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 Bros, tell me what you think about a new product I'm thinking about. Need your imput
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| Author | Topic: Bros, tell me what you think about a new product I'm thinking about. Need your imput | ||
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Pro Bodybuilder 
Posts: 401 |
What would you want in an post workout recovery drink? Here's what I'm proposing: 30-50g of protein. What would you like in a recovery drink. This is kind of a poll I guess. -Stew     | ||
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Amateur Bodybuilder 
Posts: 245 |
Every thing that you have there I would agree with,with the exception of the creatine. By putting the creatine in you increase the price of the product and decrease your available market to only those who belive that creatine does work. People who are not taking creatine or who don't belive that it works won't want to pay the extra money for it when they can have a drink with a similar blend, less the creatine for the same price. I think that the sports drinks that are the most successfull are the ones that are the most generic and appeal to the broadest range of clientel. (I have to appoligize for my poor spelling as it is late and I am tired)
[This message has been edited by rocko (edited February 06, 2001).] | ||
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Pro Bodybuilder
Posts: 402 |
Looks good bro, but I don't care much for creatine either. I do like the idea, and would be a customer. ------------------ | ||
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Pro Bodybuilder
Posts: 401 |
I will probably provide the creatine as an option then. I am really wondering about the amounts of sugar, protein, etc... -Stew | ||
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Pro Bodybuilder
Posts: 503 |
Well, I do and I don't like the idea. Let me explain: I like to manipulate natural GH and Insulin releases after my workout, and by investing all of the products at once, I would not get the pronouced spike as I do when I have a Sugar/Glutamine mix, and then some Velvet Bean. I beleive these are two major factors in growth. However, without the creatine, it might not be just a bad general purpose product. | ||
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Pro Bodybuilder
Posts: 401 |
quote: It would not be good general purpose product with or without creatine. You do not want your insulin levels bouncing around all day as it would with all the added sugar. This would only be beneficial as a post workout recovery drink. You would not want sugars at any other time, especially at night. Whey isolate (protein source) will not take long to digest anyway. That in itself is reason for it to not be an "all purpose drink." Thanks for bumping the post anyway, MEANone. -Stew | ||
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Elite Bodybuilder 
Posts: 705 |
Good idea Stew. | ||
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Amateur Bodybuilder
Posts: 106 |
I think you should add 100mg of crushed Anadrol, 40mg of crushed Dianabol, and 100cc of Winstrol V. hehehehe Seriously, I like it too minus the creatine. ------------------ | ||
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Amateur Bodybuilder
Posts: 257 |
30g whey pro CONCENTRATE 30g sugar 30g complex carbs 5g creatine 5g glutamine arginine how much??? L tryptophan ????? | ||
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Elite Bodybuilder
Posts: 604 |
Would be fine with either the creatine or the glutamine, but not both because they compete for absorption. Unlike others, I would leave in the creatine - I take glutamine at bedtime, cause it will stimulate GH production while sleeping, as well as recovery. | ||
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Pro Bodybuilder
Posts: 417 |
I'm still waiting for a company to come out with a good protein. I have to special order mine from Protein Factory. I would like the following: 1) Whey Isolate (30% of the protein) 2) Whey Concentrate (30%) 3) Casein (30%) 4) Soy Protein (10%) 5) Glutamine 6) Simple Sugars 7) 5mg Creatine This would be my ideal mix. I need the fast acting and long acting proteins, along with everything else, and I kind of like creatine. Just my two cents. | ||
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Pro Bodybuilder
Posts: 401 |
Bro, email me for great protein. I am going to begin sales later this week when my shipment arrives. I will later be selling a WPI/Posassium Casenate blend 70/30 as well as a concentrate. If you'd like to be on my list to receive updates, just drop me an email. Thanks for the ideas, bros.
