Reasons why I wonder why I still like men:

velvett · May 4, 2003

From these threads it appears that as a woman you are damned either way - if you do become what you think men want you to be you are a blood sucking, money grubbing bitch and if you don't you are a lazy fat good head sucking hole for the night.

Frankly – there are many women out there don't need any of you we just keep you around to fit the social norm and get our own rocks off once and a while. Why? Because as you represent yourself as “men” on these boards, most of you are not man enough to be a real man anyway (and if you see that as untrue, stand up and say so).

So think about what you want to say verses what you really feel first the next time you go off on women as a gender and then I'll remember to disclose that like no one women no man represents all men.

From -'Today's American women'

http://boards.elitefitness.com/forum/showthread.php?threadid=232679&perpage=20&pagenumber=1

Most are selfish, dishonest, shallow, and hypocritical. One minute they want to have you castrated for being a man, and then the next minute they put on a mini skirt and bend over in front of you.

They are all about having their cake, your cake, and trading both in for fake tits.

1) Loud, rude and crass without being any fun;

2) Ignorant, boring and uncultured with no ideas, opinions or curiosity;

3) Two-faced, lying, manipulative, controlling (duh);

4) Snobby and arrogant while lacking in both self-esteem and compassion for others;

5) They pitch their voices in shrill nasal tones that sound like nails on a chalk-board. This gets worse as they get older and is compounded by the god-awful accents some of them have;

6) They get fat;

7) They age badly. Once they get hitched, when they hit 28 or the 2nd kid whichever comes first, they hit the Haagen-Daz, get a lesbian haircut, and wear sweat pants, chunky sweaters and a pair of canvas shoes for the rest of their fat-ass life;

8) It doesn't matter how crazy she was in her youth, by age 28 or the 2nd kid (whichever comes 1st) she starts acting like her shit comes out in plastic bags and she's some kind of saintly figure engaged in a holy war against fun wherever it may be found. That's why I always find a 19 yr chick with a bunch of tattoos so fucking funny;

9) No sense of humor, they don't know something is funny unless there is a laughtrack and it involves the misfortune of others, and then they laugh like a hyena being disembowelled and show all their fillings. Because of this lack their mouths become thin-lipped and eventually pursed into a expression of permanent disapproval, that's why so many middle aged american women have a face like a pitbull licking shit off an electric fence;

10) Crap in the sack; hate to admit they enjoy sex because it would interfere in establishing a transactional dynamic in the relationship and reduce their bargaining power.

Women want to be needed. That leads to the logical question; How do I use that to my advantage?

The answer is simple. Make them feel like you do not need them and they will cling to you like stupid clings to a conservative.

From: 'Once again, I bagged another Internet Plumper last night'

http://boards.elitefitness.com/forum/showthread.php?threadid=232804

I just couldnt help myself, her tits so big, ass so round. She was a good little trooper giving head for so long and hard. 5'4" about a buck fifty, 38DDD. Pussy was ultra tight and wet for some reason, guess she hasnt got cock in a long time or whatever. I got her to put out on the first date....of course. Guess she will make a good backup plan when the other bitches arent available. Looks like Im back to my old form, bruhs.

No shame brother,as long as they're good to you...I would take a sweet plumper who knew how to treat a man over some supermodel bitch who had the typical,"I'm the center of my whole universe"attitude any day.

Hey dave, that sounds like a pretty efficient way to get laid.....what type of monetary expenditures are usually associated with dating these kinds of chicks...I'm pretty sure I could date a moderately thick girl as long as she was proportioned right, and no superflab....I might prefer it to a stick girl anyway...

gettinlarger · May 4, 2003

velvett said:
3) Two-faced, lying, manipulative, controlling (duh)

I don't wanna start any fights or anything, but this argument above always comes up. You have to wonder why ...

HULKSTER · May 4, 2003

Velvett, is that really you in your avatar? J/K....to be serious for a minute----if that's possible with me----- a distinction must be made between a man's sexual desires for women, and man's desire to have the typical, familial woman who will stay home and raise the children. Men must understand that to be a responsible, typical housewife raising children means much more time consuming responsibilites, to the point that she has no time to waste on exercising or going to GNC. Furthermore, when a woman has children, automatically the needs of the children come first, and the woman's needs come second. Thus, it needs no explanation why a woman seems to greatly mature and become more "motherly" when she has children.

PatsFan34 · May 4, 2003

I love women and I love you too Velvett, stay hott!

Frackal · May 4, 2003

Hey guess what - If women didn't insist we pay for everything, than I wouldnt have to take money as one of the largest factors in who and how I date...

Women want sex just as much as men do...or close... yet for some reason we still have to pay for it one way or another...

I wasn't always this sardonic..I grew this way....I don't hate women or anything...I'm just limited in who I can date because I am unwilling to spend a significant portion of my paycheck on something that is enjoyable for BOTH of us.

bunnymt · May 4, 2003

Women are damned either way!! You picked some prime examples of some nasty remarks made by men about women...
But so are men...they are also damned!! Women complain about men, men complain about women.
But we have to remember that there are women out there, like the ones written about in these specific threads, who allow themselves to be treated in this demeaning manner. They give the good girls a bad name.
But that's ok...let the less-worthy women be dirty. Then real men will be able to appreciate the good ones when they find them.

velvett · May 4, 2003

Re: Re: Reasons why I wonder why I still like men:

gettinlarger said:
I don't wanna start any fights or anything, but this argument above always comes up. You have to wonder why ...

Never said it wasn't true - nor any of the statements - but it does not encompass an entire gender, yet oddly enough it could define some of both male and female genders.

Although men do more lying and less manipulating - I believe it's a style thing brought down generation to generation.

