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Primobolan--- Bad on hair - True or False? Explain?

Zagreus

New member
Okay guys, I have heard mixed results on Primobolan and hair loss? I have done a cycle of Primo and want to hear other peoples experince before I present mine. Anyone experienced with Primo use please answer! Also if you due feel Primo is particularly bad on the hairline would a product like Finastride and nizerol help?

Thanks

Zag-
 
Did primo a long while ago, and had no problems with the hair, although I have heard of people having problems with it in the past. Im sure some people have used test prop, thinking that it was primo as this is a common fake when something is even actually put in. The only thing that made me shed was dbol. I have used winny tabs @ 50mgs/day and still no shedding, only on dbol. That is why I will never use dbol any more than 3 weeks with the proper protectants and shampoos. I think that I am somewhat predispositioned to MPB. Starting to receed a little by the temples, but my father is pretty damn bald (btw, that is bullshit that the gene comes from your mothers father). If you have parent that is bald, chances are that you will inherit it.

Mavy
 
am on primo now at 400mg a week and all is good.
keep in mind that i'm also on proviron at 25-50mg a day.
 
Theoretically primobolin is a dht derivative like winstrol and can cause hair loss in pre-disposed individuals as well as acne and oily skin, keep in mind it's a derivative and not DHT. DHT is not the only culprit in causing hair loss.The androgen content plays a huge role eg.Tren is very androgenic and doesn't convert to dht nor is it a derivative.I get more hair loss from 300mgs. of test a week than 300mgs. of primo.
I've done legit primo from greece(clear amps. ampule saws etc) at 300mgs/week with 200mgs. test cyp/wk. with finasteride 2.5mgs/day and experienced negligible hair loss.
The proscar wont help with the primo.Stick with the nizoral 2% and throw in some topical spiro 5%.
 
b1ewsw32 said:
Theoretically primobolin is a dht derivative like winstrol and can cause hair loss in pre-disposed individuals as well as acne and oily skin, keep in mind it's a derivative and not DHT. DHT is not the only culprit in causing hair loss.The androgen content plays a huge role eg.Tren is very androgenic and doesn't convert to dht nor is it a derivative.I get more hair loss from 300mgs. of test a week than 300mgs. of primo.
I've done legit primo from greece(clear amps. ampule saws etc) at 300mgs/week with 200mgs. test cyp/wk. with finasteride 2.5mgs/day and experienced negligible hair loss.
The proscar wont help with the primo.Stick with the nizoral 2% and throw in some topical spiro 5%.
Actually, primo is NOT a DHT derivative (Look up the structure). It is 1-methyl-1-testosterone. If anything, it is more of a 1-test derivative than a DHT derivative. Also, DHT is not the only thing that causes hairloss. Any androgen can cause hairloss and the more androgenic the drug, the more potential for hairloss there is. Hairloss is a strictly androgenic side effect.

Primo is not very androgenic in comparison to most other AS. 1-Test is even a much more powerful androgen than primo. The 1 methyl group seems to reduce the androgenicity quite a lot. I theorize that the methyl group must sterically hinder binding to the AR's. I personally have no experience with primo but since hairloss is an androgen related problem, I don't think primo would be as hard on the hair as other more androgenic drugs. As Mavy said, primo is often faked with other cheaper steroids like test prop or test enan. Test is much more androgenic than primo and would be expected to be harder on the hair; thus the rumors of primo being hard on the hair.
 
Spidey said:
Actually, primo is NOT a DHT derivative (Look up the structure). It is 1-methyl-1-testosterone. If anything, it is more of a 1-test derivative than a DHT derivative. Also, DHT is not the only thing that causes hairloss. Any androgen can cause hairloss and the more androgenic the drug, the more potential for hairloss there is. Hairloss is a strictly androgenic side effect.

