I now consider myself gifted for putting on 15lbs on 10 amps of sus over 2 1/2 mos.......$122.00 IP: Logged
Heemaan445 Pro Bodybuilder (Total posts: 167)	posted February 11, 2000 12:18 AM damn $650 for 15lbs.... I now consider myself gifted for putting on 15lbs on 10 amps of sus over 2 1/2 mos.......$122.00 bump IP: Logged
filtheboss Pro Bodybuilder (Total posts: 169)	posted February 11, 2000 01:09 PM IF WHAT YOU'RE READING MAKES YOU DOUBT STARTING A CYLE FIRST TIME OUT THEN CONSIDER MORE DETAILS ITS YOUR BOAT,YOU SET SAILS ITS A TOPIC WITH NO CONCLUSIONS JUST SOME PEOPLE WITH INFUSSIONS THOUGH THEY WORK AND MAKE YOU BIG ALSO CHICKENS, COWS AND PIGS BUT IF KNOWLEDGE IS WHAT YOU SEEK STICK AROUND AND DONT BE MEEK THE TIME WILL COME WHEN YOU DECIDE PLAY IT SAFE OR RISK YOUR HIDE AND WHEN YOU'RE READY FOR THE TRIP CHECK YOUR COMPASS,AND LET HER RIP. GOOD ADVICE YOU'LL FIND RIGHT HERE SORT IT OUT AND HAVE GOOD GEAR! OOOOOOPPPPS I DROPPED MY TUNA FISH, WISH I HAD A CAT, DMMIT I'LL EAT IT OFF THE FLOOR! IP: Logged
macrophage69alpha Pro Bodybuilder (Total posts: 575)	posted February 12, 2000 02:48 PM bump ------------------ MP IP: Logged
BIG Amateur Bodybuilder (Total posts: 21)	posted February 19, 2000 10:58 PM Well, you guys are so FULL OF SHIT!!!! Anyway, theres one guy in here who have understood the point a little better!!! Anyhow, deca and primo won`t give any great gains no matter how much you take....theres only 1 (one) thing who will - and yes...thats testosterone...lots of it!!! Anyhow...i hear some of you recommend anti-estrogens to unvoid decainduced sideeffects such as gyno and limpdick - and those who say so, are in for a very big and unpleasent surprice when you do deca yourself, and experience some of the sides!!! Because Deca has a chemical structure similar to that of progesterone in the body (the same as with anadrol) and its therefor speculated that deca can act as progesterone in the body -and antiestrogens like nolvadex, proviron and clomid would be useless against decainduced gyno f.expl or other sideeffects as limpdick!! Only one thing will "unvoid it" in some kind of way , and thats testosterone!! Stack a testosterone in your deca stack - in the reatio 3:1 (test:deca) - this is because the test compete against the same receptor sites as progesterone do, and since you have more test than prog inside your body its more likely that the test finds this receptor sites first and blocks for the prog!!! This is the one and only thing who will help you out!!! And since that i say that test are the only thing who will build up a big and great body is because of the fact that testosterone covers _all_ bases/mechanisms of anabolism/musclegrowth. It binds to the androgen receptors and activates them, and it also works through several (unknown) mechanisms unrelated to the AR's. Another advantage of testo is that you can just keep upping the dosages pretty much as high as you like, and it will only get more and more effective, unlike other AS's, like dbol and anadrol, who both really stops becoming more and more effective once a certain point has been reached. so stick with test, lots of it and you`ll see great gains!!! Peace, BIG [This message has been edited by BIG (edited February 19, 2000).] IP: Logged
macrophage69alpha Pro Bodybuilder (Total posts: 575)	posted February 19, 2000 11:06 PM I actually agree with you- thus I assume that the full of shit comment is directed at others. there are at least 2 other ways to block the progestenic effects of Deca and Anadrol- winstrol which acts as an antiprogestin and ru-486 BTW- I have said if once and I WILL say it again TEST IS THE KING-LONG LIVE THE KING ------------------ MP IP: Logged
quenepo Pro Bodybuilder (Total posts: 202)	posted February 19, 2000 11:34 PM Bump. quenepo IP: Logged
BIG Amateur Bodybuilder (Total posts: 21)	posted February 19, 2000 11:38 PM Hey macro, you were the guy i thought about actually...so youre 100% correct!! yes, i assume winnie are a oportunity - so is the other stuff (can`t remember the name hehe) but im almost convienst about that the majority of us here on Elite can`t get it, including me ofcourse!!! BIG IP: Logged
wretched Amateur Bodybuilder (Total posts: 38)	posted February 20, 2000 01:05 AM can't we all just get a long he he he IP: Logged
macrophage69alpha Pro Bodybuilder (Total posts: 575)	posted February 22, 2000 07:08 PM bump ------------------ MP IP: Logged
E2 Pro Bodybuilder (Total posts: 871)	posted February 22, 2000 09:18 PM FUCK i missed out on all this!!!! Damn! Wish i had been reading this thread then i could have had some fun too. Ahh bump IP: Logged

All times are ET (US)
	Hop to:

Powered by: Ultimate Bulletin Board (UltimateBB), Version 5.42a
� Infopop Corporation (formerly Madrona Park, Inc.), 1998-1999.

Enlightening Men about Anabolic Steroids and Bodybuilding for over Two Decades