You know, deny, deny deny...

Some women manipulate so they don't have to lie.

bunnymt · May 4, 2003

Re: Re: Re: Reasons why I wonder why I still like men:

velvett said:
Never said it wasn't true - nor any of the statements - but it does not encompass an entire gender, yet oddly enough it could define some of both male and female genders.

This is a valid point.

velvett · May 4, 2003

One more thing.

Why is it *cool* for men to bitch together about women but it is not ok for women to point out anything negative about their comments or actions?

velvett · May 4, 2003

bunnymt said:
But so are men...they are also damned!! Women complain about men, men complain about women.

But we have to remember that there are women out there, like the ones written about in these specific threads, who allow themselves to be treated in this demeaning manner. They give the good girls a bad name.

But that's ok...let the less-worthy women be dirty. Then real men will be able to appreciate the good ones when they find them.

Absolutely - I totally agree.

True there too...

...and I hope you're right.

Frackal · May 4, 2003

velvett said:
From these threads it appears that as a woman you are damned either way - if you do become what you think men want you to be you are a blood sucking, money grubbing bitch and if you don't you are a lazy fat good head sucking hole for the night.

Also, what exactly does this mean? Pretty and fit doesn't equate to money grubbing bitch....it's how you act

And what is a real man to you? Talk about damned if you do or don't - Women want you to be a gentleman in all the good ways but don't want to act like a 'lady' in return because it's 'degrading.'

Give me a break.

And with this attitude :

Frankly – there are many women out there don't need any of you we just keep you around to fit the social norm and get our own rocks off once and a while. Why? Because as you represent yourself as “men” on these boards, most of you are not man enough to be a real man anyway (and if you see that as untrue, stand up and say so).

I don't understand how you could be put off by my comment about sex.

flexygrl · May 4, 2003

One thing that I think is extremely important the we few women must remember is that this is primarily a man dominated board.

My husband is always telling me that sometimes men need to be with other men and just talk and not worry about what a women might say. I think that is what's going on with this board. The men are venting or talking about their experiences. They are not taking into account the women on this board, or how it might hurt us to hear such nastiness.

There is really nothing we can do. I do not think they will change. If some one gets dumped on tonight, you better believe that tomorrow morning their will be posting, how all women are hoes, selfish, gold diggers, fill in the blank here....

I sincerely hope that these men find a women one day that will make them eat their words. Until that happens I don't think that you should take these comments to heart at all. I know I don't.

I am not condoning anything that they do, but I chose not to make a big deal out of it, or to let it bother me. Trust me, these men here are not the norm. And most importantly a good man would never say any of this crap to our faces that we are reading almost on a daily basis.

The funny thing is I am sure I can bet money on the fact that my husband did his share of women bashing. I mean it really can be frustrating for them. And we have done our share too.

I don't know if any of this makes sense, I just felt a need to commnent.

Imnotdutch · May 4, 2003

Great post Velvett.

Frackal · May 4, 2003

Flexy girl makes some good points except I feel there is no reason why we should not speak out about frustrations...I don't think that makes us not "good men" or abnormal...I've listened to plenty of similiar sentiments at work and school...you guys are just exposed to it here more...

Also, I'd love to just date a girl and be able to have my main concern be whether I like her or not...unfortunately, the common woman attitude is, "We have equal rights except when it comes time to pay, then I want YOU to be a gentleman and shell out that cash."

That's the way things are, ok, but that makes it so I have to be practical and cold about things like you see in my comment above.

flexygrl · May 4, 2003

Hey Frackal,

How are you?

Couple of things:

When my hubby and I first started dating, yes he did pay for almost everything. I was a student and only working part time. I was lucky if I was bringing home $100 a week. When he didn't have money and I did, I always offered to pay. Most of the time we did things that were not expensive.

I always have and always will appreciate a man who treats a lady like a lady. I love when a man holds a door for me. Chivalry (sp) is not dead. The right girl will appreciate these things.

big4life · May 4, 2003

There will always be "boys" who want to play games and try to manipulate people, and then there will be "men" who who will be just who they say they are and treat people the right way.

Just as there will be "girls" who try to play games, and "women" who know who they are and what they want.

A man and a woman can make a great match.

A man and a girl, or a woman and a boy are disatsters in the making.

Just my .02.

HULKSTER · May 4, 2003

Please refer to my above post, that is all.

sk* · May 4, 2003

You forgot to quote from my thread when I called all pretty girls stupid and anyone that had a brain didn't resemble a female!!!

No it isn't about all females, it is about the majority of them. It's just that most of you are too emotional and don't use your minds to make decisions.

I commented a lot on the subject on my other thread, so no need to do it again.

-sk

Frackal · May 4, 2003

flexygrl said:
Hey Frackal,

How are you?

Couple of things:

When my hubby and I first started dating, yes he did pay for almost everything. I was a student and only working part time. I was lucky if I was bringing home $100 a week. When he didn't have money and I did, I always offered to pay. Most of the time we did things that were not expensive.

I always have and always will appreciate a man who treats a lady like a lady. I love when a man holds a door for me. Chivalry (sp) is not dead. The right girl will appreciate these things.

I assume then that you act like a Lady in return? Which includes being submissive, staying home and doing household chores, listening to the man's problems first when he comes home etc?

Oh what, that's degrading? Oh ok...but it's ok for a man to do all the nice stuff of the same cultural background for a woman?

Oh.

-SD- · May 4, 2003

Frackal said:
Flexy girl makes some good points except I feel there is no reason why we should not speak out about frustrations...I don't think that makes us not "good men" or abnormal...I've listened to plenty of similiar sentiments at work and school...you guys are just exposed to it here more...

