Please Scroll Down to See Forums Below Hey guys I'm 100% new to the world of pharmaceuticals. I had posted another thread asking questions about bulking and in the end I decided to stay natural for a while longer. Over the last few weeks I've done mountains of research and I've come to the conclusion that I began my journey into this to get lean and achieve a physical condition that I could be proud of. I've been in the gym for some time now and I work hard to get better every day. I found an article thread on evolutionary talking about an oral only cycle for beginners. What are your opinions? Should things be added deleted or replaced ? I like the concept of t3, I've read about the dangers and possible problems what's your experience? Cycling isn't something I intend to do on a regular basis and I'd like to get as much out of my first one as possible while being as safe as reasonably possible. This is the cycle and the pct. All opinions and advise are greatly appreciated.
Oral only cutting cycle
- Thread starter sokymike
- Start date
suriadventures
New member
What's wrong with this cycle ? How can I improve on it ? I like the idea of an oral only cycle simply because It negates the probability of me messing something up. My under is that by going oral only it makes the cycle more toxic. At 8 weeks would this cycle be liver safe ?
B
bigorse
Guest
Liver safe? Eh you could do worse. Side effects galore, no sex drive, motivation and sore joints yes
B
bigorse
Guest
Get lean natural and do a test only fist cycle as a "bulk"
Two orals is a no no. I think you want to do this because it's easy, do you know anavar is hard to get hold of well the good stuff you will probably end up doing all Winstrol. I was just like you but now I'm doing my first test e cycle 500mg a week and I might chuck in some anavar in the last six weeks if everything goes ok with the test good luck but seriously think about the test if you dead set on trying aas. Good luck
"Oral Only" should be followed by the words "if you have a vagina" ....
Enuf Said?
Enuf Said?
SwollenMember_18
New member
Oral only = feel like shit for a few weeks, make slim to no gains, loose it all once you stop, be shutdown, liver damage, and money terribly spent
Absolute waste of time. Either man up, jump on the test train and get comfortable with IM injections. Or stay natty for life and be happy with what your body can achieve un-enhanced.
Absolute waste of time. Either man up, jump on the test train and get comfortable with IM injections. Or stay natty for life and be happy with what your body can achieve un-enhanced.
SwollenMember_18
New member
Cut natty, get to your goal bodyfat percent.
Start your first cycle lean, and use it for a "bulk" cycle... You will be unhappy using a first cycle as a cutter. You want to make use of being extremely anabolic and grow as much as you can for your first blast. You will be very grateful you went abut it this way in the future.
I would suggest you hop on ECA stack, or Clen if you realllllly want to. Get lean. Then start a test enanthate or cyp cycle at 500mg/week for 12-14 weeks eating like a horse
Start your first cycle lean, and use it for a "bulk" cycle... You will be unhappy using a first cycle as a cutter. You want to make use of being extremely anabolic and grow as much as you can for your first blast. You will be very grateful you went abut it this way in the future.
I would suggest you hop on ECA stack, or Clen if you realllllly want to. Get lean. Then start a test enanthate or cyp cycle at 500mg/week for 12-14 weeks eating like a horse
What are the sides of clen ? I've been cutting for a year and a half. I was 411 lbs at 85% bf when I started this journey. I'm now 255 and high 20s in my bf. I've been working hard and eating a clean 500 calories deficit. I do an hour of cardio every morning and lift every evening. I was dropping like 5 to 10 lbs a week now I'm struggling to get 2 or 3 off.ive busted my ass trying to accomplish this, I'm just looking for some help over the top. How do it dose clen ? Could I stack the eca with it ? What's your opinion on stacking sarms with it ?
SwollenMember_18
New member
Sarms would be another good route to go if you really think you need an extra kick, although I have not run them myself and have heard conflicting opinions, lots of people do swear by them
If you were to run Clen it would be by itself not stacked with ECA, it sounds like you've made some amazing progress on your own and I can understand the need to want the results faster. But this is the game we play my friend! I would not start injectable or oral AAS over 15% bodyfat.
The Clen sides are mostly shakes, elevated heart rate, BP increase, and muscle cramping. If you start very low around 20-40 mcg a day and work your way up from there depending on your tolerance it is fairly safe to run for short time periods. Sounds like your still on the right track though my
Man! I would just get on ECA and keep pushin hard!! The work will pay off, and once you have achieved that, you could look into enhancement as to improve upon what you have already built.
Very impressive what you have achieved this far though man, and although I can't condone use of AAS for you yet, keep working hard, and come back here when you have a bit more experience, knowledge, and a better base to work from and start fresh!
Good luck with your journey! Keep grinding!!!
If you were to run Clen it would be by itself not stacked with ECA, it sounds like you've made some amazing progress on your own and I can understand the need to want the results faster. But this is the game we play my friend! I would not start injectable or oral AAS over 15% bodyfat.
