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ken shamrock... Tito Ortiz

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bca21

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What yall guys think about them. Idk if any of yall watch ufc but these are pretty big and hell of athletes. What do yall think about Shamrock, you see them guns?( dark side)
 
back in the day when he whooped dan severen and beat gracie though it was called a draw, yes he was for sure on. his brothers are all adopted as he is. some of them make him look tiny. watch his fight against gracie his brothers rush the ring and are gassed up for sure. tito was not large when he started. he was pretty ripped but skinny. he then turned into a very big guy with a huge head. i think tito for sure did as well. that is why he isn't fighting as much now because they are really testing hard now
 
Athlestes using steroids, NOOOOOO. The next crazy rumor that you're gonna start is that people can get as big as Brad Pitt WITHOUT steroids.
 
Ken shamrock (not frank) deff.
Mark coleman, Brad Kholer, Vitor Belfort, Baroni, maybe Ricardo Arona....not sure about Tito, he isnt THAT big....Josh Barnett did too but you couldnt tell by looking at him......

Some folks you just dont know

Tito over Shamrock by GnP to death.
 
Cabbage has a physique I aspire to have someday if I quit working out and start eating 40 sticks of butter daily.
 
As far as muscle goes, I say check out Jeff Monson. He is 6'1" 230, most of these guys look shorter than they actually are or what the ufc website says they are.
 
Who do you guys think will win this weekend Matt Hughes or Royce Gracie? Should be an interesting fight old school vs. new school...You gotta give Matt hughes his props but Royce is the legend he built the ufc house...he used to fight 4 times in one night the guys' amazing!!!!
 
Alot of the ufc guys juice.... Some other guy just got popped about a year or so ago for using deca and he said it was due to fighting in japan and not knowing what his trainer was giving him.. He thought he was injecting b12 if i remeber correctly..
 
Id say most the top UFC guys use something, and Im not talking about Xyience lol.

Pride tests select fighters, not all of them. Phil Baroni gets tested before and after every Pride fight, but he is jacked as hell, so he knows how to evade or something.

I dont think Tito cut back on fights because of roid use though, Ive read he has a lot of injuries, knees, shoulders ect - isnt really the same fighter physically he was 5 years ago.
 
forgot remember mark coleman, that guy was jacked as fuck. hell yea vitor did, he was a skinny little guy when he first came in, 5 yrs later his kneck wouldn't fit in a tee shirt
 
down here in florida that shit (mma, bjj and such) is big time. I know a few guys who get paid and a few guys that just train and get beat up everyday.. They juice.. Their training is soo intense that even when conditioned as good as they are, they need help recovering. Im not saying all of them, but if you take a good look, it hasnt hard to tell..
 
KD1 said:
I dont think Tito cut back on fights because of roid use though, Ive read he has a lot of injuries, knees, shoulders ect - isnt really the same fighter physically he was 5 years ago.
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Tito quit fighting because of issues with Dana White. He was drawing huge crowds but still being paid shit in comparison to what UFC was making off of him.
 
bruce410 said:
i heard brad pitt takes a bottle of flinstone vitamins everyday with a winny latte. he's about 145 wet and wearing boots and mofos think he is on gas.
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shit. pitt has definitely been on at least a couple of times. he's probably putting on 15 lean lbs for fight club/snatch/troy, then you see his ass on some mag when your checking out at the grocery store and he's soft and skinny again.
 
zouave said:
shit. pitt has definitely been on at least a couple of times. he's probably putting on 15 lean lbs for fight club/snatch/troy, then you see his ass on some mag when your checking out at the grocery store and he's soft and skinny again.
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here we go :rolleyes:
 
bca21 said:
What yall guys think about them. Idk if any of yall watch ufc but these are pretty big and hell of athletes. What do yall think about Shamrock, you see them guns?( dark side)
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He's probably using AS, but he was pretty big to begin with - so he's done well for himself. :coffee:
 
Ken Shamrock and the Lion's Den fighters have always put a lot of effort into strength training. Some other schools focus more on cardio or BJJ.

If you look at many of the fighters it's quite obvious who is on. Mark Kerr has admitted using, Mark Coleman & Kevin Randleman have always been physical specimens, Baroni is too obvious to bother talking about. A little juice with their levels of conditioning and training make for interesting fights.

Matt Hughes is a genetic freak and is very well rounded fighter. Wrestler by background with years of training with the Miletech Fighting Systems. His stand up is solid, ground and pound is deadly and he can submit as well. Royce is a legend and a pioneer but I think he will have his hands full with Matt. Hughes by decision.
 
1392477 said:
Ken Shamrock and the Lion's Den fighters have always put a lot of effort into strength training. Some other schools focus more on cardio or BJJ.

If you look at many of the fighters it's quite obvious who is on. Mark Kerr has admitted using, Mark Coleman & Kevin Randleman have always been physical specimens, Baroni is too obvious to bother talking about. A little juice with their levels of conditioning and training make for interesting fights.