Also, I'd love to just date a girl and be able to have my main concern be whether I like her or not...unfortunately, the common woman attitude is, "We have equal rights except when it comes time to pay, then I want YOU to be a gentleman and shell out that cash."

That's the way things are, ok, but that makes it so I have to be practical and cold about things like you see in my comment above.

Sometimes I have that problem with women and sometimes I dont. It all depends on who Im going out with at the time. It also depends on which person asked the other one out for the date, i.e. if I asked them out then I expect to pay and if they asked me out then I expect them to pay, or at least pay for themselves. I think you may be subconsciously seeking out a certain type of woman and you arent even aware of it, because the same problem of paying for the dates always arises for you. Its a numbers game bro, if you ask a girl out on the first date and she sits there dumb like a rock while you fork over the money all night while you are on the date, then go to the next girl and see if she offers to pay for herself or whatever. Give a girl one date and you will have her figured out regarding her views on paying for dates, if she is a golddigger then move on to the next one.

sk* · May 4, 2003

superdave said:
Sometimes I have that problem with women and sometimes I dont. It all depends on who Im going out with at the time. It also depends on which person asked the other one out for the date, i.e. if I asked them out then I expect to pay and if they asked me out then I expect them to pay, or at least pay for themselves. I think you may be subconsciously seeking out a certain type of woman and you arent even aware of it, because the same problem of paying for the dates always arises for you. Its a numbers game bro, if you ask a girl out on the first date and she sits there dumb like a rock while you fork over the money all night while you are on the date, then go to the next girl and see if she offers to pay for herself or whatever. Give a girl one date and you will have her figured out regarding her views on paying for dates, if she is a golddigger then move on to the next one.

They will bitch and moan behind you for 100years if you don't pay SPECIALLY for the first few dates.

-sk

flexygrl · May 4, 2003

Hey Frackal,

No unfortunatly you can't make it where we live without a two income household. I get home before him and I do try to make sure he has a home cooked meal waiting for him. That's something my mom taught me. I was brought up in a very strict hispanic home where the man was the head of the household.

I share a lot of my moms views, but I don't think it's about submission. It's about love and respect. Like mondays for instance, I don't get home until after 9. Well my husband will cook for us on Monday and take care of the animals. It's about mutual repect. It's about loving someone enough to make sure they are taken care of and that they are happy. I really, really try my best and so does he.

duff_rose · May 4, 2003

bunnymt said:
Women are damned either way!! You picked some prime examples of some nasty remarks made by men about women...
But so are men...they are also damned!! Women complain about men, men complain about women.
But we have to remember that there are women out there, like the ones written about in these specific threads, who allow themselves to be treated in this demeaning manner. They give the good girls a bad name.
But that's ok...let the less-worthy women be dirty. Then real men will be able to appreciate the good ones when they find them.

This is pretty much what I wanted to say in retort. It works both ways, however there are a hell of a lot more guys on this board than women, therefore there's going to be more bitching about women. But you didn't get my quote from the "Today's American women" thread:

duff_rose said:
I love 'em!

See, We're not all assholes.

sk* · May 4, 2003

flexygrl said:
Hey Frackal,

No unfortunatly you can't make it where we live without a two income household. I get home before him and I do try to make sure he has a home cooked meal waiting for him. That's something my mom taught me. I was brought up in a very strict hispanic home where the man was the head of the household.

I share a lot of my moms views, but I don't think it's about submission. It's about love and respect. Like mondays for instance, I don't get home until after 9. Well my husband will cook for us on Monday and take care of the animals. It's about mutual repect. It's about loving someone enough to make sure they are taken care of and that they are happy. I really, really try my best and so does he.

Believe it or not most woman aren't like that, specially american woman as they didn't grow up in the strict households you are talking about. Besides you are married now and once you trully love someone a lot will change, including the support you will give him and he will give you. Once I know for sure I am gonna spend the rest of my life with a girl, she can have access to my every penny.

-sk

flexygrl · May 4, 2003

Believe it or not most woman aren't like that, specially american woman as they didn't grow up in the strict households you are talking about. Besides you are married now and once you trully love someone a lot will change, including the support you will give him and he will give you. Once I know for sure I am gonna spend the rest of my life with a girl, she can have access to my every penny.

That's so true *sk.

When you are married the money is just a big pool. It really doesn't matter where it comes from. He gets my whole entire paycheck, and I trust that he does the right thing with it. And he does. Because of him I have a beautiful house, a new car and basically anything I want. Yes I work too but I would never have the luxory of just getting something I want if it was not for him. Oh, and I always ask before I buy anything.

velvett · May 4, 2003

Frackal said:
Hey guess what - If women didn't insist we pay for everything, than I wouldnt have to take money as one of the largest factors in who and how I date...

Women want sex just as much as men do...or close... yet for some reason we still have to pay for it one way or another...

I wasn't always this sardonic..I grew this way....I don't hate women or anything...I'm just limited in who I can date because I am unwilling to spend a significant portion of my paycheck on something that is enjoyable for BOTH of us.

Then don't dating GIRLS that never once offer to pay and don't start a dated with the out look of "I bet this bitch expects me to PAY for this meal (or movie, etc).

That's the overall problem with people- associating sex and money as it pertains to relationships in the same sentence or consideration.

velvett · May 4, 2003

duff_rose said:
See, We're not all assholes.

LOL

Didn't say you were..

Because as you represent yourself as “men” on these boards, most of you are not man enough to be a real man anyway (and if you see that as untrue, stand up and say so).

... and you follow direction perfectly.

velvett · May 4, 2003

flexygrl said:
One thing that I think is extremely important the we few women must remember is that this is primarily a man dominated board.