The Clen sides are mostly shakes, elevated heart rate, BP increase, and muscle cramping. If you start very low around 20-40 mcg a day and work your way up from there depending on your tolerance it is fairly safe to run for short time periods. Sounds like your still on the right track though my
Man! I would just get on ECA and keep pushin hard!! The work will pay off, and once you have achieved that, you could look into enhancement as to improve upon what you have already built.
Very impressive what you have achieved this far though man, and although I can't condone use of AAS for you yet, keep working hard, and come back here when you have a bit more experience, knowledge, and a better base to work from and start fresh!
Good luck with your journey! Keep grinding!!!
RADAR
Well-known member
Congrats on the weight loss, i submitted a link to what you need to know about clen.
Clenbuterol Cycle for Cutting: Schedule, Dosages, and Results
polarbear1134
Banned
85% at 411 would be 349 lbs of fat in your body.
28% at 255 would be 71.4 lbs of fat in your body.
How did you lose 277.6 lbs of body fat on a 500 calorie diet while only losing 156 total pounds? That would be you somehow gained 121.6 lbs of muscle while on a natty 500 cal starvation diet.
I suspect the answer is you are about 255 and 45% body fat currently
SwollenMember_18
New member
I suspect he was not 85% bodyfat to begin with. That is almost physiologically impossible with bone and muscle mass equated in as well.....
Either way I won't be judging!!! The dedication and work ethic it takes to loose that much weight in itself is a MAJOR feat!!! Fucking awesome progress no matter what the bf% is
The way I'm gauging my bf% is through an electronic guage that you grip im not really sure how it works nor how accurate it is. I'm basing those number off that devise I bought on amazon hoping to help track my progress. I had congestive heart failure October 23 2013. That's what brought on my lifestyle change. At 22 years old with 2 kids I had to change what I was doing. My starting bench max was no joke 50 lbs in a 10 rep set. I look at guys in great shape and see the life style they live, I want that for myself, I will do whatever it takes to get there. I really can't express enough how much I appreciate the input and advise. It because of people like you that I've been able to make it as far as I have. I've got a stellar trainer and a nutritionist that have helped me lay out my workouts and diet. My cardiologist has cleared me with a clean bill on my heart and my blood panels look better than ever . I don't use insulin anymore and I've been able to come off all my meds. Achieving a body I can be proud of means more to me than I can express because I never thought it would be possible. If clen is the most extreme route that's the one I'll take. There's a guy on here I've spoken with before who swears by sarms. I think I'm going to consult with him and see what he recommends stacking with it in that department. I don't wanna step on any toes but if anyone would pm me with a safe gear shop I'd also appreciate that as well.
polarbear1134
Banned
The reason I brought up #s is clen is some dangerous crap if you are heavy, have high bp or a weak heart. Especially if you are still near the 30% spot. Also if you are are at 30% you can get something 100 times better... a real actual prescription for phentermine with a DR checking up on you each month. Albuterol works the same way as clen but with a short half life...meaning if you react bad less time before its out of your system....Think of it this way if clen sent your BP to 200 for 12 hrs straight can your current body handle that? Albuterol would likely only effect you for 3-4 hrs. While that could still be really bad...I would take 3-4 hrs of it over 12 hrs any day. So if you insist on going down this route use the shorter half life version albuterol. Also consider albuterol is an actual people med while clen is approved for nothing except live stock.
SwollenMember_18
New member
This is definately a solid point, the higher the BF the more dangerous ALL compounds and fat loss drugs are
There is also meridia, it's a discontinued diet pill, won't burn fat directly but lemme tell ya it's tough to even finish a chicken breast when you be poppin those baby's back
Thank you for explaining. I wasn't aware that being at a higher bf would cause the compounds to react adversely. According to the cardiologist my heart is normal at this point. ( no longer weak and no long term damage) I've spoken with my general care doctor about prescription wieght loss drugs and while he's a great doctor his exact words were " I do not condone the use of medication for wieght loss. Eat right, exercise and let your body adapt naturally." So that's what I've done. Perks of living in a really small town in guess.
Would the same be true for sarms ? I ordered an eca called black widow this evening so we will see how it works for me. As far as Albuterol isn't that what they put in inhalers? How difficult is it to find Meridia? If I go further into deficit in my calories will it not cause me to start dropping muscle mass as well ? How do I prevent that ?
Would the same be true for sarms ? I ordered an eca called black widow this evening so we will see how it works for me. As far as Albuterol isn't that what they put in inhalers? How difficult is it to find Meridia? If I go further into deficit in my calories will it not cause me to start dropping muscle mass as well ? How do I prevent that ?
SwollenMember_18
New member
Mmmm I'm not sure about meridia sources, I have a source that lives down the street so it's easy for me. Younwouldnhave to ask around. As for your deficit and muscle loss, that needs to be a major second priority right now. Don't go crazy with the deficit and make sure your only dropping calories when fat loss haults. The slower the better when natty. But seriously focus on fat loss, you will rebound nicely when you are lean and be able to pack on some muscle! Just lift heavy to maintain as much as possible! Keep protein high carbs low-moderate and healthy fats moderate and you should continue to see results. If nothing else is working, take a week or 2 and just eat normally around maintenance, then re assess and start the cut again, this will give your body a chance to re adapt to the given deficit! You are doing great work this far my friend, update us on the results with the sarm and we can continue to guide you from there!
