Thighs and cardio...

[mishvs]

I know there are a lot of knowledgable people on this board and that is why am calling out to any of you!

Two questions: the first is how on earth do I get my thighs to shape up? I have nice quad definition but my outer thighs are SERIOUSLY lacking. Just behind the hip, under my glutes I have these little "pockets" of I don't know, fat? Any way I cannot get rid of them and need advice on how to eliminate these "bags" and get my legs looking like a bodybuilders.

The second question is about cardio: when trying to gain muscle mass with minimal fat gain, how much cardio should be done per week and for how long?

Ok, and I'll slip a third little ? in here: to spatts, JJfigure, and any one else who would like to answer... How many cals did/do you consume when tyring to gain muscle and in what ratio. I am 106 lbs, 5 ' 8 but am struggling to increase my cals (currently cycling cals from 1500- 1800 with carbs ranging from 20%-30%, fats 25-35% and protein always 40-45% depending on the day and activity level). If you need any more info I'd be only too happy to reply.

I know this was a long ost but thanks for ploughing thru it!

Michelle

 

[teresand77]

i'm sorry to bud in on your post but i have the same problem with that fat on the outer part of my thighs--they're called saddle bags, aren't they? i notice it going away pretty fast when i am running consistently but i have been injured lately and not running.

i must need help with my diet too! i am pretty sure though that my whole diet downfall happens on the weekends.

here is my normal routine
6 AM 30-45 minutes of cardio
8 AM 1/2 cup of oatmeal and 4 egg whites
11 AM 3 oz of chicken, 1/2 a yam, and 1/2 c. vegetables
1 PM myoplex shake
4 PM 1/2 cup of cottage cheese and 1/2 c. vegetables
5:30 PM lift (i cycle chest/triceps one day, shoulders and back another day, and biceps and legs another--i have been lifting 5 days a week--is that too much?)
8 PM 3 oz of chicken or tuna, 1/2 c. vegetables
10 PM 1 scoop of protein

i also have been mixing flaxseed oil in to get a total of about 30-40 grams of fat a day. is that too much? i also drink a gallon of water a day. i don't take any supplements anymore except for my multivitamin.

but if this diet looks good i will assume that i am keeping this fat on my outer legs because of my bad diet on the weekends.

i have done a couple of fitness modeling competitions...when i was doing those i didn't prepare at all and i did really well but now that i am wanting to do more serious competitions i am having a hard time keeping lean and sticking to my diet. i have gained a ton of muscle in the past year or year and a half but i am also gaining fat. i am 5'3" 130 pounds, a little under 20% bodyfat.

i appreciate any advice anyone can give me! you guys are so awesome on this board. i'm so glad i found it!

teresa

 

[mishvs]

Here is my current diet: This would be an average day but the food choices do change.

7:30 am
40 g oats
5 egg whites/ whey shake
slice low fat cheese

10:00 am
70 g cooked chicken
Salad
higher carb days an apple
lower carb days 1/2tbs flax seed oil

13:00 am
Fillet fish
2 cups cauliflower
Salad
15 g nuts

Post workout: 15:30:
Myoplex Lite with half a banana

18:00
Steak (lean)
More salad
2 cups vegetables
1/4 avo

21:30:
Can tuna/ chicken breast
Salad
15g nuts

As I said, that is a typical day, but if I eat more carbs then I'll add 10g oats in the morning and beans at lunch too. Low carbs days I'll cut out the apple and replace with more fat. The only supplements I take is a whey protein drink. I tried creatine for a length of time but it did nothing for me.

My training is as follows: I superset the body parts below except on leg day. I also incorporate various shocking methods such as static contraction and stripping.

Chest/ back with shoulders (superset four/five exercises 4 sets each going to faliur)
bis/tris (superset four exercises, four sets each)
legs (no supersets just a straight forward w/o with squats, lunges, one leg squats, leg press all for fours sets 12-8 reps, and a few isolation exercises for three sets.)

Cardio: I was doing about everyday but I have injured myself so I have had to cut down. At the moment it is five times a week for 30 -40 mins and a long dostance run on sundays for about an hour.

I find it very hard to take a day off or just chill. I know overtarainig hinders ones progress but I just can't stop! Anyways, if I have left out anything just let me know...

Thanks a ton
Michelle

 

[MS]

"you might want to get rid of some of that fructose in your diet and replace it with better carbs like yams or rice...more green veggies"


I'm with spatts here. Fructose/fruit is what allowed our ancestors to store up lots of bodyfat for the inevitable lean pickings ahead. Veggies were prolly what we ate when we were desperately hungry during those lean times............

Sooooo if you want to store up body fat, eat lots of fruit. If you want to lose fat eat lots of fibrous veggies.