Matt Hughes is a genetic freak and is very well rounded fighter. Wrestler by background with years of training with the Miletech Fighting Systems. His stand up is solid, ground and pound is deadly and he can submit as well. Royce is a legend and a pioneer but I think he will have his hands full with Matt. Hughes by decision.
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Matt Hughes is over rated! In no way i'm i trying to take anything away from him, he's respectful-great all around fighter but IMO the guys over rated.. At least even he says his chance to win will come from a stand up fight. Funny how he's a wrestler tho...
 
karachi183 said:
Matt Hughes is over rated! In no way i'm i trying to take anything away from him, he's respectful-great all around fighter but IMO the guys over rated.. At least even he says his chance to win will come from a stand up fight. Funny how he's a wrestler tho...
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I agree he is over-rated, but he is still the best in his division right now. I watched the replay of him vs GSP the other day and what really stood out is how slow and plodding Matt looked compared to his fights from years earlier. He has lost a step and its only a matter of time before the younger lions in the sport take him down.

Speaking of Mark Kerr, check him out today - he looks like shit!

http://www.sherdog.com/_images/pictures/28987.jpg
 
i don't care much for the ufc anymore, when there was no rounds and no gloves gracie would wax anyones ass, matt hughes you name it. the only man i saw match him was good old kenny sham
 
Matt Hughes is over rated! In no way i'm i trying to take anything away from him, he's respectful-great all around fighter but IMO the guys over rated.. At least even he says his chance to win will come from a stand up fight. Funny how he's a wrestler tho...
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Definitely not overrated! Matt is an animal with a full arsenal of fighting techniques. He trains with the best! There is 6 world champions at his gym, its not a fluke that he takes everyone out. When he lost to BJ Penn in UFC 46 going for his 6th consecutive title defense he got stupid and lost. Now BJ Penn is an incredible jiu jitsu phenom as well as Gracie. So who knows Gracie may submit hughes but it's a long shot. If gracie does win I might think the UFC sets fights, im sure this wouldnt be the first one! I dont know how you guys can say hughes is overrated, thats a joke.
 
bruce410 said:
i don't care much for the ufc anymore, when there was no rounds and no gloves gracie would wax anyones ass, matt hughes you name it. the only man i saw match him was good old kenny sham
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wasn't there some russian dude who beat gracie pretty badly?
 
no royce gracie retired undefeated with a draw with kenny. if you are thinking of oleg taktarov, he was a serious bad ass. all natural for sure and hung in there with shamrock a few times. he was ex kgb and not to be fucked with. he acts now, he was in 15 minutes with robert deniro and another flic can't remember, there are a lot of brazilians that claim they beat royce in vale tudo but never seen it myself. he is boring but man he never lost and he was only 185.
dullboy said:
wasn't there some russian dude who beat gracie pretty badly?
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KD1 said:
Yeah the Brad Pitt debate lives on lol. Well at least its better than the Carrot Top debate over at bb.com, lol.
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lol. sorry. i'm new, didn't know it was an ongoing debate. won't mention it again...even though i'm right :qt:
 
Hate to say it but hughes by desicion is the call Royce will be on his back the whole fight....Hughes will land little rabit punches and win the three round decision...

Tito is huge on GH...thats coming from his mouth...I won his grappling tournament last year...

Ken juices randleman and vanderlei loves gh as well. Most of those guys love it because there is no way to test for it... at least yet...
o and jeff monson loves deca and is 5'9" and is 234
 
It's on like donkey kong bitches!!!!!!!! Tito has the biggest head for his size and i would hate to look like him.. Ken def looks like he juices .. I could sware i noticed the jaundice look in him in one the uf episodes.. Honestly between Joyce and Matt either guy could win and i wouldn't hate.
 
Yeah Ill give royce credit he has had some huge guys in his guard pounding on him and he hasnt flinched but I dont think matt is stupid and will go for the KO and risk getting summited. He will be smart and use less big punches, stay tight and pull off a unanimous desicion....
 
In an interview Matt said how great it would be to submit Gracie. Imagine what would happen to the Gracie name if Hughes submitted him, I'd laugh my ass of.
Remember the first superfight Ken VS. Royce? Well Ken held gracie down almost the entire fight, it was horrible. Picture Hughes doing the same thing but being 10x more active than Ken was. This is Matt's fight 100% If he loses I might be convinced that the fight was SET.
 
karachi183 said:
It's on like donkey kong bitches!!!!!!!! Tito has the biggest head for his size and i would hate to look like him.. .
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i suppose thats why ken kept calling him "monkey boy" during the ufc series on spike
 
UFC22 said:
In an interview Matt said how great it would be to submit Gracie. Imagine what would happen to the Gracie name if Hughes submitted him, I'd laugh my ass of.
Remember the first superfight Ken VS. Royce? Well Ken held gracie down almost the entire fight, it was horrible. Picture Hughes doing the same thing but being 10x more active than Ken was. This is Matt's fight 100% If he loses I might be convinced that the fight was SET.
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yeah, but ken is 30 or 40 lbs bigger than hughes. i relaly can't make a call on this one. if it goes the distance--hughes. if it's a stoppage--gracie
 
Sure Ken was 30-40lbs bigger than hughes but whose the better wrestler? HUGHES... Really a 150 pound all american wrestler can hold down a 200 pound person that is not so good on the ground anyday. Hughes can hold gracie down forever but he doesnt want to make the fight boring. Gracie will never quit he will take beatings but gracie thru in the towel when he fought Sakuraba in pride. He could not submit sakuraba and had to many failed attemped he was completely dominated! Hughes will do that same if the fight is not set, just my thoughts.
 