Alright guys my research has led to the conclusion that despite the possibility of issues I'm going to stagger into the world of aas and sarms.
SARMS cutting stack 8 weeks
S-4 (Andarine) 50 mcg
GW-501516 (Cardarine) 40
Add in MK-2866 (Ostarine) 60
at week 9 and continue the whole mess through for 12 weeks. Run 4 weeks pct and roll into a clen winny and test cycle for 8 additional weeks. How can I tweak my dosages to get the best results? Is more really ....... more ? I'm hoping to cut for 12 weeks hard at seriously caloric deficit and lower my bf % to a safer range to run the aas. During my 4 week pct I'm hoping to bridge between the 2 and just set long enough to let everything stabilize before I take the jump on the aas. If I don't meet my bf goals I'll simply run the same sarms cycle again until I do. Does this look and sound logical?
SARMS cutting stack 8 weeks
S-4 (Andarine) 50 mcg
GW-501516 (Cardarine) 40
Add in MK-2866 (Ostarine) 60
at week 9 and continue the whole mess through for 12 weeks. Run 4 weeks pct and roll into a clen winny and test cycle for 8 additional weeks. How can I tweak my dosages to get the best results? Is more really ....... more ? I'm hoping to cut for 12 weeks hard at seriously caloric deficit and lower my bf % to a safer range to run the aas. During my 4 week pct I'm hoping to bridge between the 2 and just set long enough to let everything stabilize before I take the jump on the aas. If I don't meet my bf goals I'll simply run the same sarms cycle again until I do. Does this look and sound logical?
B
bigorse
Guest
Time on = time off. You do an 8 week sarm cycle you take 8 weeks off anything hormonal such as test and winny.
Clenbuterol you can do 2 weeks on 2 weeks off for 10-12 when ever possibly between cycles as it isnt hormonal. You could also run gw indefinitely as it also isnt hormonal
Clenbuterol you can do 2 weeks on 2 weeks off for 10-12 when ever possibly between cycles as it isnt hormonal. You could also run gw indefinitely as it also isnt hormonal
So scrap the test and winny? Cycle the s4 and Ostarine 8 weeks each with a 4 week overlap then jump the clen while doing my pct ? I'd end up with pretty much a staggered 24 week cycle which should put me close to where I wanna be by early winter. At that point I could plan out my first big bulking blast and be ready for next summer. With taking that route, how do I estimate my dosages? Will the sarms cause any effect on how well the clen works? Obviously I want to get the most out of my time work and money so can you guys help me lay out the max dosage logical for a 100% beginner? I wanna plan for the max to base my order off of then start low and dial it up as possible.
B
bigorse
Guest
Okay ill lay my opinion out for you.
1-10 ostarine 25mg daily
1-10 s4 50-100mg daily
11-14 nolvadex 40 40 20 20
1-20 gw 501516
8-20 Clenbuterol (2 weeks on 2 weeks off)
Then do a test only cycle once your bodyfat is nice and low
1-10 ostarine 25mg daily
1-10 s4 50-100mg daily
11-14 nolvadex 40 40 20 20
1-20 gw 501516
8-20 Clenbuterol (2 weeks on 2 weeks off)
Then do a test only cycle once your bodyfat is nice and low
B
bigorse
Guest
gw would be 10mg Twice per day and clen Would be starting at 40mcg and tapering up 20mcg every few days as Sides allow Until youre at 80-100mcg
big_boy_1
New member
First get tested for Free T3 and Free T4.
They should be at least in the upper half of the normal range preferably in the upper third.
Then use BOTH T3 (liothyronine) and T4 (levothyroxine) as needed to get em high in the range while still not surpassing the upper end of normal.
You are guaranteed to lose weight with little side effects this way.
They should be at least in the upper half of the normal range preferably in the upper third.
Then use BOTH T3 (liothyronine) and T4 (levothyroxine) as needed to get em high in the range while still not surpassing the upper end of normal.
You are guaranteed to lose weight with little side effects this way.
I've got a doctor's appointment in the morning for a full hormone test. Last week I spoke to my doctor and found out that in the early 90s he used a lot of gear. He's going to be getting all my base line numbers and going to help me monitor them every 2 weeks for the duration of my cycle and pct. Thanks to Obama care my insurance covers all my testing with only a 20 dollar Co pay so why not lol .
Alright guys my lab tests are back. My total t3 and t4 levels are dead on in optimal range. However my free t3 and t4 levels are on the low end of optimal. The doc said they are high enough that he can't justify clinical treatment but low enough that it will definitely be something to consider while attempting to drastically change my physical appearance. So the question is how do I get the hormones I'm already producing to free up and start circulating? Or am I better off just supplementing a low dose t3 and calling it a day ?