My husband is always telling me that sometimes men need to be with other men and just talk and not worry about what a women might say. I think that is what's going on with this board. The men are venting or talking about their experiences. They are not taking into account the women on this board, or how it might hurt us to hear such nastiness.

There is really nothing we can do. I do not think they will change. If some one gets dumped on tonight, you better believe that tomorrow morning their will be posting, how all women are hoes, selfish, gold diggers, fill in the blank here....

I sincerely hope that these men find a women one day that will make them eat their words. Until that happens I don't think that you should take these comments to heart at all. I know I don't.

I am not condoning anything that they do, but I chose not to make a big deal out of it, or to let it bother me. Trust me, these men here are not the norm. And most importantly a good man would never say any of this crap to our faces that we are reading almost on a daily basis.

The funny thing is I am sure I can bet money on the fact that my husband did his share of women bashing. I mean it really can be frustrating for them. And we have done our share too.

I don't know if any of this makes sense, I just felt a need to commnent.

Great Post.

Very true.

sk* · May 4, 2003

velvett,

Have you ever payed on a date? Specifically on a first date?

And don't tell me "he didn't let you pay," which is riddiculous as he didn't use force on you.

-sk

big4life · May 4, 2003

People need to remember that no matter how much you pay for a date, it doesn't obligate the other person to have sex. And if someone spends x amount of money on a date that doesn't mean that they are trying to buy you.

It is about maturity and some form of respect.

The Shadow · May 4, 2003

Re: Re: Re: Reasons why I wonder why I still like men:

velvett said:
Some women manipulate so they don't have to lie.

....if a man knows how to treat his lady- manipulation is not necessary.

velvett · May 4, 2003

Frackal said:
Flexy girl makes some good points except I feel there is no reason why we should not speak out about frustrations...I don't think that makes us not "good men" or abnormal...I've listened to plenty of similiar sentiments at work and school...you guys are just exposed to it here more...

Never said you shouldn't - it is quite curious as to why women can not do the same.

sk* · May 4, 2003

Re: Re: Re: Re: Reasons why I wonder why I still like men:

Cornholio said:
....if a man knows how to treat his lady- manipulation is not necessary.

Not if the lady is spoiled. Don't get me wrong, I love my current girlfriend so much and she treats me just right (well most of the time) ... most girls aren't like that though from my experience.

-sk

The Shadow · May 4, 2003

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Reasons why I wonder why I still like men:

sk* said:
Not if the lady is spoiled. Don't get me wrong, I love my current girlfriend so much and she treats me just right (well most of the time) ... most girls aren't like that though from my experience.

-sk

....I think that the way a woman treats a man is generally mirrored by how he treats her - in the vast majority of cases anyway.

sk* · May 4, 2003

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Reasons why I wonder why I still like men:

Cornholio said:
....I think that the way a woman treats a man is generally mirrored by how he treats her - in the vast majority of cases anyway.

I've had some bad experiences, so majority of time doesn't hold true for me but maybe it is true from your experiences. I've treated a girl like a princess (and always treat them like that if they are my girlfriend) and ended up suffering cause of it. So far, with my girlfriend, it is going very good but I am terrified that she will "turn" on me as it has happened before very unexpectedly.

-sk

duff_rose · May 4, 2003

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Reasons why I wonder why I still like men:

sk* said:
Not if the lady is spoiled.

I don't tolerate spoiled girls very well, the kind that won't give you the time of day unless you do something for them first. I'm sure we would get to lilke each other after a while, but It's the first 'while' that I can't haldle with a spoiled girl.

sk* said:
most girls aren't like that though from my experience.

I agree.

TC2 · May 4, 2003

Re: Re: Re: Re: Reasons why I wonder why I still like men:

Cornholio said:
....if a man knows how to treat his lady- manipulation is not necessary.

I really really wished it worked that way, but sadly it does not.

duff_rose · May 4, 2003

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Reasons why I wonder why I still like men:

Cornholio said:
....I think that the way a woman treats a man is generally mirrored by how he treats her - in the vast majority of cases anyway.

I don't know man, I see a lot of girls that are as nice as can be who are with the biggest assholes in the world. It takes all kinds.

The Shadow · May 4, 2003

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Reasons why I wonder why I still like men:

sk* said:
I've had some bad experiences, so majority of time doesn't hold true for me but maybe it is true from your experiences. I've treated a girl like a princess (and always treat them like that if they are my girlfriend) and ended up suffering cause of it.

-sk

...well - like I said there are those instances.....

I think that men are in a tough spot in that we should be MEN in terms of what society thinks and yet at the same time be sensitive and be able to open up emotionally to women.

Women like Vel said are probably "forced" by society to have a mate because they "should" and that this mate "should" conform to societal standards.

Men and women should spend less time worrying over societal value and spend that time on cherishing each other.

The Shadow · May 4, 2003

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Reasons why I wonder why I still like men:

duff_rose said:
I don't know man, I see a lot of girls that are as nice as can be who are with the biggest assholes in the world. It takes all kinds.

...is that society's view from the outside??

Unless you really know the "asshole" in question, its hard to know what that person is really like.

TC2 · May 4, 2003

I know plenty of assholes(I call them my freinds)

They are total pricks to there GFs and they love them for it.

We've actually had experiments in reguards to how women tick.

All resultts have come to the conculsion that WOMEN TRULY DON'T KNOW WHAT THEY WANT ANYMORE.

There way too many "hoops" that men have to jump thru in order to please a woman.

Be too good to them and they run all over you.

Be an asshole to them and they love you for it.

Their entire thinking is not logical and requires too much work on our part to walk that fine line of balance.

PatsFan34 · May 4, 2003

TC2 said:
I know plenty of assholes(I call them my freinds)

They are total pricks to there GFs and they love them for it.