 

[MR. BMJ]

OR,.........You could always just put up a pic of that region right below your "hip", so that we get a better understaning of what you are referring to.

Other than that, i'd go with the advice that spatt's mentioned above...and what MS confirmed.

BMJ

 

[mishvs]

Thanks for the replies.

Spatts, the three day split: I allow one day rest between each w/o so I typically hit eachj body part once a week.

About the injury- I am seeing a chiropractor about it and it's caused mainly by a muscular irritation.

I don't really want to "tone" as such, I am looking more towards a bodybuilding physique, like JJfigure's or Brickgirl. That's exactly where I am wanting to go. Do I need to eat more? Or change my training, I am willing to follow any suggestions.

Thanks again
Michelle

 

[Ceebs]

I don't really want to "tone" as such, I am looking more towards a bodybuilding physique, like JJfigure's or Brickgirl.

First of all, kudos to you for abhoring the T-word.

Having JJ's and Brickgirl's (positively drool-worthy) physiques is a matter of low bodyfat coupled with respectable amounts of muscle. Diet will get you further than you can imagine, but it's a tough road below a certain bodyfat percentage. Take a look at this thread, if you already haven't: http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=193221

 

[nvr2shredded]

Yohimburn made all the difference in the thigh area for my significant other. She had abs, but still had fat upper thighs. Her diet was tight, the fat just would not come off. enter yohimburn, the fat started coming off. It was not like the yohimburn 'made' her lose that much more fat, it just made it so that she could lose that particular fat.

what I am trying to say is I dont think that yohimburn gives you a major metabolic boost like DNP, it does give some. But it sure seems to make losing that stubborn fat, i myself used on my face and low back mostly, a lot easier.

 

[grlpwrd]

If you want to lose fat and build muscle (what the rest of the world calls "toning") you might want to ditch alot of that cardio, unless you are doing it to compete in distance races or something. Then you might want to get rid of some of that fructose in your diet and replace it with better carbs like yams or rice...more green veggies. A three day split isn't bad, but are you allowing rest between? Keeping legs and back far apart? Is it a constant cycle that start over after day 3 or is it just 3 times a week? Why all supersets? How heavy do you train? What's the injury?

I hope you don't mind me interjecting, spatts, but how much and what kind of fructose do you advise?

 

[JJFigure]

Those damn saddlebags! I've got the same problem, and they don't go away until near the end of my pre-contest diet cycle - in other words, it takes a good 8-10 weeks of very rigid dieting. And yes, they're the first place to which my bodyfat noticebly returns post-contest.

Now, on to the subject of adding muscle. I usually average 2400 kcals/day in my off season (when I bother to count). It's hard to find a happy kcalorie ground when trying to add muscle if you don't want to add a lot of fat, too. Unfortunately, I think it's a trial and error process, and the type of diet you use factors into it. I seem to be able to eat more kcals without gaining significant fat when on an anabolic diet. However, I also feel like I'm force-feeding to keep my kcals higher on this type of diet - there's only so much protein and fat you can eat. Random tablespoons of PB helps.

I'm going to stay on an anabolic diet this off season, since my body responds to adding muscle easier with this type of diet. It's the same diet I'm using pre-contest, just an increase in quantity/kcals and the addition of some dairy. Basically, low carb (30-60 grams/day) or ~10%, moderate fat - ~40%, moderate protein - ~50% from Monday - Friday; high carb - ~70%, low fat - ~20%, low protein ~10% on Sat and Sun.

Cardio - with an anabolic type diet, I don't have to do much cardio to keep my fat gain at bay. I'll do 2-3 cardio session/week, 30 minutes max. I will predominately do HIIT sessions, with the occassional moderate intensity, steady pace session thrown in (on my lazy days).

 

[JJFigure]

I just read your lifting approach - 3 days a week with a day of rest in between is a good approach - helps prevent over-training. I'm a firm believer in low reps (3-6)/heavy weight/multi-joint movements when adding muscle. I started lifting 11 years ago, and luckily I started off with a trainer who believed in low reps/multi-joint movements, so my entire lifting history has incorporated this approach. Too bad in those early years I didn't also know you were supposed to eat protein - I had a carb based diet back then. Lessons learned.

 

[newgirl-chargeback]

I will go out on a limb here -- but please do not think I am issuing a debatable tone here.

At 5'8 and 106 pounds...these "thigh things" that you are referring to....are you sure you are not being a bit critical? We tend to see ourselves more critically than others do. And it seems that you must have a really racing metabolism to eat the way you are and be that slim.