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Pro Bodybuilder
Posts: 401 |
bump | ||
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Amateur Bodybuilder
Posts: 178 |
I like the amounts of protein, and I would go as high as 50G. Being a recovery drink, creatine would be good. I don't know enough about the workings of glycogen or glutamine to comment. You're building an empire Stew. GOOD LUCK! ------------------ | ||
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Amateur Bodybuilder
Posts: 163 |
boot the creatine and add a little more protein and ill give it a shot... | ||
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Elite Bodybuilder
Posts: 644 |
I think it is a great idea. A few suggestions: 1) make the protein all whey since it empties out of your stomach fastest so you can eat again an hour or so later, 2) make a majority of the simple carbs fructose since it increases insulin sensitivity and is less likely to go to fat than sugar or glucose, and 3) dump the creatine since it makes the drink taste like ass and is a waste of money if you are on a cycle. You could also make shakes for dieters with alpha lapoic acid to improve insulin sensitivity and a blend of whey and casinate so it is more filling and takes longer to digest. I am skeptical about the benefits of glutamine so if it increases costs significantly I would use less or dump it all together. I would definately try a product like this if you decide to sell it. Your next project could be a protein bar that has 50g of protein with some carbs mixed in. The ones on the market now have too many vitamins and too little protein. Good luck with your indever. giantset ------------------ | ||
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Elite Bodybuilder
Posts: 740 |
I'd personally like to have only 3 major things in my drink... 1:Whey protein(isolates) The electrolyte replacement would be nice also. But most of your customers(I'm not saying all of them)will be chemically enhanced so the creatine is kind of useless and will only add to the price... ------------------ | ||
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Pro Bodybuilder
Posts: 401 |
Would you want 50g of carbs? The price would be directly dependent on the amount of protein. Are you sure that the price increase would be worth 50g? Also, the type of sugar doesn't matter. One does not cause greater fat storage than the other. They are only slightly different chemically. They will all cause equal insulin release. If I'm wrong and your 100% sure, then correct me. Looks like I will offer one with creatine and one without. Anyone know exactly how many carbs they would like/need? I'm thinking 35g of complex (maltodextrin) and 40g of sugar (fructose). I found a good source for a vitamin/mineral powder. I am going to order some to see how well it mixes. It doesn't cost much at all. Anything else you'd like in a post workout drink? -Stew | ||
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Elite Bodybuilder
Posts: 740 |
I'd like to see 50g of protein and at least 70-80g of carbs myself. I'd like glucose and maltodextrin for my carb choices personally. I've read a few articles stating that fructose replenishes liver glycogen stores before muscle stores. This would not be benificial for a post workout drink. I assume it's coming in a loose powder so those who want more carbs or protein could just adjust their dosages if they wanted to though... ------------------ | ||
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Freak 
Posts: 1556 |
Atleast 50g of protien. A mix if possible. Glutamine is a must 10g. Carbs and maybe some arginine and ala for and insulin spike. A friend of a friend came up with a recovery drink 3 years ago. A company came to him, which stayed unknown( for reasons he knows know) and offered 20,000 for just the name. He said no and 3 weeks later came back with a 175,000 offer, which he took. The name was Propel, which is Gatorades new product. If he had know the company involved he would have held out for more. He now calls the drink Prolite and caters to the mountain bike community. Not bad! ------------------ "Catch a man a fish, he eats for a day. Teach a man to fish, and he eats for a lifetime." | ||
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Pro Bodybuilder
Posts: 401 |
quote: I don't know what the ligistics of the article were, but glycogen stores are not replenished differently by different sugars. Fructose is an isomer of glucose. The only difference between the two is the location of the carbonyl group within the chemical formula. Fructose does not compose glycogen. Fructose must be converted by fructase enzymes to glucose. The glucose that is not allocated into immediate energy production can be stored as glycogen in the following manner glucose-glucose-glucose-glucose... Glucose bonded to glucose forms glycogen. Both take about the same amount of time to assemble glycogen because it does not take much effort for fructase to switch the carbonyl group to make fructose glucose. It's a very quick process. I see no physiological correlation between the type of sugar and its storage in different glycogen locals.
quote:
I don't have a price figured out yet.