We've actually had experiments in reguards to how women tick.

All resultts have come to the conculsion that WOMEN TRULY DON'T KNOW WHAT THEY WANT ANYMORE.

There way too many "hoops" that men have to jump thru in order to please a woman.

Be too good to them and they run all over you.

Be an asshole to them and they love you for it.

Their entire thinking is not logical and requires too much work on our part to walk that fine line of balance.

Word brutha! I think most women are crazy, you just need to find the least crazy ones!

Velvett, you're still hott!

velvett · May 4, 2003

sk* said:
velvett,

Have you ever payed on a date? Specifically on a first date?

And don't tell me "he didn't let you pay," which is riddiculous as he didn't use force on you.

-sk

Yes many times and it's actually an awkward moment because while here on EF it appears that many men would like the woman to pay there are many that would not.

Simple rule to follow when in doubt: You ask you pay or at the very least offer up to split the bill.

When dating someone at least half the time I pay for dinner, lunch, movies etc - except in once case where my ex used to pat me on the head and say, "Sure honey, maybe next time." (He was much older than I and used to think my gesture was "cute" but ridiculous.)

I would like to think of a relationship as a partnership and you just split things, chores, monetary expense, oral sex, driving, food shopping and cleaning.

With the exception of only one dating scenario that did not allow me to pay on the first date. Actually - I snagged the bill from the waitress while he was in the boy's room and there was a huge protest (playful and fun actually) and when I wouldn't keep him money he was officially glued to my hip. (Not a bad thing)

Personally - I will never owe anyone anything ever - and that is not one of my better traits because it always gets in the way of a good relationship. As will the constant focus of "you better not make me pay too much before you put out for me."

My $2

velvett · May 4, 2003

PatsFan34 said:
Word brutha! I think most women are crazy, you just need to find the least crazy ones!

Velvett, you're still hott!

Actually, we're all nuts (men and women) you just have to find what level of crazy you can live with for a long period of time.

PatsFan34 · May 4, 2003

velvett said:
I would like to think of a relationship as a partnership and you just split things, chores, monetary expense, oral sex, driving, food shopping and cleaning.

Cheers Babe!

DealsMorte · May 4, 2003

OK, first off being raised by my mother I hold women in the highest respect.

Having said that I think alot of the male negativity towards women stems from some of this ridiculous feminist bullshit. When a man can't tell a woman that she has a nice dress on or her hair looks good at work it is just taking something too far. The female rights movement had a valid and honorable goal when they started, now it is becoming alot like affirmitive action. I'm different and was oppressed in the past so give me everything please.

slobberknocker · May 4, 2003

I just want women to be more laid back, and quit analyzing every little thing I say. And for God's sake, quit crying once a month for no reason!!!

LOL

collegiateLifter · May 4, 2003

velvett said:
Never said you shouldn't - it is quite curious as to why women can not do the same.

I personally feel like the mass media does exactly this, women bitching about men, pretty much 24/7.

2Thick · May 4, 2003

velvett said:
Women want to be needed. That leads to the logical question; How do I use that to my advantage?

The answer is simple. Make them feel like you do not need them and they will cling to you like stupid clings to a conservative.

Click to expand...

That is my favorite...

ajtomasi · May 4, 2003

wow this is an interesting thread.

I think the blame should be put on those men who use and abuse women, which then in turn fucks them up for super studs like me.

slobberknocker · May 4, 2003

ajtomasi said:
wow this is an interesting thread.

I think the blame should be put on those men who use and abuse women, which then in turn fucks them up for super studs like me.

I think it's probably all your fault.

ajtomasi · May 4, 2003

slobberknocker said:
I think it's probably all your fault.

No! it's your's you woman user. stop using women, you woman user!

The Shadow · May 4, 2003

Originally posted by velvett

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Women want to be needed. That leads to the logical question; How do I use that to my advantage?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

...funny...I dont WANT to be needed....I need to be WANTED.

bunnymt · May 4, 2003

I think that the point on this thread has been made, disregarding other nonsense: Men complain about men. Women complain about women. Some men are bad, some are good. Some women are bad, some are good.
Men disrespect women when they allow themselves to be disrespected, in the majority of cases.
Women also disrespect men....it just seems as though the men on this thread are more vocal about their women 'dilemmas'/ situations than vice versa.

Really, when I read a thread about 'banging some chick' or whatever, I am more embarassed for the girl and for women in general, than anything else.

slobberknocker · May 4, 2003

ajtomasi said:
No! it's your's you woman user. stop using women, you woman user!

YOU ARE THE ONE WHO IS THE WOMAN USER!

biteme · May 4, 2003

I think that the majority of women are nothing but a headache and trouble waiting to happen. I have never said "all women".

TheProject · May 4, 2003

velvett said:
Actually, we're all nuts (men and women) you just have to find what level of crazy you can live with for a long period of time.

Exactly....you just gotta find the right kind of crazy.

My .02: just because there aren't a ton of threads on here by women bitching about men doesn't mean it doesn't happen.

Women bitch about men just as much, IMO, just not on Elite.

That said, the whole "women are evil" thing gets a bit tiresome.

sk* · May 4, 2003

velvett said:
Yes many times and it's actually an awkward moment because while here on EF it appears that many men would like the woman to pay there are many that would not.

Simple rule to follow when in doubt: You ask you pay or at the very least offer up to split the bill.

When dating someone at least half the time I pay for dinner, lunch, movies etc - except in once case where my ex used to pat me on the head and say, "Sure honey, maybe next time." (He was much older than I and used to think my gesture was "cute" but ridiculous.)