UFC 4 didn't some guy named kimo or something really put it too gracie before he had his hairpulled and finally got submitted. That kimo guy also said he had 5% bf, thats a joke. The dude was probably closer to 14%. Couldn't see any abs what so ever. I would think hughes will win in a boring tactical fight. Can gracie wear his gye or what ever its called? Without it a lot of his chokes and shit are much harder to lock in.
 
I am with you on one thing ufc 22. If royce wins the fight it could be thrown. But I think they would have to pay matt hughes a lot of money to throw the fight. Also you cant even compare shamrock to matt hughes. The shape the matt hughes is in is rediculous and he is a way better fighter than shamrock
 
PCP316 said:
As far as muscle goes, I say check out Jeff Monson. He is 6'1" 230, most of these guys look shorter than they actually are or what the ufc website says they are.
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Sapp from Pride makes Monson look like a ballerina.
 
Sapp is a genetic freak, he fights at like 375......he has terrible skill though, he just hits hard as hell, gasses after like 30 seconds.

Wandy is good, i wanna see him murder Liddell, but Dana is a bitch and wont let it happen even though they both want to fight.

Penn is the best though (Fedor too).
 
I am with you on one thing ufc 22. If royce wins the fight it could be thrown. But I think they would have to pay matt hughes a lot of money to throw the fight. Also you cant even compare shamrock to matt hughes. The shape the matt hughes is in is rediculous and he is a way better fighter than shamrock
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Did I compare the two? You are definately right there is no comparison. If by some reason they were to fight and hughes fought 170 & Ken at 205 Hughes would still dominate.

No Gracie cannot wear a Gi. I'm sure he's done tons of training without the Gi so that should not be a problem. The Gi was the key to his success in alot of fights though.
 
matt gunna beat gracie! I remeber when gracie had on his outfit and pulled that guys hair and pounded him. No more that these days
 
bca21 said:
What yall guys think about them. Idk if any of yall watch ufc but these are pretty big and hell of athletes. What do yall think about Shamrock, you see them guns?( dark side)
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I admire both for different reasons,,,both are great athletes.
 
some of you UFC newbs amuse me. For starters Royce Gracie is a REAL legend and if some of you people knew anything about the UFC or any other MMA organizations prior to you seeing it for free on SPIKE TV, you'd know that. Two, he never fully retired he has fought in PRIDE and other organizations when they wanted to pay him enough, unlike the formly cheap ass UFC...plus he has schools around the United States and Brazil to take care of instead of fighting B level fighters. Three, all of you idiots on the Matt Hughes band wagon are in for a rude awakening. The only shot Matt has is a decision by "lay and pray" which is highly unlikely he'll pull that off given Royce's ground expertise. The only other prayer he has is landing a One and a Million, LUCKY punch on Royce when he's "closing the gap" or coming in for the chute. Yes, Matt is a truly gifted wrestler and thats it. Lets not forget that Carlos Newton had Hughes choked out on his feet (unconscious) and should have won that fight. Lets also not forget that Frank Trigg had Hughes choked out in their first match but was not intellegent enough to finish him. Yes he beat Trigg twice but Trigg is an absolute horrible B level fighter and had the opportunity to beat Hughes. Theres NO way that Hughes will beat Gracie on the ground. The Gracie's invented effective ground fighting BJJ which Pat Militech later learned and copied and called his own. Royce Gracie has fought far more superior fighters who were bigger, faster, and stronger than him. Matt Hughes has never fought a fighter with the caliber and instinct of Gracie. Yes it will be a good fight. Yes they're both great athletes. Royce by submission in the second round and the Legend Continues...
 
BrettB1 said:
some of you UFC newbs amuse me. For starters Royce Gracie is a REAL legend and if some of you people knew anything about the UFC or any other MMA organizations prior to you seeing it for free on SPIKE TV, you'd know that. Two, he never fully retired he has fought in PRIDE and other organizations when they wanted to pay him enough, unlike the formly cheap ass UFC...plus he has schools around the United States and Brazil to take care of instead of fighting B level fighters. Three, all of you idiots on the Matt Hughes band wagon are in for a rude awakening. The only shot Matt has is a decision by "lay and pray" which is highly unlikely he'll pull that off given Royce's ground expertise. The only other prayer he has is landing a One and a Million, LUCKY punch on Royce when he's "closing the gap" or coming in for the chute. Yes, Matt is a truly gifted wrestler and thats it. Lets not forget that Carlos Newton had Hughes choked out on his feet (unconscious) and should have won that fight. Lets also not forget that Frank Trigg had Hughes choked out in their first match but was not intellegent enough to finish him. Yes he beat Trigg twice but Trigg is an absolute horrible B level fighter and had the opportunity to beat Hughes. Theres NO way that Hughes will beat Gracie on the ground. The Gracie's invented effective ground fighting BJJ which Pat Militech later learned and copied and called his own. Royce Gracie has fought far more superior fighters who were bigger, faster, and stronger than him. Matt Hughes has never fought a fighter with the caliber and instinct of Gracie. Yes it will be a good fight. Yes they're both great athletes. Royce by submission in the second round and the Legend Continues...
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I have to agree. Most of the opinions here are largely based on the new UFC(no head butts, no grabbing the fence, no knees/kicks to the head when down) of the past 3 yrs or so. If you guys saw Shamrock bust this undefeated dude's leg in '92 UFC 1 and Saw Gracie bust a few arms in the old UFC(no rules) you might have a different perspective? Also Pride's fighters get paid more and tested less. Overall the Pride fighters are better-especially in the HWT class. . Fedor would kill Sylvia or Arlovski-it wouldn't even be close. If Gracie loses to ?Hughes, he threw the fight for big $$$.
 