Primo is not very androgenic in comparison to most other AS. 1-Test is even a much more powerful androgen than primo. The 1 methyl group seems to reduce the androgenicity quite a lot. I theorize that the methyl group must sterically hinder binding to the AR's. I personally have no experience with primo but since hairloss is an androgen related problem, I don't think primo would be as hard on the hair as other more androgenic drugs. As Mavy said, primo is often faked with other cheaper steroids like test prop or test enan. Test is much more androgenic than primo and would be expected to be harder on the hair; thus the rumors of primo being hard on the hair.
HMMM....I stand corrected.Methenolone is actually dihydroboldenone, so it's a derivative of boldenone via 5 alpha reduction. I was just trying to recall my original info obtained from philips many moons ago, where he classified it as a dht deriv. along with winstrol. :bawling: Good to see we're on the ball and in agreement on the more important aspects of this thread. :mix:
 
QUOTE]my father is pretty damn bald (btw, that is bullshit that the gene comes from your mothers father). If you have parent that is bald, chances are that you will inherit it.[/QUOTE] [/B]

That is 100% correct. Doctors used to believe that baldness was inherited from the mothers side. Recent research has shown this to be completley inaccurate.

Back onto the topic of primo...
Just because a drug is a derivative of DHT does not necessarily mean it WILL convert to DHT within the body and aggrivate the receptors in your scalp. I also would'nt worry about what drugs cause a increase in MPB unless your gentically predisposed to MPB. There seems to be a lot of people around this board who have a full head of hair, yet are paranoid about losing it.
 
b1ewsw32 said:

HMMM....I stand corrected.Methenolone is actually dihydroboldenone, so it's a derivative of boldenone via 5 alpha reduction. . :mix:

1) so using EQ with low dose aromatase inhibitor is basically a cheap way to do primo?

2) any idea on comparable doses?
 
geoboy said:


1) so using EQ with low dose aromatase inhibitor is basically a cheap way to do primo?

2) any idea on comparable doses?
Excellent question,as I knew that it was only a matter of time before somebody asked this.You would probably need gallons of Eq to achieve this as Eq does not have a high affinity for the 5AR enzyme.Let's just say that if you needed 2000mg. of Eq to convert into 100mg of methenolone,do you think you would feel the kick of that primo,especially when you have 2 grams of eq floating around,it's kind of like adding a sip of coke to your eca stack...redundant, to say the least.Also I dont know if there are other modifications needed other than just 5AR conversion.
There is a slight merit in stacking Methenolone with boldenone, because apart from its 1-methyl group, methenolone is basically DHB, the 5-alpha-reduced form of boldenone. But since boldenone itself has very low affinity for 5-alpha-reduction, it should have a good synergistic effect stacking the two at 300 mg/week each.
 
satchboogie said:
am on primo now at 400mg a week and all is good.
keep in mind that i'm also on proviron at 25-50mg a day.

if the proviron isn't killing your hair, you're just not predisposed.
lucky bastard :mad: .
 
b1ewsw32 said:
HMMM....I stand corrected.Methenolone is actually dihydroboldenone, so it's a derivative of boldenone via 5 alpha reduction. [/B]
LOL, No it is not dihydroboldeneone. Did you look at the structure? Bodenone has no 1-methyl group. If you want to name things that way, then 1-testosterone=dihydroboldenone. This is not a flame but come on man, if you are going to contribute, make sure you know what you are talking about. Primo can not be converted to a DHT derivative as it lacks the prerequisit 4,5 double bond. It is not a substrate for the 5-AR enzyme. It also is not a substrate for aromatase (requires the same 4,5-double bond). Eq, on the other hand is a substrate for both aromatase and 5-alpha reductase and is converted to some degree into 1-test (by 5-AR) or estrogen (aromatase). Chemically, EQ and primo have very little in common.

b1ewsw32 said:

Excellent question,as I knew that it was only a matter of time before somebody asked this.You would probably need gallons of Eq to achieve this as Eq does not have a high affinity for the 5AR enzyme.Let's just say that if you needed 2000mg. of Eq to convert into 100mg of methenolone,do you think you would feel the kick of that primo,especially when you have 2 grams of eq floating around,it's kind of like adding a sip of coke to your eca stack...redundant, to say the least.Also I dont know if there are other modifications needed other than just 5AR conversion.
There is a slight merit in stacking Methenolone with boldenone, because apart from its 1-methyl group, methenolone is basically DHB, the 5-alpha-reduced form of boldenone. But since boldenone itself has very low affinity for 5-alpha-reduction, it should have a good synergistic effect stacking the two at 300 mg/week each.
This is all completely wrong. Boldenone does not convert to primo. You are way off base here.
 
Primobolan is a well-known and popular steroid as well. Like nandrolone it's most often used as a base compound for stacking with other steroids. Methenolone however, is a DHT-based steroid (actually, DHB or dihydroboldenone, the 5-alpha reduced of the milder boldenon). Meaning when it interacts with the aromatase enzyme it does not form estrogens at all. That makes it ideal for use when cutting when excess estrogen is best avoided because of its retentive effects on water and fat. Methenolone is mostly only used in such instances, or by people who are very succeptible to estrogenic side-effects, because the anabolic activity of methenolone is slightly lower than that of nandrolone, quite likely BECAUSE it is non-estrogenic.

Because it is a widely available steroid its often used as a replacement for nandrolone or boldenone to those who have no access to Deca-Durabolin or Laurabolin or Equipoise. When stacked with a heavy mass steroid like testosterone and/or methandrostenolone it can deliver almost similar gains. Those seeking to cut will most likely be very pleased stacking it with drostanolone, stanozolol or trenbolone. Women and beginners also stack methenolone WITH nandrolone because this gives a mildly anabolic stack that is generally regarded as one of the safer stacks around in an androgenic perspective. But alas, with the nandrolone, also a very suppressive stack.

Methenolone is available as an injection or as an oral. The injection is naturally regarded as better. Its an enanthate ester which is quite long-acting and only needs to be injected once a week in doses of 300-600 mg. Because it by-passes hepatic breakdown on the first pass, it also has a higher survival rate. The orals are a lot less handy, but often preferred by bodybuilders who are afraid of needles or who are already taking one or more injectable compounds. The tabs are in a short-lived acetate form, meaning that doses of 100-150 mg per day are needed, split over 2 or 3 doses, making the tabs quite inconvenient for use. The reason doses need to be split up, unlike most oral steroids, is because Methenolone is not 17-alpha-alkylated, but 1-methylated for oral bio-availability. This reduces the liver stress, but also the availability, hence the multiple and high doses needed daily.

Like nandrolone, methenolone is very mild on the system. Probably the reason why both are strongly favored as base compounds in stacks. Methenolone has no estrogenic side-effects whatsoever, on account of its structure. Its effects on the cholesterol levels are barely noticeable. In doses of 200 mg or less (injectable) blood pressure is rarely, if at all, altered. As for hepatoxicity, long-term use will of course increase liver values but gradually and only slightly. The injections of course, since they only pass the liver once, have roughly half the liver-toxic effects of the tabs. The low liver-toxicity is accounted for that the bio-availability of methenolone is carried by a 1-methyl-group, which lessens the need for a carrier attachment such as a 17-alpha-akylated group, the main culprit in steroid-related liver afflictions.

The strangest thing however, taking into account that Primo is still a DHT (or rather DHB) derivative, is that it is quite easy on the system androgenically as well. Women use methenolone often, usually the tabs, and find little virilisation symptoms in short term use of methenolone. Long-term use may induce some acne and a deepening of the voice however. Methenolone is also not overly suppressive of the HPT axis (endocrinal axis for the production of natural testosterone). These are both the result of DHB's 1,2-double bond, which, analog to the parent structure boldenone, reduces the androgenic binding by 50% as opposed to DHT.