I would like to think of a relationship as a partnership and you just split things, chores, monetary expense, oral sex, driving, food shopping and cleaning.

With the exception of only one dating scenario that did not allow me to pay on the first date. Actually - I snagged the bill from the waitress while he was in the boy's room and there was a huge protest (playful and fun actually) and when I wouldn't keep him money he was officially glued to my hip. (Not a bad thing)

Personally - I will never owe anyone anything ever - and that is not one of my better traits because it always gets in the way of a good relationship. As will the constant focus of "you better not make me pay too much before you put out for me."

My $2

Assuming what you are saying is true, that would make you one out of a million. Oh yea sure girls offer to pay, all the time they do ... they are just being nice, but once I say no i'll get it they are like ok. Thing is, the only reason I would wanna pay is that in my opinion it is the right thing to do, what bothers me is that woman take it for granted and they know the guy will say no and they take advantage of it and cover their asses by saying I offered to pay. Reality is if I let the girl pay, I would never see her again as I would be labeled as a jerk.

This is in majority of cases, ofcourse ... not all. With my girlfriend I have a very different relationship as she is 15years older than me and she knows I go to college and can't support her as much. Sadly, she is a girl that likes to go out a lot and eat out at least 2-3times a week and it makes it hard for me. I feel embarrased and I can't buy everything she wants cause I really don't have money and I think she understands that, but pretty much every penny I get gets spent on her. If she chooses to go out and eat I refuse to eat anything there so I wouldn't spend her money, but when I am the one taking her out I will pay for it. Somewhat complicated situation and very different than most as we aren't in the begining stages of the relationship, and it is more like my money is her money. Seriously, other than her, every girl i've known had expected me to pay.

-sk

sk* · May 4, 2003

Damn, just re-read my post, sooo many run-ons lol.

-sk

ajtomasi · May 4, 2003

bunnymt said:
I think that the point on this thread has been made, disregarding other nonsense: Men complain about men. Women complain about women. Some men are bad, some are good. Some women are bad, some are good.

I don't want to toot my own horn, but I am a good man, really I am, more so than 90% of men in general. I think that what men say here is totally just BS. When you're in front of a woman, every "normal" man acts completely different.

Superdave might be bragging about banging over wieght women, but it's all just part of his act. I'm sure he acts more himself when he is out with these plumbers.

AND AS FOR YOU SLOBBERKNOCKER, YOU ARE THE WOMAN USER! So I'll ask you kindly, please, don't squeeze the Charmine.

biteme · May 4, 2003

I think a lot of us men have had the experience of making a committment to love a woman for the rest of our lives, through sickness and health, good times, bad times, etc. They made that committment in return and reneged on it for no good reason and after a lengthy relationship. This committment to many women means nothing. I think they are far more fickle than men. If I love a women, it will be forever. That has been the case both times that I fell in love. I would never have left them because I truly loved them. How can a man trust the average woman these days? Knowing the divorce statistics. 80% of all divorces are instigated by women. I read this statistic at Father's Rights. 60% of first marriages end in divorce these days. The statistic is higher for second marriages. The reason, women are always looking for the grass is greener on the other side. That is what I think anyway.

2Thick · May 4, 2003

Cornholio said:
Originally posted by velvett

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Women want to be needed. That leads to the logical question; How do I use that to my advantage?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

...funny...I dont WANT to be needed....I need to be WANTED.

That is why you are not a woman.

velvett · May 4, 2003

biteme said:
I think a lot of us men have had the experience of making a committment to love a woman for the rest of our lives, through sickness and health, good times, bad times, etc. They made that committment in return and reneged on it for no good reason and after a lengthy relationship. This committment to many women means nothing. I think they are far more fickle than men. If I love a women, it will be forever. That has been the case both times that I fell in love. I would never have left them because I truly loved them. How can a man trust the average woman these days? Knowing the divorce statistics. 80% of all divorces are instigated by women. I read this statistic at Father's Rights. 60% of first marriages end in divorce these days. The statistic is higher for second marriages. The reason, women are always looking for the grass is greener on the other side. That is what I think anyway.

It's all about the green.

$$$

As with any encounter all individual experiences and responses may vary....

A man will cheat on a woman and stay with his wife because the divorce will cost him too much - and if he is lucky he will not get a caught.

A woman will cheat on a man and leave her husband for the new love and get her chunk of the pie providing there have been enough to contribute to the receipt of said $$$.

Men and women will always be different even when commit the very same act, they are wired different and it will always be as such.

Hopefully men and women can look beyond the hurtful actions of their prior mate(s) and not punish those in their future because of the action of another that they did not commit.

After my parents married, my father forbid my mother to work even though she had been an active journalist during their 6 year courtship. Then he gave her an allowance to live by (food, me, dry cleaning, gas, etc) and when she did not abide by his rules he punished her by leaving her no money to buy anything for the household and he would eat his meals out and drop his own clothes off at the cleaners. When she couldn't take it anymore she punished me because there was no else around.

They should have gotten divorced in the early 80's when I 11-12 years old but they did not. They just continued their co-dependant - I abuse and I need to be abused relationship.

In the early 90's my father did everything he could think of to make her miserable and in result she tortured him in response. He told her that you can be free if "you divorce me" - because to him it could not be his failure but hers. "I will never divorce you "her name" I would kill you first."

In 98, the day after Christmas my father found himself cuffed in front of his own house and placed in jail. I'm still unaware of what the truth is behind that event was but it starts a 4-year divorce preceding.

The details of the follow 4 years of hell (mine included) are too lengthy but what is important is that they never did get divorced.

Why?

Money.

After 37 years.

So now co-exist between 3 houses - one of which they both really like and both fight over hating each other waiting to see who die first so the other can live out the rest of their lives without the other.