BrettB1 said:
some of you UFC newbs amuse me. For starters Royce Gracie is a REAL legend and if some of you people knew anything about the UFC or any other MMA organizations prior to you seeing it for free on SPIKE TV, you'd know that. Two, he never fully retired he has fought in PRIDE and other organizations when they wanted to pay him enough, unlike the formly cheap ass UFC...plus he has schools around the United States and Brazil to take care of instead of fighting B level fighters. Three, all of you idiots on the Matt Hughes band wagon are in for a rude awakening. The only shot Matt has is a decision by "lay and pray" which is highly unlikely he'll pull that off given Royce's ground expertise. The only other prayer he has is landing a One and a Million, LUCKY punch on Royce when he's "closing the gap" or coming in for the chute. Yes, Matt is a truly gifted wrestler and thats it. Lets not forget that Carlos Newton had Hughes choked out on his feet (unconscious) and should have won that fight. Lets also not forget that Frank Trigg had Hughes choked out in their first match but was not intellegent enough to finish him. Yes he beat Trigg twice but Trigg is an absolute horrible B level fighter and had the opportunity to beat Hughes. Theres NO way that Hughes will beat Gracie on the ground. The Gracie's invented effective ground fighting BJJ which Pat Militech later learned and copied and called his own. Royce Gracie has fought far more superior fighters who were bigger, faster, and stronger than him. Matt Hughes has never fought a fighter with the caliber and instinct of Gracie. Yes it will be a good fight. Yes they're both great athletes. Royce by submission in the second round and the Legend Continues...
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that was intense as hell.
 
I dont know if you are referring to me or not, but I have watched the beginning up until the now. I also follow pride and up and coming fight promoters. Gracie will lose, if he wins they probably set the fight, simple as that.

ZOUAVE dont be a prick and call us idiots because we think hughes will win. I also don't think Gracie fought any superior fighters to Hughes. Sakuraba may have been better than hughes and sakuraba killed royce, made him throw in the towell actually. I AM NOT DOWNING ROYCE he is amazing with out a doubt. So you go for royce I will go for hughes. No need to insult anyone bud.
 
Reading these posts, all anyone can really agree in is that these are 2 very very different fighters. That is why i am extremely excited to see it. Gracie is very technical on the ground, and hughes is very smart and strong. I can't see gracie tapping, only way royce loses is by decision. Hughes might get choked out, but is too strong to go down from any other submission. Definitely not gonna be stopped by strikes. Ill enjoy it.
 
i gotta disagree here. royce did dominate in early ufcs but come on he was going against ppl who had no clue about bjj. im not tryin to down play nething royce did in the past but everyone now in MMA knows and trains bjj. 3 reasons i see gracie losing. 1. gracie is a defensive fighter, he waits for an oppent to make a mistake on the ground and makes them pay for it i dont see hughes being dumb enough to stay in gracies gaurd for 3 rounds. 2. the fight wont even get to the ground unless hughes takes him down. 3. the ufc judges never favor the man on the bottom, and the gaurd is gracies favorite place. so i see this fight ending wit a gnp stopage, or decision for hughes

BrettB1 said:
some of you UFC newbs amuse me. For starters Royce Gracie is a REAL legend and if some of you people knew anything about the UFC or any other MMA organizations prior to you seeing it for free on SPIKE TV, you'd know that. Two, he never fully retired he has fought in PRIDE and other organizations when they wanted to pay him enough, unlike the formly cheap ass UFC...plus he has schools around the United States and Brazil to take care of instead of fighting B level fighters. Three, all of you idiots on the Matt Hughes band wagon are in for a rude awakening. The only shot Matt has is a decision by "lay and pray" which is highly unlikely he'll pull that off given Royce's ground expertise. The only other prayer he has is landing a One and a Million, LUCKY punch on Royce when he's "closing the gap" or coming in for the chute. Yes, Matt is a truly gifted wrestler and thats it. Lets not forget that Carlos Newton had Hughes choked out on his feet (unconscious) and should have won that fight. Lets also not forget that Frank Trigg had Hughes choked out in their first match but was not intellegent enough to finish him. Yes he beat Trigg twice but Trigg is an absolute horrible B level fighter and had the opportunity to beat Hughes. Theres NO way that Hughes will beat Gracie on the ground. The Gracie's invented effective ground fighting BJJ which Pat Militech later learned and copied and called his own. Royce Gracie has fought far more superior fighters who were bigger, faster, and stronger than him. Matt Hughes has never fought a fighter with the caliber and instinct of Gracie. Yes it will be a good fight. Yes they're both great athletes. Royce by submission in the second round and the Legend Continues...
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Fuck who wins Gracie vs. Hughes. I wanna lick Amber Nicole where she pees.

Rachel Leah too.