For athletes who wish to maintain a "natural" status in competition, the tablets are quite well-suited as detection chances for the acetate-form are quite slim. However tests have improved and quite a number of metabolites1 of methenolone can be detected with a simple urine sample. But an English study documented that there is a liability in eating methenolone contaminated meats2, which could provide a possible defense if found out. One could always claim they ate the meat of a chicken or cow injected with methenolone since the test concluded eating such meat does not improve performance, but can deliver positive tests for several methenolone metabolites almost 24 hours after ingestion. That's for those of you seeking a viable defense against a possible methenolone-positive.

Stacking and Use:

Methenolone comes in orals and injectables. The injectables are to be preferred as they can be used for quite some time and only require injecting once a week. The orals are taking every day, or multiple times a day. An oral passes through the liver twice. An injectable only once. The injectable is more effective since less is broken down.

Methenolone is not used all that often by experienced users. It makes a good product as an alternative to Deca or EQ in a cutting stack, because it has similar properties but does not aromatize and does not have progestagenic activity. But those at least slightly versed will prefer boldenone over methenolone as its more potent gram for gram. Its quite mild, so its not as prone to cause your standard side-effects. This too makes it quite popular with beginners. Methenolone was quite popular during the 70's in stacks with Methandrostenolone. Some of the all-time greats of bodybuilding were quite fond of this stack.

The common use is similar to that of Nandrolone. 300-400 mg a week, in conjunction with other steroids mostly. Some attempt to make up for the lack of potency switching from nandrolone or boldenone to methenolone by using higher doses, in the neighbourhood of 600-800 mg a week. At that point I feel it would be cheaper to opt for boldenone at 300-400 mg a week though. Methenolone makes a poor stacking partner in mass stacks as both Deca and EQ provide better results while they are qualitatively similar. There is a slight merit in stacking Methenolone with boldenone, because apart from its 1-methyl group, methenolone is basically DHB, the 5-alpha-reduced form of boldenone. But since boldenone itself has very low affinity for 5-alpha-reduction, it should have a good synergistic effect stacking the two at 300 mg/week each.

There is no use for alternate drugs since it does not aromatize, is quite mild and the gains are fairly easy to maintain, so post-cycle use of clomid or Nolvadex is not warranted.

References

1 Goudreault D, Masse R., Studies on anabolic steroids--4. Identification of new urinary metabolites of methenolone acetate (Primobolan) in human by gas chromatography/mass spectrometry.,J Steroid Biochem Mol Biol. 1990 Sep;37(1):137-54.

2 Kicman AT, Cowan DA, Myhre L, Nilsson S, Tomten S, Oftebro H., Effect on sports drug tests of ingesting meat from steroid (methenolone)-treated livestock., Clin Chem. 1994 Nov;40(11 Pt 1):2084-7.

Thanks for calling me blind and ignorant to my face! As you cannot obviously see, I didn't write the article.If you want to spend more needless time proving me wrong...It's a derivative of this and not that...blah blah go ahead. I have more important things to do than engage in a pissing contest with you on such miniscule details. I was just trying to help someone with some info I tried to dig up. You my friend,missed the big picture, as we both agreed on the androgenic content being more of a relavent factor. Did I give someone dangerous advice? You think someone is grabbing 10 grams of boldenone attempting to transform it into primo right now?I dont think anyone is dramatic as you!
Go ahead genius chemist...there's the journal references. I guess your going for the nobel peace prize with this one, more like the debating team award. I know what I read."apart from it's 1-methyl group methenolone is basically DHB"
I've had enough, this discussion is dead to me! R.I.P.
:mad: :mad:
 
Nice work b1ewsw32! Nothing better than to run something in someones face after they have been beaking off.

In my next cycle I am stacking primo with EQ. Although similar they are not the same and work synergystically together for a very "anabolic" cycle.

I would have to say though that EQ is most comparable dbol though. Actually, EQ is almost identicle to d-bol. The only difference is EQ has been 17 beta esterfied while d-bol has been 17 alpha alkylated. But this small change makes the two hormones act very differently in the body.