Why did I tell you all this?

Men and women are influenced by the actions of those around us. The experiences we live through and the experiences that we create and come through our own accord.

That is why neither two men nor no two women can be judged the very same way and even when we consciously try not to judge we do anyway as if it were an auto-response.

I don't know - I just felt chatty.

So there it is.

Drunken_Weasel · May 4, 2003

I fuckin hate these damn threads!

biteme · May 4, 2003

velvett said:
It's all about the green.

$$$

As with any encounter all individual experiences and responses may vary....

A man will cheat on a woman and stay with his wife because the divorce will cost him too much - and if he is lucky he will not get a caught.

A woman will cheat on a man and leave her husband for the new love and get her chunk of the pie providing there have been enough to contribute to the receipt of said $$$.

Men and women will always be different even when commit the very same act, they are wired different and it will always be as such.

Hopefully men and women can look beyond the hurtful actions of their prior mate(s) and not punish those in their future because of the action of another that they did not commit.

After my parents married, my father forbid my mother to work even though she had been an active journalist during their 6 year courtship. Then he gave her an allowance to live by (food, me, dry cleaning, gas, etc) and when she did not abide by his rules he punished her by leaving her no money to buy anything for the household and he would eat his meals out and drop his own clothes off at the cleaners. When she couldn't take it anymore she punished me because there was no else around.

They should have gotten divorced in the early 80's when I 11-12 years old but they did not. They just continued their co-dependant - I abuse and I need to be abused relationship.

In the early 90's my father did everything he could think of to make her miserable and in result she tortured him in response. He told her that you can be free if "you divorce me" - because to him it could not be his failure but hers. "I will never divorce you "her name" I would kill you first."

In 98, the day after Christmas my father found himself cuffed in front of his own house and placed in jail. I'm still unaware of what the truth is behind that event was but it starts a 4-year divorce preceding.

The details of the follow 4 years of hell (mine included) are too lengthy but what is important is that they never did get divorced.

Why?

Money.

After 37 years.

So now co-exist between 3 houses - one of which they both really like and both fight over hating each other waiting to see who die first so the other can live out the rest of their lives without the other.

Why did I tell you all this?

Men and women are influenced by the actions of those around us. The experiences we live through and the experiences that we create and come through our own accord.

That is why neither two men nor no two women can be judged the very same way and even when we consciously try not to judge we do anyway as if it were an auto-response.

I don't know - I just felt chatty.

So there it is.

Very well written my lady. I have a feeling that if you ever fall in love, that man will be very lucky.

fistfullofsteel · May 4, 2003

Velvett is an angry lesbian. She won't have sex with me.

*** · May 4, 2003

our ploy is to drive all women into lesbianism...

nevertoobig · May 4, 2003

We all manipulate each other both consciously and subconsciously.

In my experience, by observing other people, women are generally MUCH more manipulative. They are generally more aware that they are manipulating a man, and they are also better at doing it.

Men do it a lot too, just nowhere near as much and they aren't as good at it.

The Shadow · May 4, 2003

velvett said:
Hopefully men and women can look beyond the hurtful actions of their prior mate(s) and not punish those in their future because of the action of another that they did not commit.

....deja vu

nevertoobig · May 4, 2003

Also, women are a lot more emotional and sometime irrational about making decisions. This, combined with the fact that they are more manipulative, I think is why you see so many woman bashing threads here.

Also... it hink it was flexygrl that made some good post points in her original post about the amount of woman bashing threads here.

Sinistar · May 4, 2003

as most bodybuilders are men, your going to get alot of male veiws. if this surprises you, i dont know what to say.

if you are treated so horribly on this site, go make an all female bodybuilding site. theres your option. only a woman would walk into an enviorment like this and expect everyone to change for them, which is what you want. im sure you have an excuse as to how this isnt asking ppl to change, but id like you to tell me how this is. youve been here awhile, this is how tings are talked about and the opinions we hold

i also love how we are being told we arent 'normal' guys. well if we arent, why are you getting your panties all wadded up, bitching and complaining?

bottom line? we arent appologetic about the posts and comments we make on here. its a hard world velvett, if you cant stand the heat, move into the living room.

and ill tell you what else, i wouldnt go on some crusade like this on a mostly female board. so ill tell you what they would prolly tell me: grow up.

vinylgroover · May 4, 2003

Women's expectations have changed, particularly over the last 10 years, more so than ever.

They have far more career choices than ever and are getting paid well in many instances, well enough for them not to 'need' a man to be looked after.........which is a far cry from the 'old' days.

It's just a social revolution we are living through at the moment, and unfortunately for men, the current generation of men are having to live through this period where women are expecting and demanding far more out of life than to be 'kept'.

Future generations of men will be brought up in the aftermath of the revolution so they won't know any different.

So for the current genration of men out there, we need to adjust to this change, otherwise we will be left behind..........there's no point bitching about it, it's already happened.

The choice is to back a fundamentalist muslim overthrow of western governments and culture........how many here would wat that.

velvett · May 4, 2003

Sinistar said:
as most bodybuilders are men, your going to get alot of male veiws. if this surprises you, i dont know what to say.

if you are treated so horribly on this site, go make an all female bodybuilding site. theres your option. only a woman would walk into an enviorment like this and expect everyone to change for them, which is what you want. im sure you have an excuse as to how this isnt asking ppl to change, but id like you to tell me how this is. youve been here awhile, this is how tings are talked about and the opinions we hold

i also love how we are being told we arent 'normal' guys. well if we arent, why are you getting your panties all wadded up, bitching and complaining?

bottom line? we arent appologetic about the posts and comments we make on here. its a hard world velvett, if you cant stand the heat, move into the living room.

and ill tell you what else, i wouldnt go on some crusade like this on a mostly female board. so ill tell you what they would prolly tell me: grow up.