I would check out on cardio for a while. There was a BRIEF moment in my life when I just was losing weight rather quickly and eating ALOT all the time and ALOT of garbage. At 5'7 I dropped from 140 pounds (little muscle) to 127 -- trust me, I was eating for 5! I could not put on muscle (nor lose the saddlebags either).

My trainer strongly suggested losing the cardio for a while....and it did work. I kept up my 4 days a week lifiting schedule and started eating more protein like close to 200 grams possibly more (I had thought was already eating a fair amount of protein before).

I am just thinking at how thin you are ... and your body instinctively is holding onto what it feels it needs. Just my uneducated 2 cents!

 

[rez]

Sooooo if you want to store up body fat, eat lots of fruit. If you want to lose fat eat lots of fibrous veggies. [/B]

does this include low gi fruit such as apples/pears and berries..they have low carbs and low gi?

i usually have an apple before training...you think i should drop it if trying to cut?

 

[mishvs]

These post are quite depressing But really, I think I am critical but the rest of my body has come such a long way just those DAMN outer thighs!!!!

I am sceptical of an anabolic diet for my body I think I actually may do well on a higher carb plan but am frankly a bit worried to try. I guess I will have to experiment a bit more.

Is 200 g protein for my body weight too much? I am worried about overstressing my organs. Also about the carbs- is it possible to eat too few carbs thus hindering muscle gains? This is my main concern, I don't want to cut them out and sacrifice my gains.

Thanks again for the replies

 

[mishvs]

Spatts,

It is definitely to put on muscle. At the moment I am more on the "skinny fat" side than being built and hard! I would really like to stay with my bodyfat % at the moment (around 14-15%) maybe even drop it slightly put add much more muscle to increase my weight to a healthy range for my height (5'8).

 

[FitFossil]

If you're trying to gain muscle, you do need more carbs than 20-30% of your diet. Carbs convert to glycogen, which is your muscles' preferred form of energy. To get the most out of your training (and therefore muscle growth), your muscles need carbs to function at their optimum. Just stick to the complex (like oatmeal, sweet potatoes, brown rice, etc.) and fibrous (veggies like spinach, broccoli, etc.) and limit the simple carbs like bread and fruits.

As for wanting your legs to shape up - how are you training them now? What rep range?

Cardio 6 days a week is a lot. As low as your bodyweight is for your height, all that cardio could be catabolizing your muscle. When the body is overstressed due to insufficient calories and/or overtraining, it will start shedding muscle (to lower metabolism) in preference to losing fat so it can conserve the most energy. Also, a higher proportion of incoming calories may be stored as fat, because the body senses possible famine.

I'd cut out some of those cardio days. On the days you do cardio, don't always go at the same pace. Try doing an interval sprint session (e.g. alternating betw easy and hard pace). This is great for leg and glute definition. 20-30 minutes is plenty and never more than 2x/week as intervals are very taxing.

If you tend to do cardio before weights (and you don't eat something before lifting), either switch cardio to after weights, or eat something after cardio before starting weights. If your body is drained from cardio, you won't get a very effective weight workout.

 

[mishvs]

When I train legs I usually hit for btw 8-12 reps. Once a month I will throw in a 100 rep w/o just for variety. I don't think I train my legs with the same intensity as i hit my upper body so I may need to work on that. Exercises are: squats, one legged squats, leg press and isolation exercises.

I just had my body composition checked: i am up 2 % body fat(ouch!!!!!) at 16,7% with a 600g muscle LOSS and a 600g fat GAIN. This is really bad news. I am going to change my diet to higher carbs (40%) and lower fat (20%) se if that helps, I always suspected my body worked better with carbs and the test just confirmed Anyways I'll see how this goes.

Michelle

 

[FitFossil]

I need my carbs too What I do is cycle my carb intake - higher some days, lower on others. It keeps my body guessing, and I never get any cravings. I work it so my higher carb days are right before a heavy training day like legs (Monday) or back (Thursday).

When you say you usually "hit for btw 8-12 reps" on legs, does that mean the weight's heavy enough so you couldn't do another rep (w/ good form) after 12? If so, that's good. So many women are afraid to lift sufficient weight - esp w/ legs because they think they'll explode with muscle. A few might, but they're the minority. You never know until you try. My legs got smaller and more defined from heavy training/sprinting.

You can also experiment with other rep ranges like 6-8, 12-15, etc. to see how they respond. Right now I'm training legs once a week, alternating betw a heavy week (8-10) and a light week (15-20). I change my whole routine every 2 months or so.

Since you're looking for overall muscle gain, concentrate more on "compound" movements like squats, deadlifts, bench press, pull ups, etc. and less on isolation movements. You can still do some iso moves, but you'll get more growth and strength mileage from the compound exercises, because they work multiple muscle groups.

 

[fitmedic]

good post fitfossil