I'll give her some of my Xyience right down her throat.
 
bigrand said:
Sapp is a genetic freak, he fights at like 375......he has terrible skill though, he just hits hard as hell, gasses after like 30 seconds.
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Yeah when you first see the guy you are thiking "why didnt this guy pan out in the NFL - OL or DL he would be awsome" - and supposedly he runs an 11.0 in the 100 ( thats fast as hell for a 375lbs dude ).

But when you watch him fight and how uncoordinated and off balence he is, how top heavy he is, you can understand why. He just isnt very athletic.
 
boskers22 said:
royce did dominate in early ufcs but come on he was going against ppl who had no clue about bjj.
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true. right after gracie submitted shamrock at 0:57 in the 1st round by rear nake choke in ufc 1 the commentator interviewed shamrock and he said he had never fought anyone trained in BJJ.
 
UFC22 said:
I dont know if you are referring to me or not, but I have watched the beginning up until the now. I also follow pride and up and coming fight promoters. Gracie will lose, if he wins they probably set the fight, simple as that.

ZOUAVE dont be a prick and call us idiots because we think hughes will win. I also don't think Gracie fought any superior fighters to Hughes. Sakuraba may have been better than hughes and sakuraba killed royce, made him throw in the towell actually. I AM NOT DOWNING ROYCE he is amazing with out a doubt. So you go for royce I will go for hughes. No need to insult anyone bud.
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huh? where did i even suggest such a thing? i already said i thought it could go either way.
 
PCP316 said:
As far as muscle goes, I say check out Jeff Monson. He is 6'1" 230, most of these guys look shorter than they actually are or what the ufc website says they are.
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Jeff Monson is 5"8 240 bro.
 
UFC22 said:
I dont know if you are referring to me or not, but I have watched the beginning up until the now. I also follow pride and up and coming fight promoters. Gracie will lose, if he wins they probably set the fight, simple as that.

ZOUAVE dont be a prick and call us idiots because we think hughes will win. I also don't think Gracie fought any superior fighters to Hughes. Sakuraba may have been better than hughes and sakuraba killed royce, made him throw in the towell actually. I AM NOT DOWNING ROYCE he is amazing with out a doubt. So you go for royce I will go for hughes. No need to insult anyone bud.
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wrong guy bro.
 
BrettB1 said:
some of you UFC newbs amuse me. For starters Royce Gracie is a REAL legend and if some of you people knew anything about the UFC or any other MMA organizations prior to you seeing it for free on SPIKE TV, you'd know that. Two, he never fully retired he has fought in PRIDE and other organizations when they wanted to pay him enough, unlike the formly cheap ass UFC...plus he has schools around the United States and Brazil to take care of instead of fighting B level fighters. Three, all of you idiots on the Matt Hughes band wagon are in for a rude awakening. The only shot Matt has is a decision by "lay and pray" which is highly unlikely he'll pull that off given Royce's ground expertise. The only other prayer he has is landing a One and a Million, LUCKY punch on Royce when he's "closing the gap" or coming in for the chute. Yes, Matt is a truly gifted wrestler and thats it. Lets not forget that Carlos Newton had Hughes choked out on his feet (unconscious) and should have won that fight. Lets also not forget that Frank Trigg had Hughes choked out in their first match but was not intellegent enough to finish him. Yes he beat Trigg twice but Trigg is an absolute horrible B level fighter and had the opportunity to beat Hughes. Theres NO way that Hughes will beat Gracie on the ground. The Gracie's invented effective ground fighting BJJ which Pat Militech later learned and copied and called his own. Royce Gracie has fought far more superior fighters who were bigger, faster, and stronger than him. Matt Hughes has never fought a fighter with the caliber and instinct of Gracie. Yes it will be a good fight. Yes they're both great athletes. Royce by submission in the second round and the Legend Continues...
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wow buddy, you are calling me a ufc newb huh? well I know who royce is training with for this fight. I train with rickson. Im a purple belt and 2 time defending pan american champion for your info. Even Rick's says his bro is probably gonna loose. You wanna talk about legend...its Rickson bro.
Cruise down to our academy one day buddy...its in la on wilsure and barrington....I will show you whos a newbie while you're sleepin...
 
By the way...royce will never catch matt coming in.....royces strikes suck my balls....he has never KOed anyone.
Matt by decision at the end of three rounds of royce on his back
 
Cauliflower Ear said:
wow buddy, you are calling me a ufc newb huh? well I know who royce is training with for this fight. I train with rickson. Im a purple belt and 2 time defending pan american champion for your info. Even Rick's says his bro is probably gonna loose. You wanna talk about legend...its Rickson bro.
Cruise down to our academy one day buddy...its in la on wilsure and barrington....I will show you whos a newbie while you're sleepin...
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dullboy says can you fight on the internet instead?


more fun, ido.
 
wow buddy, you are calling me a ufc newb huh? well I know who royce is training with for this fight. I train with rickson. Im a purple belt and 2 time defending pan american champion for your info. Even Rick's says his bro is probably gonna loose. You wanna talk about legend...its Rickson bro.
Cruise down to our academy one day buddy...its in la on wilsure and barrington....I will show you whos a newbie while you're sleepin...
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Mad props to you cauliflower!

Sorry ZOUAVE I was talking to BrettB1 when i meant prick.
 