Mavy
 
b1ewsw32 said:
Thanks for calling me blind and ignorant to my face! As you cannot obviously see, I didn't write the article.If you want to spend more needless time proving me wrong...It's a derivative of this and not that...blah blah go ahead. I have more important things to do than engage in a pissing contest with you on such miniscule details. I was just trying to help someone with some info I tried to dig up. You my friend,missed the big picture, as we both agreed on the androgenic content being more of a relavent factor. Did I give someone dangerous advice? You think someone is grabbing 10 grams of boldenone attempting to transform it into primo right now?I dont think anyone is dramatic as you!

LOL, Looks like I touched a nerve there. My previous response was not intended to be a flame (as I said in the response). I was not trying to initiate a "pissing contest" and nothing you said could be construed as "dangerous". You are right. No one cares. So, I was all set to let this go. You get offended too easily. People should be able to disagree with you without your getting so upset. All I was saying is that the information you gave is simply wrong and misleading. Eq has little in common with primo and saying that it does is misleading. Primo is not equivalent to "DHB". 1-Test is DHB (as you define DHB). 1-Test is many times more androgenic than primo. They are not equivalent or even similar in that respect. It isn't a DHT analog. DHT is ten times as androgenic as test itself. Even if the 1,2-double bond reduces androgenicity by 50% as the article claimes, that means primo should be 5 times more androgenic than test! Of course that isn't true. 1-Test has been measured to be 5 - 7 times more androgenic than test though so maybe the 50% reduction in androgenicity due to the 1,2-double bond may not be too far off. The 1-methyl group on primo has nothing to do with it's oral bioavailability nor does it offer any protection against liver degradation. It is responsible for a drastic reduction in androgenicity however. It has to be the 1-methyl group because if you take it away (1-test), androgenicity increases many fold. Even proviron (1-methyl-DHT) is not extrordinarily androgenic despite it's being a DHT analog.

I don't recall calling you ignorant or blind. In fact, I tried to be polite throughout my response even though maybe it came out a little wrong. I know you didn't write the article but you did copy and paste it here as true information so you are responsible for it's content, right or wrong.

b1ewsw32 said:
Go ahead genius chemist...there's the journal references. I guess your going for the nobel peace prize with this one, more like the debating team award. I know what I read."apart from it's 1-methyl group methenolone is basically DHB"
I've had enough, this discussion is dead to me! R.I.P.
:mad: :mad:
I was going to just let this go since you're right in that no one really cares about the little details but I just have to answer this. It involves my integrity as a scientist, LOL. You sound as though your giving me the journal references proves your point or something. The journal articles you cite (although I am not clear on where in the article you cite them) talk about completely different subjects than what is in your post and, therefore, don't mean very much in the context of this discussion. The first details the HPLC identification of urinary metabolites of oral primo in humans. Here is the abstract:

"The metabolism of methenolone acetate (17 beta-acetoxy-1-methyl-5 alpha-androst-1-en-3-one), a synthetic anabolic steroid, has been investigated in man. After oral administration of a 50 mg dose of the steroid to two male volunteers, twelve metabolites were detected in urine either in the glucuronide, sulfate or free steroid fractions. Methenolone, the parent steroid was detected in urine until 90 h after administration. Its cumulative urinary excretion accounted for 1.63% of the ingested dose. With the exception of 3 alpha-hydroxy-1-methylen-5 alpha-androstan-17-one, the major biotransformation product of methonolone acetate, metabolites were excreted in urine at lower levels, through minor metabolic routes. Most of methenolone acetate metabolites were isolated from the glucuronic acid fraction, namely methenolone, 3 alpha-hydroxy-1-methylen-5 alpha-androstan-17-one, 3 alpha-hydroxy-1 alpha-methyl-5 alpha-androstan-17-one, 17-epimethenolone, 3 alpha,6 beta-dihydroxy-1-methylen-5 alpha-androstan-17-one, 2 xi-hydroxy-1-methylen-5 alpha-androstan-3,17-dione, 6 beta-hydroxy-1-methyl-5 alpha-androst-1-en-3,17-dione, 16 alpha-hydroxy-1-methyl-5 alpha-androst-1-en-3,17-dione and 3 alpha,16 alpha-dihydroxy-1-methyl-5 alpha-androst-1-en-17-one. Interestingly, the metabolites detected in the sulfate fraction were isomeric steroids bearing a 16 alpha- or a 16 beta-hydroxyl group, whereas 1-methyl-5 alpha-androst-1-en-3,17-dione was the sole metabolite isolated from the free steroid fraction. Steroids identity was assigned on the basis of the mass spectral features of their TMS ether, TMS enol-TMS ether, MO-TMS, and d9-TMS ether derivatives and by comparison with reference and structurally related steroids. The data indicated that methenolone acetate was metabolized into several compounds resulting from oxidation of the 17-hydroxyl group and reduction of A-ring substituents, with or without concomitant hydroxylation at the C6 and C16 positions ."