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Elite Bodybuilder
Posts: 740 |
I don't really have the article on hand(I'll have to go thru the books and magazines I have to find them), but if you've ever read anything from the late Dan Duchaine does not recommend fructose. His recommendation for a carb up was to eat a apple or other piece of fruit before doing your depletion workout. The fruit would replenish your liver stores first allowing you to deplete them more allowing for a greater supercompensation during carb up. I'll try to find the other articles if I have time today also... ------------------ | ||
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Amateur Bodybuilder
Posts: 107 |
Creatine dehydrates you. That's why you hold all that water from it. Your body decides to start storing it since you are losing alot of the water. Taking protein and drinking a drink with electolytes is about are about the only things worth taking. For the most part, supplements have only one use...as a laxative. ------------------ | ||
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Cool Novice 
Posts: 42 |
sounds good to me STEW!!!!!!!! | ||
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Novice 
Posts: 8 |
Test.net/Biotest have been talking about the perfect post workout drink for the last 2 weeks, worth a look no matter what you think about these guys. Interesting stuff regarding the type of protein you need after training. | ||
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Elite Bodybuilder
Posts: 644 |
I found an article about insulin sensitivity to back-up my claims about fructose. It's from t-mag but it is cited information. "You probably know that sugars are usually the first thing you should avoid when trying to lower insulin resistance, but one sugar can actually benefit you when consumed in sane amounts. That's right, my favorite, fructose. It was shown to increase insulin sensitivity by 34% in diabetic patients.(26) It also has a lot of other benefits that I've already discussed in my article called The Forbidden Fruit." 26.Koivisto VA, Yki-Jarvinen H. "Fructose and insulin sensitivity in patients with type 2 diabetes." J Intern Med 1993 Feb;233(2):145-53 The link is http://www.testosterone.net/html/body_121ins.html I have read about fructose replenishing the liver first as well but I am not sure how that would affect the post workout recovery of skeletal muscle. Perhaps the proposed blend of maltodextrin, fructose, and possibly dextrose could exibit the positive benefits of all of these types of carbohydrates. The shaker idea sounds good as long as the drink doesn't get clumpy. The price would probably have to be less than $2-3 to be competitive with the other shakes out on the market. giantset ------------------ | ||
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Elite Bodybuilder
Posts: 740 |
A carbohydrate blend would be ideal. As long as the majority of carbs came from maltodextrin or dextrose I would be happy. Most people on here consume 100g of carbs post workout, so I would think 30-40g or so of fructose would be a good idea. Stew was proposing 40g of fructose and 35g of maltodextrin which I really didn't go wild over... ------------------ | ||
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Pro Bodybuilder
Posts: 401 |
Be careful what you perceive as truth. People like to make outrageous claims to draw attention to themselves such as the person that wrote that article. He was boasting about fructose being a more desirable sugar. The research that he quoted did not compare fructose to other sugars, it compared it to starch. Everyone knows that complex carbohydrates do not raise blood sugar levels as much as sugars do. That guy is just trying to draw attention. Fructose has no superiority over any other monosaccaride in any form or fashion. It will all turn to glucose before the body can use it. The author of that article was taking advantage of people's inability see fraudulant claims. Here's the abstract of the actual research so you'll know what I'm talking about. He did not compare fructose to other sugars...We investigated whether the potentiation of postprandial lipaemia by fructose occurs in both non-diabetic subjects and those with non-insulin-dependent diabetes mellitus. Six non-diabetic and six diabetic subjects were studied on two occasions. They were given a meal containing 1 g fat/kg body weight with, on one occasion, 0.75 g fructose/kg body weight, on the other occasion 0.75 g starch/kg body weight. In both groups, plasma glucose and insulin concentrations rose more after starch than after fructose. At 1�2 h after the meal, plasma non-esterified fatty acid concentrations were suppressed more after fructose than after starch, but later they rose more after fructose than after starch. Plasma triacylglycerol concentrations rose more slowly after fructose, but were considerably higher than those after starch from 4�6 h after the meal. There were no differences in post-heparin plasma lipoprotein lipase (EC 3.1.1.34) activity at the end of the test. The potentiation of postprandial lipaemia by fructose was positively related to the fasting plasma insulin concentration, suggesting that insulin-resistant subjects are more prone to this effect. We conclude that the potentiation of postprandial lipaemia by fructose is seen in both diabetic and non-diabetic subjects. Our results suggest that alterations in the dynamics of plasma non-esterified fatty acids might underlie the effects of fructose on triacylglycerol metabolism.
I could provide the drink for a much lower price than other products like it. But people wouldn't buy it. People think that if something is cheaper, it is not as good. I will sell more product if I make it only slightly lower or equal to the competition's price. I'd like to sell it very cheap, but sadly, people wouldn't buy it. I'm sure that I'll offer my bros at EliteFitness a substantial discount because most of us have a lot more sense than the average consumer. Educated people read the labels, not listen to advertisements or like the pretty design on the label, or go by the word of the Professional bodybuilder that is being paid to endorse it. There is a lot more education floating around here than there is hanging out at the local GNC...
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Novice
Posts: 6 |
How about vit C? I know a lot of guys like to dose up on it and considering the studies I've read you lose a lot of it through excercise especially heavy weights work. I'd suggest about 2-300mg as from what I've seen, the body can only absorb up to 300mg at one point (levels stay raised for about 2-3 hrs, correct me if I'm wrong) | ||
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Cool Novice
Posts: 32 |
Everything looks good Stew. I would however drop the creatine and add some glutamine. Other than that, you da man! ------------------ |
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posted February 06, 2001 12:57 AM