Iam not for sure they been on GH. For instance some mentioned Titos head, but what i remember he has always been that way, prove me wrong. And how come his hands and feets are not that big? Thought that was alot more common effect of long time GH use rather then big head!
 
You guys are truly gifted in the "jumping on bandwagons/idiot department. Yes it will be a good fight...but to say that Hughes will dominate or "If Gracie wins, the fight was set" or Gracie will throw in the towel". Are you fucking serious? And yes, you guys are obviously newbs if you can only base your decision on Gracie promos that you've caught on SPIKEtv. Gracie has fought FAR superior fighters than Matt Hughes has, so do your research on what you already should've known newbie. Califlour, for the record, I never asked you nor do I give a shit on who you supposedly train with or think you know or what you heard. You're not the only person on the planet who has ever trained with a Gracie so get off of your broken down soapbox. You're more than welcome to come down to R1 gym in El Segundo but i'll say it now we go full contact and we dont let up for purple belts. Hope you have health insurance. I know many people who have gone to all of the camps and schools and their still trash. Come to think of it, they're the same people who wear MMA and Gracie tshirts wherever they go and talk about how badass they are and get on the internet and make claims. We can name drop all day but it all means nothing. Maybe you should train a little more and get past that purple belt before you start challenging the unknown because you DEFINATELY have no idea who you're trying to call out here half pint. Yes, Rickson is a legend as many of the Gracie's are. I was trained by Danny Dring, Andrea Pederneiras, and Carlson Gracie Sr...Saulo Ribeiro so what. Now you're challenging someone on the internet?...you're probably REALLY good...OR NOT...And to whoever said Sakuraba "owned" Gracie, you obviously didnt watch the fight. It took Sakuraba 90 minutes, 6 rounds to stretch out a "victory". Royce was obviously exhausted and the lay and pray technique combined with 15 minute rounds worked for Sakuraba. His corner, said if thats what your're gonna do, you can have it. So that ONE "defeat" with 15 minute rounds in Pride, by Sakuraba who is one of the greatest grapplers of all time, justifies Matt Hughes "owning" Gracie. Well enough of the nonsense we'll all see Saturday. Yes Matt Hughes is younger and stronger, and if he wins he'll be the biggest name in MMA. If Gracie wins, it'll just reassure everyone that he's the greatest fighter of all time.
 
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Sweet, I dont know which fight I would rather see, the Hughes vs Gracie or the EF steroid board beatdown! In my experience, gym fights are usually better and bloodier than the sanctioned ones!
 
BrettB1 said:
You guys are truly gifted in the "jumping on bandwagons/idiot department. Yes it will be a good fight...but to say that Hughes will dominate or "If Gracie wins, the fight was set" or Gracie will throw in the towel". Are you fucking serious? And yes, you guys are obviously newbs if you can only base your decision on Gracie promos that you've caught on SPIKEtv. Gracie has fought FAR superior fighters than Matt Hughes has, so do your research on what you already should've known newbie. Califlour, for the record, I never asked you nor do I give a shit on who you supposedly train with or think you know or what you heard. You're not the only person on the planet who has ever trained with a Gracie so get off of your broken down soapbox. You're more than welcome to come down to R1 gym in El Segundo but i'll say it now we go full contact and we dont let up for purple belts. Hope you have health insurance. I know many people who have gone to all of the camps and schools and their still trash. Come to think of it, they're the same people who wear MMA and Gracie tshirts wherever they go and talk about how badass they are and get on the internet and make claims. We can name drop all day but it all means nothing. Maybe you should train a little more and get past that purple belt before you start challenging the unknown because you DEFINATELY have no idea who you're trying to call out here half pint. Yes, Rickson is a legend as many of the Gracie's are. I was trained by Danny Dring, Andrea Pederneiras, and Carlson Gracie Sr...Saulo Ribeiro so what. Now you're challenging someone on the internet?...you're probably REALLY good. And to whoever said Sakuraba "owned" Gracie, you obviously didnt watch the fight. It took Sakuraba 90 minutes, 6 rounds to stretch out a "victory". Royce was obviously exhausted and the lay and pray technique combined with 15 minute rounds worked for Sakuraba. His corner, said if thats what your're gonna do, you can have it. So that ONE "defeat" with 15 minute rounds in Pride, by Sakuraba who is one of the greatest grapplers of all time, justifies Matt Hughes "owning" Gracie. Well enough of the nonsense we'll all see Saturday. Yes Matt Hughes is younger and stronger, and if he wins he'll be the biggest name in MMA. If Gracie wins, it'll just reassure everyone that he's the greatest fighter of all time.
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First of all who are you, I have trained at R1, frank, ricco, vladimir...those guys are great...Do you think I dont train mma bro. I am 22. Started boxing when i was 12, muay thai when I was 16 and jits since I was 18....Wrestled while I was in high school too and when I was training at RAW...But they dont even have an mma class there. They only let the pro's train full contact...I bet I have trained with you, my names Ryan and i would love to come train with you one day
 
Ohhh and just for the record....I dont give half of the graices the credit....Rickson is the best...no one can argue that....even all the gracies say that....also I would love to see royce submit hughes....that would be awesome....but I think we both know that thats just not gonna happen...id love to see it....does howard lu still train down there from HCK? How bout that guy koji or whatever Used to train with him all the time?
 