Now, do you see anything in that abstract about "DHB" or any comparisons to boldenone? Do you, in fact, see ANYTHING in that abstract that corroberates any of the information in the article you pasted? If you do, please outline it because I don't see it.

The other journal citation deals with the effects of giving chickens primo and then feeding them to people to see if steroid metabolites can be found in the human urine after injesting meat from a steroid treated animal. Here is the abstract:

"Anabolic-androgenic steroids are widely misused in human sports and are also used as growth promoters in livestock. Athletes who consume meat containing such hormone residues may risk failing a sports drug test. Prompted by an athlete's defense case, we questioned whether the consumption of small livestock given doses of anabolic steroid, orally or intramuscularly, could generate positive results in samples tested by our analytical procedures. We analyzed urine from eight men who consumed chickens that had been either fed with methenolone acetate (1 mg/day) from day 0 to 21 or injected with methenolone heptanoate depot (1 mg/intramuscular injection) on days 0, 7, and 14 and slaughtered on day 22. No methenolone or characteristic major metabolite was detected in samples from subjects who ate meat from the orally dosed chickens. However, 50% of the samples collected 24 h after consumption of the intramuscularly dosed chickens were confirmed positive. Hence, eating meat containing small amounts of injected hormone may constitute a serious liability to the athlete."

What does this article have to do with the androgenicity or chemical nature of primo? Nothing that I can see. You could not have even read the articles or you wouldn't have even included them. You cited completely irrelevant journal articles which were probably cited in the article you read (and then cut and pasted here). All I can think of is that the original author was betting that most people wouldn't take the time and effort to actually read the references and he/she just threw in a couple of arbitrary references with "steroid" in the title to make the article more convincing. Either that, or the references were taken completely out of context and you didn't paste the relevant parts of the original article. I am willing to bet on the latter since I think most people have better ethics (not to mention good sense) than to do the former.

Now that I have defended my scientific honor, I can let this go and everyone out there in cyber world can believe whatever they want about the comparisons of EQ and Primo. :D
 
That is 100% correct. Doctors used to believe that baldness was inherited from the mothers side. Recent research has shown this to be completley inaccurate.

if what i remember from genetics is correct, mpb is a recessive gene. meaning both parents must be carriers and the person with mpb has received mpb genes from both parents. if a person receives it from only one parent he can be a carrier but will not experience it. if your father has it, then he WILL pass the gene along, then you have to look to your mother's side. i don't think i'm being very clear here though.

pretend z is the mpb gene, it takes two z's for you to have it.


mother Zz, father Zz if you get zz you will have mpb. if you get Zz you will not have mpb, but you can pass the z gene along to your children (along with whatever their mother gives). if you get ZZ you will not carry nor possess mpb. of course any person may have anyone of ZZ, Zz, or zz: only the zz will show signs of mpb. does this make sense to anyone?