You missed my point entirely.

I don't want to change anything or anyone nor do I feel the need to leave to an all female site. I am merely making a point of certain comments off of certain threads to create discussion to ponder what and how people (men) think.

I never said anyone treated me horribly here - if fact I would say I am treated very well by the male crowd considering my very outward, not always popular and open point of view.

I understand where everyone is coming from with their gripes and complaints, most of them I believe to be just based on the information given. I also believe that the *tough* guys on this boards are probably the most misunderstood males here.

I never said you personally were not normal - I did state that if you were to take some of these threads as representation of "males" this is the depiction you would get - right or wrong. To which I gave the opportunity for everyone to state why there are not like this or like that, which quite a few people did.

What I have done is turned the table and put man on the defense in a man's world - if one were to take for a moment EF as a small illustration of a whole gender.

It's not glamorous to be put of the defensive of a statement that groups you unfairly into a predetermining judgment based solely upon one's sex is it?

And darling' I love the heat, why do you think I am still here?

:devil:

velvett · May 4, 2003

vinylgroover said:
It's just a social revolution we are living through at the moment, and unfortunately for men, the current generation of men are having to live through this period where women are expecting and demanding far more out of life than to be 'kept'.

A - f**king MEN!

The Shadow · May 4, 2003

fuck wanting a kept woman.....I want mine to be independent, and have the ability to make her own decisions.

nevertoobig · May 4, 2003

velvett said:
You missed my point entirely.

And darling' I love the heat, why do you think I am still here?

This is a prime example of what I mean by being manipulative. I agree with teh post though, he did miss the point.

velvett · May 4, 2003

nevertoobig said:
This is a prime example of what I mean by being manipulative. I agree with teh post though, he did miss the point.

I learned my best manipulation skills from my father.
He is quite brilliant and too damn smart for his own good.

I think he is just an odd case though.

Or maybe I am.

vinylgroover · May 4, 2003

Cornholio said:
fuck wanting a kept woman.....I want mine to be independent, and have the ability to make her own decisions.

All guys say that corn..........then they meet one and they can't handle it.

nevertoobig · May 4, 2003

velvett said:
I learned my best manipulation skills from my father.
He is quite brilliant and too damn smart for his own good.

I think he is just an odd case though.

Or maybe I am.

The Shadow · May 4, 2003

vinylgroover said:
All guys say that corn..........then they meet one and they can't handle it.

I like my women to be hard to handle and easy to hold.

The Shadow · May 4, 2003

velvett said:
FEISTY!

OH HELL YEAH.....

velvett · May 4, 2003

Cornholio said:
I like my women to be hard to handle and easy to hold.

FEISTY!

Sinistar · May 4, 2003

It's not glamorous to be put of the defensive of a statement that groups you unfairly into a predetermining judgment based solely upon one's sex is it?

thats not quite what happened. i said if were so weird and odd, why were you getting upset. and if were normal, then isnt the problem you?

love to see the 'mans world' thing rolled out again.

mans world? i see this put out by women who think that being a man is easy. like getting to the highest places in the world is a cakewalk to a man. its hard for everyone. who wants to split hairs about who has it hardest? isnt that kind of demeaning? your pretty much telling a man who has made it, and blown ofand as for your initial thing about feeling forced to marryf women, friends, family, going out and having fun, plenty of times that his sacrafice is bullshit compared to a womans. now maybe thats not how you meant it, but thats how it sounds.

and for every woman who has it a grade harder than a man getting to the top, theres 5 who have fucked there way to the top. thats very unfair dont you think? not only to men, who i dont think, you really give a rats ass about, but for deserving women also. one thing i can gaurantee is that there arent many men at all who can/have fucked there way to te top. you dont hear much about this problem, cause i guess its all fair game cause men are holding you down.

honestly, i dont understand why this is such a surprise. the very dynamic of how humans relate and reproduce has a detrimental effect towards man straight off the bat. the basic thing is we pursue, and you judge. add that to the wasted money, time, thought, and stress, and its alot to juggle for...bullshit.

this of course goes without saying that the guy is playing the numbers game, a must to get anywhere.

i could go on. truth is, i dont hate females, but im there worst critic. a little gratitude and humanity would be a welcome change, since they are the pursued.

i guess it all boils down to alot of girls with a remarkable lack of class.

HULKSTER · May 4, 2003

What the hell just happened to my post?

ANABOLICK1 · May 4, 2003

You want to talk about the most manipulative, contemptible thing to ever walk the earth? Anna Nicole Smith.

nevertoobig · May 4, 2003

ANABOLICK1 said:
You want to talk about the most manipulative, contemptible thing to ever walk the earth? Anna Nicole Smith.

what makes you say that? Bare in mind that I don't even know who she is.

ANABOLICK1 · May 4, 2003

nevertoobig said:
what makes you say that? Bare in mind that I don't even know who she is.

She's an ex model/playboy playmate who dated a 90yr old billionaire, practically on his death bed, so she could inherit. it worked. Awarded her 100's of millions of $$ through the courts..

velvett · May 4, 2003

Ack. Nevermind.

naturally anabolic · May 4, 2003

naturally anabolic said:
is that a picture of your abs velvett? or u pulling a fonz?

velvett · May 5, 2003

Natty,

You won't find that belly in Victoria's Secret, Sports Illustrated or in Fredricks of Hollywood.

ANABOLICK1 · May 5, 2003

...I just don't trust something that bleeds for 5 days and doesn't die -- Mr. Garrett (South Park)

Reasons why I wonder why I still like men:

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