Hey bro, thats kewl if you train, more power to you and whatever you do. The question at hand was Hughes vs. Gracie. Both fighters have their strengths. I don't know if i've trained with you or not and dont really care. I've trained with hundreds of people over the years. I train back and forth in Cali and Florida and train people in BJJ and Muay Thai. I'm not really big into letting everyone in the world know my identity on a steroid discussion board for obvious reasons but I am sponsered by Fairtex along with others. Yes I agree, that Rickson is truly a legend and maybe the "best" Gracie. My only problem was with those who were obviously stating shit that had no truth or facts to back up their statements. Yes, anything can and does happen in MMA. But, why is Matt Hughes all of a sudden regarded as a superior "submission artist"...because he submitted no talent Joe Riggs. Why couldn't Royce submit Matt? I've already backed up my opinions based on facts. Where are yours? (not being a smartass, I would really like to know why you think that theres NO possible way that Hughes can get submitted?...especially when Frank Trigg and Carlos Newton had him.)
Matt Hughes has already said that he doesnt want the fight to go to the ground that he will try to stand up with Royce.
 
Tito was a 220 lbs fighter as well as a university wrestler ... he now fights @ 205. With his cardio and natural athletic build I doubt he uses gear. Shammy on the other hand .... ;)
 
Roc86 said:
Tito was a 220 lbs fighter as well as a university wrestler ... he now fights @ 205. With his cardio and natural athletic build I doubt he uses gear.
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Yeah, and Kate Moss doesn't snort coke. I don't care how great your genetics are-the chemically enhanced will eventually leave the nattys behind in 99% of all sports.
 
I think matt Huges is a little over-rated. He hasnt fought all that great of compitition. BJ penn or St Piere will beat him soon. Grayce.... might submit him but doubt it. I think it will be a boring 15 min fight. Who knows? Ken deffiniatly on juice. Tito definitly played with GH. Anyone ever think chuck lidell seems to have a little large GH style belly?
 
I can't even count the number of MMA fighters I've played weight training/diet/AAS guru for over the years. I'm not going to drop any names, but I think it's safe to say they all use AAS to varying degrees.
 
tito ortiz is on hgh! i met him in person.look at his jaw.

and i met ken shamrock this past saturday in tulsa oklahoma at battle at the brady.he is small in person,but looks good,solid,lean,and vascular.
 
i'm rootin 4 shamrock over Ortiz, and i hope he humiliates him and spanks tito's litttle ass just like couture did at the end (when couture and ortiz fought) I still remember when Shamrock put the BEATING on gracie,(mid 90's)and split his eye.(it went into OT) split dec,..went to gracie..BULLSHIT dec,..everyone who watched that fight KNOWS shamrock won. i think hughes will fare better than most expect. I'm rootin 4 hughes on that match. Overall, i think they are all incredible athletes/fighters.
ANDRE ORLOVSKI ID THE MAN!!!
 
UFC22 said:
lol I will pretend like I never heard that.
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You've gotta admit he lucked out w/ the fight against Newton. He has a better chance of winning the lotto than winning like that again. However that last minute arm bar he pulled at the 10 sec warning against ??? was pretty a fucking impressive move. I don't think anyone(including his opponent) saw it coming-and is the very reason MMA is so exciting to watch. Now I sound like Joe Rogan.
 
mhcbenz said:
i'm rootin 4 shamrock over Ortiz, and i hope he humiliates him and spanks tito's litttle ass just like couture did at the end (when couture and ortiz fought) I still remember when Shamrock put the BEATING on gracie,(mid 90's)and split his eye.(it went into OT) split dec,..went to gracie..BULLSHIT dec,..everyone who watched that fight KNOWS shamrock won. i think hughes will fare better than most expect. I'm rootin 4 hughes on that match. Overall, i think they are all incredible athletes/fighters.
ANDRE ORLOVSKI ID THE MAN!!!
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Gracies repsonse to the draw, "Shamrock came in for a draw. He knows he cannot beat me. He came in for a draw. He knew he just didn't want to lose, that's why he requested the time limit. He knew he just wanted to have a draw, for him that's a victory".

Btw, Andrei Arlovski would get wrecked in Pride
 
mesco said:
Btw, Andrei Arlovski would get wrecked in Pride
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I wasnt so sure of that till Silvia KO'd him recently. He dosent have the chin to stand up to Pride heavyweights. He is right there on athletic ability, and his skill is good enough to give him a chance, but unfortunately for him he has a glass jaw.
 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hughes IS currently overrated but a good fighter nontheless, he needs to greatly better his standup
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Why fix something this isn't broken.. True, he might not be the most well-rounded fighter. But you can't argue his style. Obviously, close combat, power slamming your opponent and ground and pound works for him. Anyone can throw a haymaker and get that lucky knockout punch. But it takes alot of confidence out of your opponent when your being overpowered and thrown on your back...
 
Yes he is strong for his size which enables him to pick up and slam many of the fighters he has faced. However, he has faced many subpar fighters who aren't skilled enough to defend it. Good standup/intellegent kickboxing hardly involves "throwing haymakers" and anyone who knows anything about muay thai will tell you that. He wouldn't be "fixing" anything but rather adding to his arsenal which would only help him become a well rounded fighter. Say he fights someone that can defend takedowns like Chuck Liddell, then what other option does he have? I'm ready for a Hughes vs St. Pierre rematch.
 
