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genezapharmateuticals
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puritysourcelabs
Research Chemical SciencesUGFREAKeudomestic
napsgeargenezapharmateuticals domestic-supplypuritysourcelabsResearch Chemical SciencesUGFREAKeudomestic

avoiding aromatization and testicular shrinkage...

liquid_sharp

New member
hello, i am not too sure on this so thats why im asking anybody who knows.....now, is it anabolics as well as test that will cause aromatization and testicular shrinkage or both. if both which does this more, probably the test right?? i was thinking of doing a cycle of something like deca and winstrol for about 2 months and then just stopping and not going to test and not taking gonadatrophin. so am i thinking along the right lines here in that the anabolics like those (milder ones) wont cause aromatization or shrinkage so i dont need to worry about too much estrogen from aromatization or taking gonadatrophin afterwards to restart my testes????? please, any response will be apreciated. thanks...
 
This is from a Dr. on another site.

Since I've been hanging out here a bit lately, I've been getting quite a few emails from guys wanting individualized advice on their cycles. In the first place, I cannot design cycles, nor do I prescribe steroids (just ancillary medications). That would be a violation of my Oath as a physician, and DEA law to boot. Also, obviously I cannot afford to give away free Consultations. So, I'll post my PCT Protocols here, for anyone who may choose to use them.

Also, I'm just running to catch a plane for Las Vegas, attending the American Academy of Anti-Aging Medicine International Conference. I guess they are supposed to publish an article I wrote on how to administer TRT for men. Wish me luck!

Here it is:

I advise my AAS patients to use small amounts of HCG (250IU to 500IU) two days each week, right from the beginning of the cycle. This serves to maintain testicular form and function. It makes more sense to me to keep the horse in the barn, so to speak, then to have to chase it across three counties later on. I am also a big fan of maintaining estrogen within physiological ranges. Both therapies have been shown to hasten recovery.

Any more than 500IU of HCG per day causes too much aromatase activity. Some feel aromatase is actually toxic to the Leydig cells of the testes. You are then inducing primary hypogonadism (which is permanent) while treating steroid-induced secondary (hypogonadotrophic) hypogonadism (which is temporary--hopefully).

If 250IU or 500IU on two days each week isn’t enough to stave off testicular atrophy, then I recommend using it more days each week (as opposed to taking larger doses). In fact, I wouldn’t mind having a guy use 250IU per day ALL THROUGH the cycle. Those that have tell me they thus avoid that edgy, burned-out feeling they usually get. They also say they simply feel better each day. Subjective reports, to be sure, but they are hard not to appreciate. Especially when HCG is so inexpensive.

The testes are then ready, willing and able to again produce testosterone at the end of the cycle. LH levels rise fairly rapidly, but endogenous testosterone production is limited by lack of use. I also want to make sure a SERM, such as Clomid or Nolvadex, is at effective serum dosage (around 100mg QD for Clomid, 20-40mg QD for Nolvadex) when serum androgen levels drop to a concentration roughly equal to 200mg of testosterone per week. That is when androgenic inhibition at the HP no longer dominates over estrogenic antagonism with respect to inducing LH production. Of course, if the fellow has been doing Clomid or Nolvadex all along the way (and I now prefer Nolvadex over Clomid, due to the possibility of negative sides from the Clomid), he is all set to simply continue it at the end (no need to switch from one to the other). BTW, I see no evidence of any benefit in using BOTH SERM’s at the same time. I used to think a couple of weeks of the SERM was enough; now I like to see an entire month after the last shot of AAS (and migration of long to short esters as the cycle matures). Tapering the SERM is probably a good idea during the last week, as well.

I want my patients to stop taking HCG within a week after the end of the cycle. The testosterone production it induces will further inhibit recovery, as will using Androgel, or any other testosterone preparation, while in recovery. There is no escaping this, as there is no such thing as a “bridge”. Just because you are not inhibiting the HPTA for the entire 24 hours does not mean you are not suppressing it at all. IOW, you can’t “fool” the body—it is smarter than you are.

I like Arimidex during the cycle (in fact, consider use of an AI while taking aromatisables a necessity) but it ABSOLUTELY should not be used post cycle (even though it has been shown to increase LH production) because the risk of driving estrogen too low, and therefore further damaging an already compromised Lipid Profile, is too great (this also drives libido back into the ground—and we don’t want that, do we?).

All this is meant to get my guys through recovery as fast as possible (the real goal, yes?). So far, all of them who have tried it have reported they are recovering faster than when they have tried other protocols.


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www.AllThingsMale.com

ANY ADVICE I MAY GIVE IN NO WAY SUBSTITUTES FOR A PROPER EVALUATION BY YOUR PHYSICIAN; NOR DOES IT CONSTITUTE DR/PT RELATIONSHIP, OR LIABILITY, IN ANY WAY .
 
liquid_sharp said:
hello, i am not too sure on this so thats why im asking anybody who knows.....now, is it anabolics as well as test that will cause aromatization and testicular shrinkage or both. if both which does this more, probably the test right?? i was thinking of doing a cycle of something like deca and winstrol for about 2 months and then just stopping and not going to test and not taking gonadatrophin. so am i thinking along the right lines here in that the anabolics like those (milder ones) wont cause aromatization or shrinkage so i dont need to worry about too much estrogen from aromatization or taking gonadatrophin afterwards to restart my testes????? please, any response will be apreciated. thanks...


basically im looking for a substance that will help me put on muscle but i am very concerned about aromatization, estrogen levels getting high, testicular shrinkage....i want to know what is lowest in those side effects.....im doing my homework like a smart person so i dont mess myself up. thanks
 
liquid_sharp said:
basically im looking for a substance that will help me put on muscle but i am very concerned about aromatization, estrogen levels getting high, testicular shrinkage....i want to know what is lowest in those side effects.....im doing my homework like a smart person so i dont mess myself up. thanks





oops, i never posted my info, ok....im 24, 5.6, 175 lbs...about 15 lbs overweight. my goals are too gain quality hard muscle and lean up which im trying to do...i did as when i was 18 and i didnt know what i was doing, i was following the advice of some dick who didnt give me the best advice, i had major side effects and now i want to do it healthily, i might not even use, thats why im asking so many questions. i did have some aromatization in the past and got some small growth under the nipples that is still a little bit there, so that is a big concern for me. also when i came off, i had such bad test shrinkage and i didnt know about gonadatrophin, i lost a lot of my gains.....im not a young kid anymore and im smart so im asking questions...thanks.
 
listen to the guy who cut and pasted from the other site, i know of that particular doctor and he is very good. if i was to juice (and im a pharmacist) i would follow that regimen.

cheers
 
liquid_sharp said:
oops, i never posted my info, ok....im 24, 5.6, 175 lbs...about 15 lbs overweight. my goals are too gain quality hard muscle and lean up which im trying to do...i did as when i was 18 and i didnt know what i was doing, i was following the advice of some dick who didnt give me the best advice, i had major side effects and now i want to do it healthily, i might not even use, thats why im asking so many questions. i did have some aromatization in the past and got some small growth under the nipples that is still a little bit there, so that is a big concern for me. also when i came off, i had such bad test shrinkage and i didnt know about gonadatrophin, i lost a lot of my gains.....im not a young kid anymore and im smart so im asking questions...thanks.
IMO judging off your stats I would say wait a while. You dont seem like you are anywhere near where you should be before using. 15lbs overweight at 175. Im guessing but Iwould say that puts youat around 25% bf at least. At least cut first so you can see the gains. No aas is going to add mass and cut off 10% bf in two months.
 
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