jkerry
 
JKerry said:


if what i remember from genetics is correct, mpb is a recessive gene. meaning both parents must be carriers and the person with mpb has received mpb genes from both parents. if a person receives it from only one parent he can be a carrier but will not experience it. if your father has it, then he WILL pass the gene along, then you have to look to your mother's side. i don't think i'm being very clear here though.

pretend z is the mpb gene, it takes two z's for you to have it.


mother Zz, father Zz if you get zz you will have mpb. if you get Zz you will not have mpb, but you can pass the z gene along to your children (along with whatever their mother gives). if you get ZZ you will not carry nor possess mpb. of course any person may have anyone of ZZ, Zz, or zz: only the zz will show signs of mpb. does this make sense to anyone?

jkerry
Good job; very understandable. This makes more sense to me than getting MPB just from mother's side. Too bad for me though. My maternal grandfather is 86 and still has a full head of hair. My paternal grandfather was completely bald by the time he was 25. My dad has MPB too. My hairline has receded quite a bit so I WISH it was all up to the mother's side, LOL.
 
Too bad for me though. My maternal grandfather is 86 and still has a full head of hair.

even though he had a full head of hair, he could have still been a carrier Zz. since it's a recessive gene, you must have both zz to show signs.

jkerry
 
For those that are not prone to male pattern baldness. Would the effects of AS use accelerate the process?

i'm not certain, but i don't think so. you either have it, or you don't. there's not an inbetween.

jkerry
 
xxbignipperxx said:
For those that are not prone to male pattern baldness. Would the effects of AS use accelerate the process?

search on "telogen effluvium" here and on bodybuilding.com
 
Spidey said:


1-Test is many times more androgenic than primo.

True. But take into account the fact that it's also many times more anabolic. So the anabolic:androgenic ratio doesn't differ that much. It would be around 1.74:1 for Primo and 1.62:1 for 1-Test ... So it's almost the same. Perhaps people who experience more MPB with 1-test than with Primo are also experiencing more anabolic effects. Given these ratios, for the same anabolic effect Primo and 1-Test should display similar androgenic side effects.
The study where I arrived at this conclusion:

Steroids (1966) volume 8, issue 2, page 216

By subcutaneous injection with castrated rats using levator ani as indicator of anabolic activity:

Testosterone Propionate (standard) : 100

1-Tesosterone: 210

Methenolone (primobolan): 88


Androgenic activity is determined by seminal vesicle and ventral prostate weight. How these relate to MPB, I can't say exactly

Testosterone Prop: 100(SV) 100 (VP)

1-Testsosterone: 135(SV) 123(VP)

Methenolone: 44(SV) 57(57)
 
Ran Primo with test prop and nothing happened to my hair

Then you, or any othe other people, who previously made statements like "dbol does not effect my hair" etc etc, are not at all adding to any post regarding hairloss and AAS use. I wish people who normally use AAS like drol, dbol, fina, Test, proviron, and winny with no hairloss would not waste the time of people who use them (like me) with hairloss by responding to this post and all future posts. They are not helpful in determining how harsh on the hairline certain AAS are and what methods help in preventing them to us users who ARE prone. Thanks!
:D :D

PG
 
if hair is of concern to you... do NOT gamble with it

cause once its gone its gone for good

stick to deca, var and perhaps eq to be on the safe
side....
 
rush said:
if hair is of concern to you... do NOT gamble with it

cause once its gone its gone for good

stick to deca, var and perhaps eq to be on the safe
side....

Deca??? I don't think it's worth to risk it with progestagenic gyno and testicle cancer due to BRUTAL hpta supression. Deca is not the mild steroid everybody thinks ... It has side effects that make more androgenic steroids' pale in comparison.
 
re: teston and bold

I am about 130 lbs and I know some stuff has a lot of side effects and are not good for woman. I have taken Primobolan - methenolone - and anavar and loved both of them. I only can get these and propinate how much should I take and how often. and what should I take for ptc? any help pleeeeaaase!!
 
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