I wish that Rich Franklin would've come down in weight so that he could DESTROY Matt Hughes after TUF2, but Hughes wanted no part of that. Franklin would've met him in the middle or come down.
 
Rich Franklin is a big guy to come down to the 170lb division it looks like he barely makes 185. I've seen old fights of him fighting well over the 205 range. Franklin would destroy Hughes but that fight would never happen.

What do you guys think about a match-up like Lidell VS Franklin!? I would absolutely love to see that one. I do think Franklin would be victorious though.

I honestly do not think Hughes is over-rated but he's definitely not UNbeatable. I love Penn I wish he pulled of the victory over pierre for the rematch against Hughes. Anyone know when the rematch between Pierre & Hughes will take place? Probably 62?
 
UFC22 said:
Rich Franklin is a big guy to come down to the 170lb division it looks like he barely makes 185. I've seen old fights of him fighting well over the 205 range.
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He went through Ken Shamrock at 205. I agree he could not make 170 and still be as effective. From what I understand, he walks around at 210-215, gets in fighting shape at 200-205, and then dumps 15-20lbs of water leading up to the weigh in.

Lidell vs Franklin would be interesting, I think Rick has the edge in just about everything skill and conditioning wise. But Lidell has that 1-punch fight ending power, and Rich does not have the best chin. Its funny, I think I have said that about Lidell 3 times in this thread, but Lidell's power is so freakish, it can win a fight for him against anybody 205 and under. Lidell is also a tough guy to GNP, he was a great wrestler and can do that turn to the side and stand up thing using the cage very effectively. No cage in Pride though.
 
UFC22 said:
Rich Franklin is a big guy to come down to the 170lb division it looks like he barely makes 185. I've seen old fights of him fighting well over the 205 range. Franklin would destroy Hughes but that fight would never happen.

What do you guys think about a match-up like Lidell VS Franklin!? I would absolutely love to see that one. I do think Franklin would be victorious though.

I honestly do not think Hughes is over-rated but he's definitely not UNbeatable. I love Penn I wish he pulled of the victory over pierre for the rematch against Hughes. Anyone know when the rematch between Pierre & Hughes will take place? Probably 62?
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I would put money on lidell. Guys got fantastic standup and even the best of wrestlers cant get him down. I Would LOVE to see it though... itd be close. And franklin vs. hughes....... Franklin for sure.

Franklin has got a BAD ASS wrestler helping him train. Prob better then hughes.
 
You've gotta admit he lucked out w/ the fight against Newton. He has a better chance of winning the lotto than winning like that again. However that last minute arm bar he pulled at the 10 sec warning against ??? was pretty a fucking impressive move. I don't think anyone(including his opponent) saw it coming-and is the very reason MMA is so exciting to watch. Now I sound like Joe Rogan.
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BigCracker I take it you did not see Hughes VS Newton 2 did you? Hughes crushed him the second time.
 
Yeah, Franklin would definately be hurting at 170lb but Hughes could definately come up to 185lb but Hughes knows Franklin would destroy him at this point in his career. Liddell definately has that knockout power, I wish the pussy ass UFC would let Chuck fight the Pride champion but they're scared even though Chuck wants to. How bad ass would it be if Liddell entered into the Pride Grand Prix tournament? I guess we can all keep dreaming about a tournament that embodies all organizations.
 
mhcbenz said:
i'm rootin 4 shamrock over Ortiz, and i hope he humiliates him and spanks tito's litttle ass just like couture did at the end (when couture and ortiz fought) I still remember when Shamrock put the BEATING on gracie,(mid 90's)and split his eye.(it went into OT) split dec,..went to gracie..BULLSHIT dec,..everyone who watched that fight KNOWS shamrock won. i think hughes will fare better than most expect. I'm rootin 4 hughes on that match. Overall, i think they are all incredible athletes/fighters.
ANDRE ORLOVSKI ID THE MAN!!!
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Download their first fight from 2002. Then reconsider what you just said...
Tito dished out arguably the worst beating ive ever seen @ Vendetta.
 
I wanna see chuck and vanderlei...thats the fight....As far as hughs...Id like to see him fight the pride 170's...like dan henderson....gomi...who is even lighter....and without the cage
 
BigCracker said:
I have to agree. Most of the opinions here are largely based on the new UFC(no head butts, no grabbing the fence, no knees/kicks to the head when down) of the past 3 yrs or so. If you guys saw Shamrock bust this undefeated dude's leg in '92 UFC 1 and Saw Gracie bust a few arms in the old UFC(no rules) you might have a different perspective? Also Pride's fighters get paid more and tested less. Overall the Pride fighters are better-especially in the HWT class. . Fedor would kill Sylvia or Arlovski-it wouldn't even be close. If Gracie loses to ?Hughes, he threw the fight for big $$$.
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Fedor is very tough..beating sylvia definitely...fedor beating Orlovski...no fuckin way...the Russians are the true "diehards, been watching sports lately,..they're poppin up everywhere,..and dominating!.. in all sports. They come from poverty, and are starved,..they are more hungry to succeed than any nationality because the come from nothing(check out boxing, weightlifting,ufc hvwts),..and that's just for starters..and in the last few years..Russians are migrating here like the Mexicans and poppin up EVERYWHERE!!...lol!!
 
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